Yellow Hella Optilux bulbs illegal?

I've noticed that there are Hella Optilux Extreme Yellow XY bulbs that are noted as "Off Road Only". I always like to switch fog bulbs to yellow, and have one application where it is H11, but stumbled across this, relatively reasonably priced bulb, only to see that they are illegal for street use. Can someone please explain?

Re: Hella Optilux bulbs illegal?

H11 is on the list of approved light sources for headlamps in the US, and -- like all other headlamp light sources -- must emit white light. "Off road use only" types of disclaimers are legally meaningless. The regulations and laws apply to any/all regulated parts, including headlight bulbs, that are physically capable of being installed. It makes no difference how many places "Off road use only" (or whatever) is printed on the part or on the box it comes in; the regs still apply to it.

Also, Hella Optilux bulbs are poor-quality junk -- they are toys and trinkets for kids who think lights are fashion toys.

There are (still) no good yellow bulbs, only a variety of trash.

Re: Hella Optilux bulbs illegal?

-Virgil- said:

There are (still) no good yellow bulbs, only a variety of trash.

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Is it possible to make a legally compliant yellow bulb? Or does the coating make it a nonstarter?

Re: Hella Optilux bulbs illegal?

Sadden said:

Is it possible to make a legally compliant yellow bulb?

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Yes. In the US, it would have to be one of the types that is not on the headlamp light source list, so that would be bulbs like H10 and H12 (the 9040, 9140, 9045, 9145, 9055, 9155 family) or the 800-series (inherently useless, why bother). UN Regulation 37 (rest of the world) allows bulb types H1, H3, H4, H7, H8, H11, H16, HB3 (9005), and HB4 (9006) to emit white or selective yellow light -- though this does not necessarily mean it's legal to use selective yellow bulbs in any particular kind of lamp in any particular country that applies the UN regulations.

Re: Hella Optilux bulbs illegal?

So by and large yes it could be done. Provided that they still meet other applicable reqs and there no local regulation saying otherwise...

I guess that begs the question... Why hasnt a reputable maker started producing them?

Even in the forum fanboy circles "yellow" is considered the best option for foglamps. A proper selective yellow bulb of quality would sell well enough even just in those crowds to cover R&D and production.

Hella Optilux bulbs illegal?

As a confession I have been using PIAA's Ion yellow bulbs for this type of application.

But just a quick H11 yellow search came up with these seemingly real OSRAM ones:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/OSRAM-Fog-B...ash=item3f6323562b:g:7w8AAOSwnHZYWaBR&vxp=mtr

Re: Hella Optilux bulbs illegal?

Sadden said:

I guess that begs the question... Why hasnt a reputable maker started producing them?

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Insufficient demand to justify it.

Even in the forum fanboy circles "yellow" is considered the best option for foglamps

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...and they don't care a feather or a fig for actual quality. They go for sexy packaging and extravagant claims, and most of them won't spend more than $6 because they spent the rest of their allowance on the latest Pokemon app or whatever.

A proper selective yellow bulb of quality would sell well enough even just in those crowds to cover R&D and production.

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I think it probably would not -- unless you've got market research numbers you're not sharing with us...?

jzchen said:

As a confession I have been using PIAA's Ion yellow bulbs for this type of application.

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That just means you're spending money for a disbeneficial product. Those dichroic-coated bulbs are a losing deal; they were always a bad idea. The only thing they do is let you point to your car and say "Look, yellow fog lights!". They do not give any kind of performance or seeing advantage, and given the poor quality and high price of PIAA's bulbs, buying them is a fool's errand.

But just a quick H11 yellow search came up with these seemingly real OSRAM ones:

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Made in China -- definitely considerably better quality than the off-brand junk, but still not up to quality standards of Osram/Sylvania's US and European product. Philips has a similar line. If I had to have a yellow bulb for some reason, these (either the Osram or the Philips) are probably the ones I'd get.

Re: Hella Optilux bulbs illegal?

Thank you Virgil. As usual insightful and helpful!!!

Re: Hella Optilux bulbs illegal?

But just a quick H11 yellow search came up with these seemingly real OSRAM ones

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I installed a set of these in our Honda CRV's fog lights. They make a nice yellow contrast in comparison to the Philips Xtreme H4 +100s in the headlights.

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What does "nice yellow contrast" mean to you, and what is its importance to you?

Re: Hella Optilux bulbs illegal?

I meant to mention earlier: I bought and examined a pair of the Osram Fog Breaker HB4 (9006) yellow bulbs. They are neither DOT-certified nor ECE-approved (in fact there's a prominently crossed-out ECE among other "not for road use" types of warnings). That's interesting given that a yellow HB4 is allowed by ECE Regulation 37.

PIAA LED Reflector Series Any Good?

I've read some of Daniel Stern's article, maybe not all of it in detail. I opened the other research .pdf and glanced at it a little. I could not figure out whether they specifically used yellow, white, or a mix of the two in these studies. (I don't think I could apply tape on the lamps or paint the lenses as I saw here on the forums, at least with decent results that is). So is it worth it to swap in yellow bulbs as I have been doing? My understanding is the amount of light available is diminished when "selecting yellow". This is supposed to outweigh, negatively, the benefit of the color?

Re: Hella Optilux bulbs illegal?

-Virgil- said:

I meant to mention earlier: I bought and examined a pair of the Osram Fog Breaker HB4 (9006) yellow bulbs. They are neither DOT-certified nor ECE-approved (in fact there's a prominently crossed-out ECE among other "not for road use" types of warnings). That's interesting given that a yellow HB4 is allowed by ECE Regulation 37.

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Is the bulb shape unique, or the filament position? If it's beyond you it's definitely beyond me, with what little optics study I've had in Physics class....

Re: Hella Optilux bulbs illegal?

jzchen said:

Is the bulb shape unique, or the filament position?

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By design or intention, no, it looks like any other HB4 (9006) bulb. Whether it actually meets specs in terms of light output, filament geometry, power consumption, etc, would be a matter for formal testing.

Re: PIAA LED Reflector Series Any Good?

jzchen said:

I've read some of Daniel Stern's article, maybe not all of it in detail.

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I assume you're talking about this one? If you're trying to understand the why/why not of selective yellow light, it's worth reading carefully and completely.

I opened the other research .pdf and glanced at it a little. I could not figure out whether they specifically used yellow, white, or a mix of the two in these studies.

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Well, again, if you want to understand a document, you really have to read it -- the whole document, not just skim a few words and headlines. Once you've actually read it, your questions will either be all answered, or they will change.

So is it worth it to swap in yellow bulbs as I have been doing?

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"Worth" what? What is the goal? Fog lamps themselves are fundamentally useless except at very low speeds in very bad weather.

My understanding is the amount of light available is diminished when "selecting yellow". This is supposed to outweigh, negatively, the benefit of the color?

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The color is named selective yellow. That thing about filtration losses counteracting the benefit is one of a whole lot of simplistic folk-answers to folk-questions. You've already found the best documents to learn about this subject...but they only work if you read them!

Re: Hella Optilux bulbs illegal?

-Virgil- said:

I meant to mention earlier: I bought and examined a pair of the Osram Fog Breaker HB4 yellow bulbs.

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Daniel Stern mentioned those in an email to a friend of mine, as well as the HB3 version. And a Putco ("Where the Putz Goes!") bulb of a type I'm afraid to mention directly because NO!
I imagine the yellow coating will burn off in short order (the box apparently said "Bulbs made in Korea, coated in USA by Putco"), and the lack of the blacktop makes them a non-starter in pretty much any fog lamp I can think of. If they are at least decent, then I could see them going into my friend's RX300, which has Koito-branded factory projector fog lamps which seem to produce less light in the glare zone than my LS430's Stanley-branded factory reflector fog lamps.

Right now, my friend's RX300 has those yellow "Optilux" bulbs, despite advice from Daniel Stern to not install them. I did have an opportunity to experience them in real fog that by our estimation only gave about 90 feet of seeing distance (as far as the road markings went), but that was done by observing when the close edge of a center lane stripe was visible, then counting "one Mississippi, two Mississippi" until the stripe reached the bumper, and then estimating 30 feet per second since we were going about 20mph. The fog lamps on just made the stripes *slightly* easier to spot maybe another couple of feet out, if that much, or maybe (probably!) it was wishful thinking.

At the speed we were going, and the speed OTHERS were going, we sorely wished for a rear fog lamp! Several times we were approached from the rear by idiots who would get right on our bumper (too close for comfort) then passed us whether the lane markings and/or sanity permitted it or not. Their taillamps would disappear in maybe five or six seconds, lost to the mist...

So I've been thinking about the question "what I want to accomplish?". If I get stuck in severe weather, can only see a few feet in front of me, and stopping is not an option, will I benefit from "selective yellow" fog lights? The caveat being I need to get yellow bulbs, because painting or taping the lamps on my own would probably be a disaster.

(I don't mean to provoke anything. I am sorry.)

I did not read the Daniel Stern article on selective yellow until you referenced it. I was trying to determine the benefit of selective yellow light from the foglight article referenced and the link from there to the study by someone in MI, where I decided to read the abstract, to get the author's conclusion. The data was pretty hard to interpret for me.

I think I found my answer hidden in the middle of this post:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...lamp-options&p=3868698&viewfull=1#post3868698



"Fog lamps can be either white or selective yellow-- selective yellow is a better choice than white."

jzchen said:

I think I found my answer hidden in the middle of this post:

Alaric Darconville said:

Fog lamps can be either white or selective yellow-- selective yellow is a better choice than white.

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Yes, but remember that is true only between otherwise identical fog lamps that are also genuinely GOOD fog lamps. Selective yellow bulbs don't turn junk fog lamps into GOOD fog lamps. Also remember that the Hella OptiLux might be, shall we say, possibly just barely serviceable if we can be even THAT charitable. These bulbs could tend to defocus a set of fog lamps (if you look closely at the envelope, they look slightly *cloudy*), which would mean then that any gain from yellow tinting would be lost to the poorer focus.

A single rear fog lamp will afford you more protection than a pair of selective yellow front fog lamps-- you're more in danger of being hit from behind than you yourself hitting someone from behind (unless you think your fog lamps enable clear-weather freeway speeds through Elfin magic).

Alaric Darconville said:

Yes, but remember that is true only between otherwise identical fog lamps that are also genuinely GOOD fog lamps. Selective yellow bulbs don't turn junk fog lamps into GOOD fog lamps. Also remember that the Hella OptiLux might be, shall we say, possibly just barely serviceable if we can be even THAT charitable.

A single rear fog lamp will afford you more protection than a pair of selective yellow front fog lamps-- you're more in danger of being hit from behind than you yourself hitting someone from behind (unless you think your fog lamps enable clear-weather freeway speeds through Elfin magic).

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In my case some cars in the household come with fog lights built in from the factory. I wish to utilize them, not as fashion statements, but in fog when I get caught in fog. (A lot of cars come with white bulbs originally as I know because that is somewhat the "in" thing.) I'm not comparing the fog lights that come with a car to anything else. I am not going to custom fit a replacement. (That is too laborious for me to accomplish.) Whether or not a particular model has a good or poor fog light, I wouldn't know as you do, but I'm going to try to use whatever I have when I need to.

Someone asked in another thread about how to add a rear fog light. I guess the questioning on how to add one to the rear I should note over there, as I do have interest in adding one to the rear of my '13 smart fortwo. In other countries they come with them, but a simple switch of the rear lamp housing is not possible, as those with fogs have 3 bulbs while in the US we have 2. (In my case I'm thinking of disconnecting the driver side/left backup light, as my research notes that regulations say that is the side for fogs, switching to a red bulb, and connecting it to the OE switch location on the center console. Seems like the easiest way to implement it.) I am sorry I digress.

jzchen said:

I wish to utilize [my fog lamps] not as fashion statements

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Good.

(A lot of cars come with white bulbs originally as I know because that is somewhat the "in" thing.)

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No, it's just cheaper for the automakers-- a clear lens is cheaper to produce than a selective yellow lens, and in the case of using a bulb to get that effect, it's all but impossible to get a decent yellow bulb (it was easier when cadmium's use was still permitted, but cadmium's toxicity is such that we're better off that it's not used). Of course, now it seems "in" for the automakers to make make the fog lamps match the headlamps, or try to, by using ever-higher CCT light sources...

I'm not comparing the fog lights that come with a car to anything else. I am not going to custom fit a replacement. (That is too laborious for me to accomplish.) Whether or not a particular model has a good or poor fog light, I wouldn't know as you do, but I'm going to try to use whatever I have when I need to.

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On many vehicles, the factory fog lamps are little more than toys, and on some they are quite good. But even with very very good fog lamps, used appropriately, what they accomplish is Not. Much.

Someone asked in another thread about how to add a rear fog light. I guess the questioning on how to add one to the rear I should note over there, as I do have interest in adding one to the rear of my '13 smart fortwo.

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And a rear fog lamp is really a much better idea than front fog lamps. If you're lucky, you can just swap in a set of taillamps from the German version of your car, since then you'd get a rear fog lamp in the left taillamp. A new combination switch and some creative wiring might also be in order.

In other countries they come with them, but a simple switch of the rear lamp housing is not possible, as those with fogs have 3 bulbs while in the US we have 2.

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Hence the creative wiring. It might also involve some body computer reprogramming.

(In my case I'm thinking of disconnecting the driver side/left backup light, as my research notes that regulations say that is the side for fogs, switching to a red bulb, and connecting it to the OE switch location on the center console. Seems like the easiest way to implement it.) I am sorry I digress.

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The pattern emitted by a reversing lamp is too different from that required for a rear fog lamp. The lamp wouldn't have the required performance and might degrade your safety. Also, then using just one reversing lamp to try to see by when backing up might prove difficult. Reversing lamps' primary function is as a warning to other drivers and pedestrians, not as a light to see by. You'll reduce your reversing lamp system's performance by 50% and gain very little protection (if not making things worse) in the fog.