Best 18650 battery question

[ChrisGarrett]

Right now, at least on the E-cig 'sub-ohm' forums, I'm reading that those nutters are having good luck with the Samsung 25Rs and the LG HE2s for really hard use. The Sony VTC5s are starting to get a bit tarnished, lol.

Chris

 

[pipes]

Since Im pretty new to this interestingly deep subject of flashlights and batteries, I have decided to go with a protected cell. Im about to buy my third light, the nitecore p25, and Im pretty sure my 4th will be an olight m3x triton

 

[CyclingSalmon14]

Fenix recommend flat top cells for the BC30.Let us know how you get on. The BC30 cell holder is quite tight, so cell length will make a difference.

LOL, I use button top 3400 Olight's, bit tight to remove but seems ok, just have to be carefull, they fit and going without any effort though so not to big, but yes I can see how flat tops might be better here ahahaha, never even knew falts were recomended.

 

[SubLGT]

Re: Best 18650 lithium ion batteries--protected

Hello
I am looking to stock up on 18650 batteries and wanted to know what brand is the one most of you prefer. Right now I have nitecore but they are expensive. I also have some ultrafire.

I have seen panasonic, thrunite brands out there. What are the best for performance and price.
Thanks again

For a high quality protected 18650 3400mAh battery, I like the Keeppower, Orbtronics, and AW. I spent some time playing with the battery comparison tool HKJ has at his website, and those 3 brands are what stood out to me. The Keeppower is the best buy in the bunch, around $14 each at illumn.com.

 

[Conte]

Those are probably all re wrapped panasonics.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think panasonic is the only one making a 3400 right now. Any 3400 battery is most likely a re wrapped panasonic.

 

[pocketchange]

Greetings ALL,
I've read Panasonic picked up (bought) Sanyo for their battery expertise.
Any info available on this?
I got's to know, pc

 

[thedoc007]

I've read Panasonic picked up (bought) Sanyo for their battery expertise.
Any info available on this?

I don't know any details to speak of, but yes, that is true. I found out when I was looking for Eneloops, and found a bunch of Panasonics. They now own the Eneloop name, so they have both the highest capacity 18650s, and the best NiMH cells.

 

[pipes]

Whereabouts do you buy your 18650's? Besides amazon?

 

[thedoc007]

Whereabouts do you buy your 18650's? Besides amazon?

Illumination Supply and Mountain Electronics are my go-to stores. I've placed several orders at each site, and haven't had a problem. Amazon is a last resort, 18650s are generally more expensive there, and you don't have nearly as many options.

 

[ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond]

Illumination Supply and Mountain Electronics are my go-to stores. I've placed several orders at each site, and haven't had a problem. Amazon is a last resort, 18650s are generally more expensive there, and you don't have nearly as many options.

+1 on this!

Both places have better prices for any stocked cell than I have ever found on Amazon too, even with Prime shipping.

 

[pipes]

Thanks, I appreciate it.

 

[pipes]

Hey, all flat top unprotected lol. Ill check Mountain

 

[rsilvers]

Re: What battery to use?

For my flashlights, I don't really care if a battery cost $5 or $8 or $1. It is all about the same. But I want to build a battery pack for an electric bike and need 65 18650s.

I see I can buy cells for $1 each or Panasonic for $5 each. If you had to buy 65 cells and capacity, reliability, charge cycles, and discharge rate all mattered - which cells would you go with knowing that the price adds up massively when you need 65 of them.

 

[ven]

Re: What battery to use?

IMHO rsilvers,for capacity,reliability and charge cycles then the only option would be a good brand of cell. Panasonic are certainly one,maybe find sanyo or samsung for cheaper still. Not sure what brand(probably none) the $1 cells are,but i sure would not have confidence in them,more so using 65 for them and being reliant on.

 

[rsilvers]

Re: What battery to use?

Also it seems like when you use multiple cells, you must use protected cells.

Panasonic NCR18650B may be the way to go.

Seems like the best possible price for them is $6.50 each.

 

[chuckhov]

Re: What battery to use?

No - What you want is unprotected, and then add a BMS (Battery Management System).

I would like to build a 14S/9P pack for my bike (126 cells), and the only reason that I have not yet begun, is the cost of good cells.

I would not even dream of setting myself up for the disappointment that $1 cells can provide.

Here is a good site that you may like:

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=3&sid=70642385ebe2141d96365ea508c1f9cf

Thanks,
-Chuck

 

[rsilvers]

Re: What battery to use?

I didn't research BMS yet, but my guess was that each parallel bank would use a BMS but each row in series would want protected cells. Or does the BMS see each and every cell?

I will look into that. Here are some protected cells I found:

$3.25 each http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00LC92V8C/?tag=cpf0b6-20
Someone claims to have tested these at 2100 each. Someone else said 2200 each. So it may be true. That is $1.55 per Ah.


$4.99 each http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0112LEW3G/?tag=cpf0b6-20
Someone claimed these test at 2500. That is $2 per Ah.

$5.66 each http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0112EV41G/?tag=cpf0b6-20
Claim these are really 2500. That is $2.27 per Ah.

$8 each http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00O8U187W/?tag=cpf0b6-20
Someone claimed these tested at 2600. That is $3.08 per Ah. Probably not worth it.

As for the NCR18650Bs - I only looked at ones that were under $8 each, and all of them said "For Panasonic." That seems like weasel words for "These are fake."

If I end up wanting protected, then I may order 2-3 of these and test them and then get more. If I end up wanting non-protected, I see lots of Samsungs listed that I need to look into.

 

[rsilvers]

Re: What battery to use?

I see that LunaCycle has unprotected LG and Samsung for $4.05 each. Best deal I found so far on something known to be good.

 

[ven]

Re: What battery to use?

Have a look at Samsung 26F, 2600MAH so not highest mah but acceptable and a good brand. Also if using so many i dont think it will make it over critical and re-charge times will be quicker.

Good cheap cells,look to importing(make sure check out seller and shop properly ),places like aliexpress will have 100+ at a time . Again double check reviews and seller first,but it will be one of the cheapest options of buying so many cells in one hit. Its more than likely what sellers be it US or UK do anyway.........Your missing out the middleman but do increase the risk.

Prepare for a long delivery time as chances it could come by sea and not air.........maybe 4-5 weeks(dont know). But maybe questions to ask if you choose that way

Good luck

 

[SubLGT]

Re: What battery to use?

Here is an interesting read about various Li-ion batteries. I have no idea about the accuracy of the author's assertions:
https://mindofmorandir.wordpress.com/2015/04/16/a-beginners-guide-to-lithium-batteries-rev-3/

A short excerpt:

"...AW- In terms of cells these are the highest quality available. Andrew Wang used to work for Panasonic, developed his own company, and is the top provider of cells to flashlight users (and of course now vapers). He gets the top 5%*7 of cells from Panasonic, Sanyo, etc. and puts his custom PCB on ICR cells. Cells routinely last 500 charges or more if handled properly.

Efest- Top 10% of cells from the same manufacturers as AW, though also gets cells from LG (top 15%) and Sony (top 15%). These do not last as long as as AW, but perform as well over the first 150 charges. Usually last 250-300 charges*8. As with the recent trend, another knock on Efest is their over stating of their amp limits on a lot of their high drain batteries.

LG- Top 10% of cells are sold as bare cells to consumers. The top 5% are reserved only for cars, phones, laptops. They have improved their cell quality and chemistry over time. Would put them one notch below AW, but right up there with the other big battery manufacturers…"