Magic Fire 40W HID 4000-Lumen 4x18650 HID Flashlight

Patriot

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Well, the numbers that BVH posted in his videos tell the truth and the beamshots certainly seem to reflect those figures. I'm a bit disappointed that these lights were either falsely advertised or that the product is so inconsistent that they range anywhere from 28W - 40W. This light probably won't add anything to my arsenal that I wasn't already experiencing with the K3500 or Boxer 24W, aside from better color temperature. I'm still hoping that by some chance my tests closer to advertised wattage than BVH's test sample but that's probably wishful thinking. On the plus side, run time is increased a bit which will make it nice for walking the dog and such.

Really appreciate the tests, beam shots and other pics you guys. Helps me feel like I'm still part of this while my light is "processed in hong kong, departing hong kong, arrived at hong kong, departing hong kong, arrived at hong kong........................" :)
 

spaz815

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Yes, I have to deal with customs as well too. Just call the supplier to check with Dhl why it took so long and Dhl will trace it back to rush the release of the goods.

I deal with Dhl many times and this is the only way to get it released quickly. Hope this helps.

It isn't being shipped DHL. Its EMS.
 

mohanjude

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Well, the numbers that BVH posted in his videos tell the truth and the beamshots certainly seem to reflect those figures. I'm a bit disappointed that these lights were either falsely advertised or that the product is so inconsistent that they range anywhere from 28W - 40W. This light probably won't add anything to my arsenal that I wasn't already experiencing with the K3500 or Boxer 24W, aside from better color temperature. I'm still hoping that by some chance my tests closer to advertised wattage than BVH's test sample but that's probably wishful thinking. On the plus side, run time is increased a bit which will make it nice for walking the dog and such.

Really appreciate the tests, beam shots and other pics you guys. Helps me feel like I'm still part of this while my light is "processed in hong kong, departing hong kong, arrived at hong kong, departing hong kong, arrived at hong kong........................" :)

Paul

I have several done amp draws and it is around 2.8amps on my light at 3.9v = 43W = 20% loss so around 36W.Don't know why mine is higher. I recently bought a Polarion X1 which is rated at 40W and just a eye ball shows that the Polarion is miles better. It throws much further, looks brighter and the beam is a pleasure to look at. I guess looking at the replacement battery pack for the Polarion X1 is nearly 150% of the cost this HID light. It is all down to money. As I said in my opinion my search goes on to find the ultimate pocket HID - a HID the size of the Eznite and throws like a PH50.... I would pay twice the cost of the PH50 for a HID light like that... only wish somebody made it.
 
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2100

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Hey guys, 36W input seems pretty ok to me. I mean this is like those Ebay/Aliexpress alu tube stuff...usable but if you are talking about "CPF enthusiasts level", it's definitely not there. Regarding pricing, I was offered a lower pricing, but i'm now also into another hobby (more expensive) so... hehe, a bit picky in what i get now. :D I did not even want to pay for a $40 upgrade to the 85W ballast, I mean i am ok with the present performance for 65W.

FYI, I got about 4000 lumens OTF in ceiling bounce (+/- 10%, upwards is not optimal burn position) for my 65W Ebay. Pretty ok and still working... both here and Indo, though over here it does not get much use (triode888 still using his? LOL!). My 3.8M cd HID also not much use other than cloud spotting, i'd be in jail if i were to spot planes in my southern SG approach corridor....and i can't point at buildings for nuts. (being socially responsible here).
There's a cheap 532nm "thrower" at o-like for 81 bucks if you need something for cheap thrills, that's 10 miles easy aided by the beam expander. Not getting it, sheesh how to use that man? NOHD is like > 500m easily. It's easily classified as a weapon in a court of law by the prosecution.

Sorry for the OT. :D Anyway if you want entertainment, google shoudian (ma_sha's good at it man) and check out the feilong/flydragon new 2D80 5/7/9 XM-L. It's being sold at int-outdoor for nearly 600 bucks. It's probably below 45k (with SR92 as comparison), but something like 5000L OTF. Check it out.
 

Ginseng

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It is all down to money. As I said in my opinion my search goes on to find the ultimate pocket HID - a HID the size of the Eznite and throws like a PH50.... I would pay twice the cost of the PH50 for a HID light like that... only wish somebody made it.
Yep,
And that is why I'm sooo glad there are cheaper options like this for users like me. I'm aspirational in LEDs but kilobuck range or higher is a non-option for me. It's all a matter of expectations.
Wilkey
 

Wildlands

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I have used this 4 nights in a row, and I have dropped it a couple times, left it in 12 inches of snow for 5 mins, run it for almost an hour straight a few times, tossed it in my car and my pack. It's gone through forests, across fields, and up a few hills. So far, I am thrilled with it and have had no issues.

I do not have 20 other HIDs to compare it to, especially not thousand plus dollar ones. I have one Stanley HID that cost me half what this did, but that really is not portable or carry-able during hiking/running. I wanted something like the Stanley, that had better color and as much light, and I was willing to sacrifice some of the beam profile for portability. I got exactly what I wanted.

It is not perfect for every application. It is not an LED light with multiple levels of lighting. I like it for putting out a better color rendition than my LEDs, and I love the power of this beast for the price.

Some folks are coming from a different perspective, and want different things. That being said, this is not a disappointment at the price, and it is a fine tool for those who have specific needs.
 

BVH

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The Amondotech line of lights were sold by "Amondotech" before he went out of business and sold/transfered some inventory to BatteryJunction. Not really sure about all that happened in that. The amondotech is the forerunner of the famous POB (made by the same factory). I bought mine before Amondotech closed down. I modded it with a 46 Watt ballast a year ago or so. The blue beam was not as intense as in the pic.

where did you buy that amondotech? can't find much about it
 

TEEJ

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I have used this 4 nights in a row, and I have dropped it a couple times, left it in 12 inches of snow for 5 mins, run it for almost an hour straight a few times, tossed it in my car and my pack. It's gone through forests, across fields, and up a few hills. So far, I am thrilled with it and have had no issues.

I do not have 20 other HIDs to compare it to, especially not thousand plus dollar ones. I have one Stanley HID that cost me half what this did, but that really is not portable or carry-able during hiking/running. I wanted something like the Stanley, that had better color and as much light, and I was willing to sacrifice some of the beam profile for portability. I got exactly what I wanted.

It is not perfect for every application. It is not an LED light with multiple levels of lighting. I like it for putting out a better color rendition than my LEDs, and I love the power of this beast for the price.

Some folks are coming from a different perspective, and want different things. That being said, this is not a disappointment at the price, and it is a fine tool for those who have specific needs.


That works for me, as its in line with my expectations. I was not expecting a Polarion for $150...I wasn't even sure it would survive use for work, but I do experiment, and sometimes a piece of equipment works out, and sometimes its relegated to the trash bin/a shelf somewhere, etc. So, so far, it sounds promising.

:D
 

Ginseng

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I have used this 4 nights in a row, and I have dropped it a couple times, left it in 12 inches of snow for 5 mins, run it for almost an hour straight a few times, tossed it in my car and my pack. It's gone through forests, across fields, and up a few hills. So far, I am thrilled with it and have had no issues.

I do not have 20 other HIDs to compare it to, especially not thousand plus dollar ones. I have one Stanley HID that cost me half what this did, but that really is not portable or carry-able during hiking/running. I wanted something like the Stanley, that had better color and as much light, and I was willing to sacrifice some of the beam profile for portability. I got exactly what I wanted.

It is not perfect for every application. It is not an LED light with multiple levels of lighting. I like it for putting out a better color rendition than my LEDs, and I love the power of this beast for the price.

Some folks are coming from a different perspective, and want different things. That being said, this is not a disappointment at the price, and it is a fine tool for those who have specific needs.
I like the sound of that. Thanks for sharing your experience with the light.

Wilkey
 

Patriot

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2100
Hey guys, 36W input seems pretty ok to me.
.Yeah, honestly, that's quite acceptable in my book as well. I'd be happy to get a 36W example of MF. Seems though it's a bit hit and miss evidenced by BVH's light.
 

TEEJ

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Based upon the 350 yard shots posted, my SR90 seemed stronger than most of the HID's. I have not had a chance to re-test the SR90 after De-Doming though, so when the HID arrives, I'll shoot some shots with the de-domed SR90 and maybe some other throwers I have laying around.

:D


So far, the HID is doing the Hong Kong dance in Cincinnati now though, so who knows when I'll see it in person. And I hope mine is 37 watts.

:nana:
 
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ma_sha1

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Ma_Sha, have you or anyone else measured the FireFox input and/or output?

Never measured the Power, But I have measured Lux on oracle 24W & Xeccon 33 35W HID, shine top has a lux measurement for Firefox 1 being 148K lux.

In my hands, The firefox 1 lost to the xeccon slightly in throw, but it has a better beam.

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...ated-Short-Arc-amp-HID-spotlight-Lux-readings

3" or smaller Reflector Group
--Xeccon SSK-33 2-mode HID, 3" reflector 35W mode: 135,000 cp (Measured by ma_sha1)
--Xeccon SSK-33 2-mode HID, 3" reflector 28W mode: 96,000 cp (Measured
--MicroFire Warrior III OP-polished reflector 92,000 cp(measured by MorePower)
--MicroFire Warrior III 3" SMO reflector, 108,000 cp (measured by shinetop, 3 meters)
--Fire-Foxes 1(火狐2009), 2.6" SMO, Peeled naked bulb, 148,500 cp (measured by shinetop, 3 meters)

Low Power HIDs: 25W or less
...24W Tactical HID- 40,000 cp (measured by jirik_cz)
...24W Oracle HID, OP reflector- 45,000 cp (measured by ma_sha1)
 

MDJAK

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I think smart consumers, as most of us are, believe that you get what you pay for. Yes, sometimes there's a diamond in the rough, but for the most part if it's too good to be true, it is.

The MS is my first HID. Last night, after using it for two straight weeks, I decided to take my slightly smaller and lighter JetBeam RRT3-XML on my 3 mile walk. Now that is an over $300 light. And it runs no problem for 50 minutes on high (1950) that my walk takes.

But now that I am getting slightly more knowledgeable about this stuff, slightly being the operational word here, I see that it does not throw nearly as far as I originally thought, and it's not nearly as bright as I thought.

That's why I went HID. And I now only slightly regret buying over a thousand dollars worth of lights in my first few months in this hobby. I should have just bought a few small LEDs (which I did), and the Abyss. The SR90, while a great thrower, is too big for me to carry (and I use the shoulder strap), and has no real up close spread and so it's just not my cup of tea.


I ordered the Abyss a few minutes ago and am already looking in my mailbox for it. :naughty:
 

2100

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.Yeah, honestly, that's quite acceptable in my book as well. I'd be happy to get a 36W example of MF. Seems though it's a bit hit and miss evidenced by BVH's light.

I guess there definitely would be some noticeable variances between the lights. For my "65W" ebay lights, some of them are a fair bit brighter (I haven't measured them) and yeah some bulbs definitely would be bent more than others and it's not really bendable. My 100W ballasts are pretty ok, one is 98W input and another 93W input. But my 75W are somewhat bad, its only like 58-60W. My 55 watters are pretty much on the dot. The trick to the cheap chinese auto type ballasts and bulbs is simple, just overdrive them somewhat and stock up on the bulbs as you save on shipping. I haven't used them for like 30 minutes at a time, but for 10 mins bursts I haven't encountered a need to change any "overdriven" bulb.


Well another factor would be "OTF lumens". Just wondering, did anybody measure any ceiling bounce figures relative to LED lights with known outputs and lux figures? That'd be good info.

If it's just below SR90 in throw, it could be 90-100k thereabouts (i am not sure if you phenomenon in which CW LEDs get slightly lower figures on the meter as compared to HID applies here, but lets keep it simple for starters)
 

TEEJ

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I guess there definitely would be some noticeable variances between the lights. For my "65W" ebay lights, some of them are a fair bit brighter (I haven't measured them) and yeah some bulbs definitely would be bent more than others and it's not really bendable. My 100W ballasts are pretty ok, one is 98W input and another 93W input. But my 75W are somewhat bad, its only like 58-60W. My 55 watters are pretty much on the dot. The trick to the cheap chinese auto type ballasts and bulbs is simple, just overdrive them somewhat and stock up on the bulbs as you save on shipping. I haven't used them for like 30 minutes at a time, but for 10 mins bursts I haven't encountered a need to change any "overdriven" bulb.


Well another factor would be "OTF lumens". Just wondering, did anybody measure any ceiling bounce figures relative to LED lights with known outputs and lux figures? That'd be good info.

If it's just below SR90 in throw, it could be 90-100k thereabouts (i am not sure if you phenomenon in which CW LEDs get slightly lower figures on the meter as compared to HID applies here, but lets keep it simple for starters)


If you HAVE an SR90 for example, and you want it to THROW, just de-dome it. I got 203,000 Lux at 1 meter with that single SR90 mod.

It goes from great, to BEAST. :D
 

Patriot

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I thought that de-domed SST-90s were losing 15-20% output. Not really something I'd be interested in doing as it just reduces efficiency. I guess I can understand the sacrifice if one's primary goal is a throw light but I'd probably more interested in an aspheric arrangement if I was going to give up lumens for throw.
 

TEEJ

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I thought that de-domed SST-90s were losing 15-20% output. Not really something I'd be interested in doing as it just reduces efficiency. I guess I can understand the sacrifice if one's primary goal is a throw light but I'd probably more interested in an aspheric arrangement if I was going to give up lumens for throw.

Well, it is relative in this case. The SR90 has a ton of spill normally....and when trying to see a great distance off, too much ambient light makes your eyes stop down, making it harder to see/resolve targets at long range. The De-domed SR90 essentially reduces (But doesn't eliminate) the spill, and tightens the corona, and throws about the same hot spot beam - but further. The lost lumens are the ones normally used for spill...so lets say the stock light had 1,300 OTF lumens...a loss of ~15% - 20% = ~ 195 - 260 lumens.

Stock, the SR 90 throws about as far as the TK70, even though the TK70 is pumping out ~ 2,200 OTF lumens, vs the stock SR90's ~1,300 lumens. The rest of the TK70's lumens are corona and spill, etc. At full range, you can't see with the TK70's corona or spill, you only see what's left of the hot spot, same as an SR90 at full range.

All De-Doming the SR90 does is trade the coupla hundred lumens of light that never would reach the target anyway, and that reduces night vision, for more light that WILL reach the target...so that you can see it better.

As that's the point of a long range light, I'm fine with that.

:D

When I get a chance, I'll see what the OTF is...I have no idea of the actual loss, one way or the other, other than it was projected to be in that range. Typically, for a thrower, its less about lumens and more about Lux down range.

I DO know the light pumped out 203,000 Lux at one meter though....which bodes well for being able to reach out and touch.

:D



SR90 - Stock:

SR90WithDome.jpg







SR90 - De-Domed:

SR90DeDome.jpg



:naughty:
 
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Patriot

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Well, it is relative in this case. The SR90 has a ton of spill normally....and when trying to see a great distance off, too much ambient light makes your eyes stop down, making it harder to see/resolve targets at long range. The De-domed SR90 essentially reduces (But doesn't eliminate) the spill, and tightens the corona, and throws about the same hot spot beam - but further. The lost lumens are the ones normally used for spill...so lets say the stock light had 1,300 OTF lumens...a loss of ~15% - 20% = ~ 195 - 260 lumens.

Stock, the SR 90 throws about as far as the TK70, even though the TK70 is pumping out ~ 2,200 OTF lumens, vs the stock SR90's ~1,300 lumens. The rest of the TK70's lumens are corona and spill, etc. At full range, you can't see with the TK70's corona or spill, you only see what's left of the hot spot, same as an SR90 at full range.

:D


All makes sense except for the estimates of light loss. I think the actual loss is greater than the 195-260K estimate because I my experience the SR90 OTF lumens are substantially greater than what two of the most well known testers have tested it at. I think they've received under performing examples or I just happen to have a unusually high performing example of SR90. When I compare bounce tests with other well known and reliable HIDs and LED lights to a pretty strict test model, it's closer to 2000+ lumens not 1300. For example, I measure between 224-248 lux which is well above the WE Boxer 24W and approaches the output of the 35W HID's. Not to be confused with throw measurements, these are simply measurements of relative light output. When the MF gets here I'll measure it and add it to the list along with some updates. I'm missing a bunch of lights from this list for some reason and have to find them.

Jil Lite EZNite 10W HID
28 lux stabilized at 1:15
45 lux peak at 14 sec


AE Light PL24/S 24W HID
100 lux stabilized at 1:00
101 lux peak


Wolf Eyes Boxer 24W HID
151 lux stabilized at 1:35
152 lux peak


Microfire Warrior K3500 35W HID
305 lux stabilized at 1:30
310 lux peak


Costco / Harbor Freight 35W HID
296 lux stabilized at 1:10
419 lux peak at 35 sec.


ower on Board 35W HID
326 lux stabilized at 1:35
333 lux peak at 2:00


Polarion PH50 Helios 50W HID
650 lux stabilized at 50 sec.
1000 lux peak at 9 sec.


Polarion Night Reaper (CSWL) 50+W HID
740 lux stabilized at 1:00
1134 lux peak at 11 sec.
 

TEEJ

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I'm trying to interpret your numbers...It looks like the HID's, as a pattern, are brighter in the first few seconds, and then settle down to a lower brightness?

And assuming those are Lux at 1 meter #'s...that would put the SR90 way higher than I would think makes any sense...? Visually, I would have pictured it ~ the performance of a 35 watt HID or so as far as throw...so, do you have a order of magnitude missing from your Lux#'s above, or are they something other than lux at one meter?


I used the total OTF #'s from the esteemed testors you referred to (I'm guessing, as that's how many posted the OTF lumens...) as well, as they seemed to agree with each other.

Figure its rated for 2,200 emitter lumens...so 2,000 OTF would be a high estimate typically...~1,700 lumens would be a good guess though...as that's what Olight actually says on the website right now (Looked).

So perhaps the OTF was under estimated here...or over estimated by Olight...or both, etc.

Even if we use the 1,700 lumens...15% = 255 lumens, etc....its the same order of magnitude.


One thing I've noticed about perceived brightness, it is judged differently by different people. I can show two lights, one thrower, and one flood...and they can have the same OTF ratings, and one person will say the Thrower is MUCH BRIGHTER...and the other person will say the Flooder is MUCH BRIGHTER, and so forth.

So, I think its the way we're hardwired....just like some of us see a gal as too skinny, and someone else will call them fat.

:D

For me, its about what I can see. I spend a lot of time looking for things, and, when not looking for work, I'm experimenting.

My next experiment will be to see at what ranges we need how many lux to resolve details. I plan to compare a man carrying wood in his arms to a man carrying fire arms, and see at what range we can tell them apart...at what lux level.

:D


Preliminary data indicates that while we use 0.25 lux as our default throw limit designation...and you can definetely see fine right in front of you at 0.25 lux...you CAN'T resolve fine detail several hundred yards away at 0.25 lux.

My theory is that the part of your eye that you USE to focus on a distant object is very poor in low light situations, and your more periphreal vision (~ 2º + off center) has better light reception than your fovea.

So while you can navigate around objects, etc, at 0.25 lux w/o a problem, or even less...I want to see how many lux we need to tell if a guy has a gun or a stick when he's a long way off in the dark.

So, the MF, etc... will be part of this.
 
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