Is online Privacy truly gone?

[127.0.0.1]

umm, yeah I have to agree with EZO

I am someone who works for -all- the fortune 500 and every government agency you
can imagine in the field of computer security. I work on specific types of systems and
I won't say exactly which type...but it is big deal stuff and everyone with secret assets
to protect uses it. [I just happen to be at one of the organizations who
hires the brightest physicists and mathematicians and cryptographers, and has labs embedded
in the biggest universities, and organizations buy our software and hardware products to secure
whatever enterprise they operate, whether pharma, science, commerce or governance...I work on these systems]
...and computer security and anything that can occurs online is serious business. we have 40,000 employees
where I work and 2800 of these are specific to crypto, the others are specific to storing vast amounts
of data and protecting it, while also delivering it in microseconds when it is called up

three points

1) yup, full disclosure on what tracking is used for is not in everyone's hands, but needs to be.

2) the bad guys use the very same components and software engines developed for innocent commerce
and safe tracking and metrics,....for evil. you do not know if your info accidentally get redirected to a bad guy

3) good company has all your metrics, and your relationship with the web and tracking is currently great, it is
working as designed and everyone is happy, commerce works, you find products you like...the bad guy
hacks and gets access to that database and now ALL your info is in the bad guys hands. this is the current
gigantic flaw in this whole system. this data can NOT be guaranteed fully protected, due to the fact that
humans make mistakes...and this type of problem is why I have a job. it is easier to track when and who stole
some data, than to stop it from being stolen in the first place, and it is a constant battle to do both.

another huge flaw is many organizations that do tracking and have critical data, hire pinhead so-called
security professionals for the IT work, and they really do not have a freaking clue about what they do,
but they tell a good story in an interview and end up with important decision-making positions...then they
may or may not implement software such as what my company provides, but they screw it up, get behind on patches and updates, and...you know the rest of this story...it hits the news that XYZ credit card database has been stolen...


so yeah be a little paranoid about tracking. the only ones who care are companies who need to sell you something
or generate ad revenue, they hate your blocking. but the hackers and evil doers rely on peoples personal data
being constantly collected, sorted, and organized into a little portfolio that they can go attempt to steal someday and then
impersonate you somehow and gain an advantage

this is why I am largely off-the-grid in my real life. at work I am plugged right in, but I have only a normal cell
phone that does no GPS and just use it for voice only.


finally, no matter how smart I am, or how much smarter the real super-genius people are who develop
for my company, no matter how smart that MIT professor or nobel-prize winner in mathematics is, there is
always someone just a bit smarter, a bit more evil, a bit more desperate...who is trying to break the systems.
multiply this by 10,000 and put the power of unlimited evil government funding behind it, and you soon
see that the responsibility of protecting ones self starts at home on your own systems.

 

[hoffmyster86]

there never was any online privacy.. only the aninimaty of the mass's and not drawing attension.

 

[Sub_Umbra]

...the responsibility of protecting ones self starts at home on your own systems.

Ding, ding, ding, ding, we have a winner!

 

[blasterman]

another huge flaw is many organizations that do tracking and have critical data, hire pinhead so-called
security professionals for the IT work, and they really do not have a freaking clue about what they do,

IT pet Peeve #1

90% of the large companies I've done IT work for spend too much time and resources on Layer 3 and not enough on Layer 7. The IT Director will do anything the Cisco certified nerds tell them and hand them an open check book, and yet delegate layer 7 to desktop support staff and allow every user full desktop admin rights because they don't want to fight the political battle. You cannot have network security when your user base has full admin rights to their own desktops and can install apps at will. I don't care how much money you spent on your content filter and what Cisco tells you. If end users are running a browser that has full admin rights, and / isn't isn't sanboxed with authority there isn't security. Virus / Malware scanners are nothing more than airbags that you hope will function after a crash.

It is amusing though that some of the software mentioned here is the same stuff used to circumvent IT security measures. However, if the IT director doesn't have authority over what end users are running on their desktops it's not a technical matter anyways. Also, every piece of software you install is yet another variable and potential hack.

 

[orbital]

Google requiring cookies turned On for Search

+

Using Firefox {tested several versions},, anyone notice w/ other browsers

Started just about 1/2 hour ago, the only way around it is to hit the Reload button,
another hassle!



..the web gets less cool daily.

 

[TooManyGizmos]

Re: Google requiring cookies turned On for Search

~

DUHH .... how else can they TRACK your activity ?

objectives should be obvious by now .

~

 

[EZO]

Re: Google requiring cookies turned On for Search

Bleep Google!

Try using DuckDuckGo. They offer excellent search results and do not track you or filter bubble you. (Watch the video on the About page to learn more about DuckDuckGo...lots of cool features!)

Try StartPage. They don't track you either or record your IP address and in essence what you are getting is Google with all the tracking data stripped away. (About Startpage privacy)

Try Bing. All in all excellent search results in a well presented format.

None of these alternatives to Google require you to use cookies.

EDIT: If you really wanna' use Google but are concerned about cookies and other locally stored tracking data (like web bugs or beacons) in Firefox, just go up to the Tools Menu (Mac) or Firefox Button (Windows) and select Clear Recent History after your search. A quick and convenient way to do this on a Mac is to hold down the Command and Shift keys and hit Delete or Control/Shift + Delete in Windows.

 

[EZO]

Re: Google requiring cookies turned On for Search

UPDATE: This is interesting....After a little experimentation I discovered that if I disallow cookies in Firefox and attempt to do a search from Google's home page I get nothing.......just a blank Google page. With cookies still disabled in Firefox's preferences, if I do the same Google search using the integrated search field in Firefox's toolbar everything works fine. (But you end up at a different URL string on Google)

Perhaps others can try this and report back with confirmation.......I'm using Firefox 18 Beta.

Edit: Had some time later in the day to check out Google using Safari (6.0.2) and it works fine with or without allowing cookies, so this issue seems unique to Firefox and may be worth reporting to Mozilla.

 

[Dromsy]

Re: Google requiring cookies turned On for Search

I found a solution to this problem.

I managed to search with Google in Firefox 17.0.1 having Google cookies blocked. Do the following:

1. Search for a simple word on www.google.com. Any word. Let's say you search the word 'professional' (without quotes).
2. Of course the search results don't show up but when you refresh the page the results will show up ok.
3. Copy the URL from the address bar in Notepad. The URL will be something like http://www.google.com/#hl=en&tbo=d&sclient= ......... and so on.
4. Delete the word professional from the URL. It appears two times. So you'll be left with a similar URL but without the word you searched for in it.
5. Copy the new URL from Notepad to the address bar in Firefox and press Enter. A new Google search page shows up.
6. Bookmark this Google search page. You can make it your homepage. Now if you start your searches from this page you can search on Google having
cookies blocked.

Please, let me know if it worked for you.

 

[orbital]

Re: Google requiring cookies turned On for Search

^

any Bookmarked Google searches will give full results,, nothing wrong w/ havin' the thinking cap on
The issue becomes Searches on the fly & the the problem w/ the second page of results.

~~ side note; a few years ago, I first noticed Google searches gave different results when Cookies are enabled.
(particularly on consumer items)

I want raw 'unpersonalized' search results

..

 

[EZO]

Re: Google requiring cookies turned On for Search

^
~~ side note; a few years ago, I first noticed Google searches gave different results when Cookies are enabled.
(particularly on consumer items)

I want raw 'unpersonalized' search results

..

Orbital, you are referring to the "filter bubble" that I mentioned in my previous post. Check out this link....and this one......and then try DuckDuckGo. You'll get the completely unpersonalized search results you seek.
Break the Google habit!!

Edit: Also see the article in Forbes Magazine "Breaking Out of Your Internet Filter Bubble".

 

[orbital]

Re: Google requiring cookies turned On for Search

+

Quick heads up,,
today I just happened to check my Adobe Flash Setting and was very surprised/pissed to see my Local Shared Objects aka Flash Cookies settings changed!!

http://www.macromedia.com/support/documentation/en/flashplayer/help/settings_manager07.html

It was now allowing 3rd party flash cookies and X amount data stored on my drive.
There is no way I would ever change these..

Adobe would likely say it was a 'glitch' :shakehead


Not impressed!!

_________________________________________________________
add: this is not a situation of doing a Flash update either

when I do those,, I immediately check my settings.
Haven't done a flash update in a few months..

 

[thedoc007]

Re: Google requiring cookies turned On for Search

Regarding Ghostery, you might want to read this article:

http://www.technologyreview.com/news/516156/a-popular-ad-blocker-also-helps-the-ad-industry/

 

[EZO]

Re: Google requiring cookies turned On for Search

+

Quick heads up,,
today I just happened to check my Adobe Flash Setting and was very surprised/pissed to see my Local Shared Objects aka Flash Cookies settings changed!!

http://www.macromedia.com/support/documentation/en/flashplayer/help/settings_manager07.html

It was now allowing 3rd party flash cookies and X amount data stored on my drive.
There is no way I would ever change these..

Adobe would likely say it was a 'glitch' :shakehead


Not impressed!!

_________________________________________________________
add: this is not a situation of doing a Flash update either

when I do those,, I immediately check my settings.
Haven't done a flash update in a few months..

Having been an Adobe software user for 20 years now I have watched this once beloved company become increasingly despised by its customers, myself included for a wide range of reasons including chronic lapses in security, a general arrogance and contempt for the needs and preferences of their customers and willingness to engaging in exploitative pricing tactics in their near monopoly of their industry. But don't get me started......

The best way to be sure you are not plagued by Flash Cookies otherwise known as LSOs (local stored objects) also sometimes called Super Cookies is to use FireFox as your browser as well as the BetterPrivacy browser plug in. BetterPrivacy will allow you to monitor, count and delete all LSOs stored on your machine. A relatively new feature of the Firefox browser will also give you the option of deleting Flash Cookies when you quit the browser. I use both tools and periodically quit the browser to flush things out. (This can also be useful if you are using Little Snitch's "Deny Until Quit" setting.

If you want to use Firefox to delete Flash Cookies, or anything else for that matter, go to menu item "Preferences", then to "Privacy" and check off the box to delete them when you quit. While you are there, check off the box to delete "Offline Website Data" as shown below. Make sure you check off the box that says, "Clear history when Firefox closes". (some people like to keep their history but it is a good practice to flush this periodically IMHO)

 

[bshanahan14rulz]

Re: Google requiring cookies turned On for Search

many applications like flash now update automatically by default.

Just take the blue pill. I hear it's blueberry flavored!

 

[dc38]

Re: Google requiring cookies turned On for Search

many applications like flash now update automatically by default.

Just take the blue pill. I hear it's blueberry flavored!

For maximum Mind Blown, take the red pill instead. I hear that it's ALSO blueberry flavored. It's a lose lose situation here.

 

[moldyoldy]

Re: Google requiring cookies turned On for Search

<snip>

The best way to be sure you are not plagued by Flash Cookies otherwise known as LSOs (local stored objects) also sometimes called Super Cookies is to use FireFox as your browser as well as the BetterPrivacy browser plug in. BetterPrivacy will allow you to monitor, count and delete all LSOs stored on your machine. A relatively new feature of the Firefox browser will also give you the option of deleting Flash Cookies when you quit the browser. I use both tools and periodically quit the browser to flush things out. (This can also be useful if you are using Little Snitch's "Deny Until Quit" setting.

If you want to use Firefox to delete Flash Cookies, or anything else for that matter, go to menu item "Preferences", then to "Privacy" and check off the box to delete them when you quit. While you are there, check off the box to delete "Offline Website Data" as shown below. Make sure you check off the box that says, "Clear history when Firefox closes". (some people like to keep their history but it is a good practice to flush this periodically IMHO)
<snip>

ahhh, I resisted so far, but this entry was sufficiently interesting to comment on:

Last first: My FF browser (24.0) is not in the English language and does not have the FlashCookies delete entry in the security settings panel. odd.

I dropped Ghostery and installed "Disconnect" which is or was not available on the Mozilla FF plug-in website. With Disconnect, quite a few more trackers showed up as blocked or still open for predictable sites. odd. I wonder why...

Ref closing browsers: In addition to not allowing history or passwords to be saved, and assuming all history is deleted when I close FF, there are some additional practices that are useful. If you log in to a website with an ID/pwd, always log in from a fresh browser launch - never from an additional tab and use the Privacy mode (InPrivate). When you have completed your work, always log out AND close the browser window used to log in, and any other browser window you may have open.

Ref logging in with ID/pwd: Keystroke loggers cannot track mouse movements. Hence if you want to confuse keystroke loggers, use the following pattern: Type the first 3 or last 3 characters of your password incorrectly, yet all other characters correctly. Then highlight the incorrect characters with your mouse and retype them. Do NOT use the DEL or Backspace key or any Shift/Arrow keys. The correctly typed characters will replace the incorrect characters. In effect, your password as entered has been lengthened by the number of characters originally incorrectly typed. Then as long as you never use any word in any dictionary as part of your password, and vary the location and number of incorrect characters, the likelyhood of your password being decoded by a keystroke logger is very small. It would be desirable if you also had a 2-way SW firewall that would catch any attempted transmission by the keystroke logger - which you would then deny. All this in the possible case when a keystroke logger slips past your paid anti-virus solution.

Also, Google Chrome communicates with it's Mother Ship even when you are not using Google Chrome and did not open it! Same problem as Apple SW, although Apple is more 'up-front' about doing that.

If you are really neurotic, you would create a flash drive with a full OS image, preferably from a new computer. All storage goes to the flash drive, nothing to laptop hard drive, make a copy of that. Boot from the flash drive. do your business online. log off the Flashdrive OS. delete that OS from the flash drive along with all data. Switch to the next flash drive for your next online session.

For that matter, most European Governmental security personnel never use the same computer for banking as for surfing the Internet. Also, many European ministers have 3 cell phones: 1 for secure talk. 1 for data. 1 for personnel. Each of those cells have a different security solution. SECUSMART is only one of many solutions. The best security SW/firmware is normally not from any public company. That includes https:// or the AES forms. The final answer lies with the user!

edit: keep in mind that the math genius that provided the original impetus to breaking the German Enigma code realized that it was not necessary to test all combinations of the cipher. only a small segment would suffice. so much for all those combinations, permutations, and prime numbers.

 

[moldyoldy]

Re: Google requiring cookies turned On for Search

inasmuch as the thread title seems to have changed, these comments are thereby off-topic, although still perhaps worthwhile to note:

To protect themselves from rootkits (keystroke loggers, etc.), users should frequently reboot their computers. This gives the paid anti-virus SW a chance to scan the startup files. Rootkits were started by Sony in it's DRM efforts - which was unfortunately picked up on by virus-writers.

Really off-topic, but cell phones are even more susceptible to hacking. Even if the user 'turns off' his/her cell phone, the cell phone is not actually totally shut down. It is merely in a light or deep sleep (depending on brand/model). The cellular carrier (or others) can still send messages to that cell and those msgs are not reported or logged to the user. That is why when I shut off my cell phone for certain ocassions, I remove the battery and leave it out of the cell phone. In some German firms, the managers are required to place their cell phones in a metal box as well before certain conferences.

 

[Chauncey Gardiner]

Re: Is Online Privacy Truly Gone? Google Requiring Cookies Turned On for Search

L@@Ks like two threads were merged. Carry on discussing both subjects.

~ Chance

 

[StarHalo]

Re: Is Online Privacy Truly Gone? Google Requiring Cookies Turned On for Search

Everybody finds out they agree with my guy after it's too late: Opting Out From the Corporate State of Surveillance