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Aleph info.

Fringe

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Joined
Jan 8, 2006
Messages
996
O.K., so I am pretty stoked. I have a Aleph II stock with 2x123 & 1x123 body coming from the shoppe and Chop as been so nice to make me a custom Aleph I head with an nice configuration to give me good run time and power to go with my 1x123 body. I think I have a pretty good starter kit with the Aleph so far. It did cost alot, but I believe after owning a PD, that it will be so worth it. The light formats by the Don are a thing of amazing beauty and irreplacable functionality. I just believe they cannot be beat, so thanks Don, for giving me another passion and thanks to everyone that has offered their help, specifically bernie and Chop.
 

Ned-L

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Nov 3, 2005
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Fringe said:
O.K., so I am pretty stoked. I have a Aleph II stock with 2x123 & 1x123 body coming from the shoppe and Chop as been so nice to make me a custom Aleph I head with an nice configuration to give me good run time and power to go with my 1x123 body. I think I have a pretty good starter kit with the Aleph so far. It did cost alot, but I believe after owning a PD, that it will be so worth it. The light formats by the Don are a thing of amazing beauty and irreplacable functionality. I just believe they cannot be beat, so thanks Don, for giving me another passion and thanks to everyone that has offered their help, specifically bernie and Chop.
Fringe,

Glad to hear you were able to decide on what to get. Especially as you got a 1 cell and 2 cell body, I am really curious what LE you are getting and what batteries you will be running it with in each configuration? And what tailcap did you go with? Do you agree that the process of researching, reading posts, and asking people like Bernie and Chop for advice is almost as much fun as having the light?

Ned
 

Chop

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Ned,

I hope I'm not speaking out of line, but Fringe opted for a NexGen500/TXOJ light engine. This will allow him to run either of his Aleph heads on his 1X123 body. We also decided to go with a 10 ohm resistor PCB for the low mode. I think that Fringe just took my word on this and we'll have to see how happy he is with it.

As for the amount of fun that he had...he'll have to answer that.
 

Ned-L

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Messages
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Location
Florida
Thanks. I still have a lot to learn. I knew from reading that some LEs did not work with a 1 cell light so I was curious which would work with a 1 or 2 cell. By the way, I was conversing with CroMAGnet about the Aleph19, TXOH, McR19, Wiz2 520ma, 7.5 ohm FT that I just purchased from tntsl, who bought it from arewethereyetdad who bought it from Billson (in case it helps answer my question) and he was wondering what light engine it had. I know I have read that the Wiz2 is a converter, but I don't know what the various electronics are that go into an Aleph. Do you know enough from this to enlighten me a little?
Thanks,
Ned
Chop said:
Ned,

I hope I'm not speaking out of line, but Fringe opted for a NexGen500/TXOJ light engine. This will allow him to run either of his Aleph heads on his 1X123 body. We also decided to go with a 10 ohm resistor PCB for the low mode. I think that Fringe just took my word on this and we'll have to see how happy he is with it.

As for the amount of fun that he had...he'll have to answer that.
 

Beamhead

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Jul 6, 2004
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gone "Squatchin" :p
Chop said:
Ned,

I hope I'm not speaking out of line, but Fringe opted for a NexGen500/TXOJ light engine. This will allow him to run either of his Aleph heads on his 1X123 body. We also decided to go with a 10 ohm resistor PCB for the low mode. I think that Fringe just took my word on this and we'll have to see how happy he is with it.

As for the amount of fun that he had...he'll have to answer that.

Excellent choice IMHO.:p
 

Chop

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I hope I'm answering the right question and correctly. I've been out of circulation for a while and much of this information is of the "use it or loose it" variety.

Regarding the Wiz2, it is what is called a buck/boost converter. What this means is that in cases where the voltage of the power supply exceeds the forward voltage (Vf) of the luxeon, the converter will reduce (buck) the voltage that actually gets to the luxeon. In cases where the voltage of the power supply is less than the Vf of the luxeon, the converter will boost the voltage to that needed to run the luxeon at the desired current level.

On it's face, this sounds as though it is the best way to go, but there are always buts. The Wiz2, like all other converters, has its limitations. Some of these include the fact that it's operating voltage range is from about 2.5v to 6v. If the power supply voltage drops below around 2.5v, the light will fall out of regulation. If the voltage of the power supply exceeds 6v, you'll likely fry something.

The upside of running the Wiz2 converter is that you can use your choice of a single primary 123, a single 3.7v li-ion cell, or 2X123. The 2.5v cut off also serves as sort of a protection against over discharging unprotected li-ion cells.

The downside of running a Wiz2 converter is that it generates more heat than either the NexGen (boost converter) or Downboy (buck converter). Another downside is that when running this converter with a single primary cell (in a single cell light), the 2.5v cut off means that the light will fall out of regulation long before the battery is really dead, so you're kind of wasting half of your battery. I say this because the converter depends on the voltage of the battery under load, and when you put a load on a primary 123, the voltage drops around 1/2v (usually).

Where the Wiz2 really shines is when you intend to use li-ion cells as your primary power source, especially unprotected cells.

You just have to keep in mind that there are always more tradeoffs when you are striving to attain maximum flexibility.

I, personally, find it best to dedicate a setup to a particular use (or power source) and build around that. I usually like to use either a downboy or nexgen, unless maximum flexibility is needed or li-ion cells will be used almost exclusively.

Now, this may be more information than you asked for, but...

I usually use the NexGen converter in single cell lights, whether they are going to be used with primary cells or li-ion cells. I've found that the nexgen performs very well in single cell lights. Just remember that with a boost converter, you CANNOT run two lithium cells. When using a boost converter, the voltage of the power source under load, plus the voltage overhead tolerance of the converter CANNOT exceed the Vf of the luxeon being used. What this means in practical terms is that you can use a NexGen converter in single cell lights running a luxeon with a Vf of J or better with a bias of 667mA or so or greater and feed it with either a single 123 or li-ion cell. If you aren't going to use li-ions, the Vf of the luxeon or the bias (current level) are almost immaterial. The reasons that I prefer the NexGen in this confirguration are that the NexGen produces no noticeable heat and it will suck a battery pratically dry, which is a plus when you're using relatively expensive lithium 123 cells.

The downboy converter is a buck converter and I know that it is good with power supplies up to 12v (probably beyond, but I've never had the need). This is a great converter. It produces very little heat and is efficient. You'll get super long runtimes (usually) in lights running at a reasonable current level. The downside is that lights using this converter are usually larger multi cell lights.

All of the above assumes the use of a Lux I or III.

You will likely also see many references to Vf. As a practical matter the Vf of the luxeon will have little to no impact on the performance of a regulated light. Where it does make a difference is in runtime. If I had to guesstimate, I'd say that in a two cell (6v) light configuration, you loose roughly ( and I do mean roughly) 10 minutes of runtime everytime you go up a step in Vf. If you used an H Vf luxeon as a standard and you got 1 hour of runtime, then going with a J Vf luxeon will only get you 50 minutes, going with a K Vf will get you 40 minutes, etc.
 

Chop

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Oh, as for the resistance of the two stage switch.

When running a NexGen either 10 or 15 ohms usually works well. With a Wiz2, I believe I was using 7.5 ohms for li-ion cells and 4 ohms for primary cells. With the DownBoy, 60 ohms is about perfect.
 

Ned-L

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Nov 3, 2005
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Tony,
Thanks for the tutorial. I really appreciate you sharing your knowledge in so much detail. So, and this may be a dumb question, what is the difference between a light engine and a converter? For the Aleph19, TXOH, McR19, Wiz2 520ma, 7.5 ohm FT that I just purchased, how much current does it draw? Will it perform differently on an unprotected 17670 (which I plan on purchasing from) versus 2x123 primaries? Thanks.
Ned
 

Chop

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The actual Wiz2 is the converter. The light engine consists of the luxeon, heatsink, ecan (converter housing), and the converter. I believe that the term "light engine" was coined to name the assembly. Besides, it's what makes the Alephs "go," so I guess it's appropriate.

The amount of current that you light draws from the battery(ies) will depend on what battery configuration you use. The lower the input voltage the more current the converter will draw from the battery; however, regardless of the battery configuration used, the luxeon will always get a regulated 520mA. The light really won't perform differently with the different battery configurations in the sense that it won't be any more or less bright as you change types of power source. What will be different is the amount of runtime that you will get. Of course, a single 123 will give you the least, with a single li-ion cell giving more. The 2X123 will give you the most.

As I side note, I know that many are using bare (unprotected) li-ion cells, but since you are relatively new to the scene, I would highly recommend that you do some research and read up on their use. The dangers associated with unprotected cells can range from simply killing your cells, due to over discharge, to having one of them blow up, due to over charging.

I've been messing with flashlights for a little while now and have seen them grow increasingly complex, as far as hobbies go. From my perspective, there is enough to worry about without having to worry about your rechargeables. I know that the bare cells are less expensive than the protected cells, but the additional cost of the protected cells is justified by the piece of mind that comes along with the added cost.

I also have to add that it's nice to be able to run the protected li-ion cells in lights that have converters other than Wiz2s without having to worry about the overdischarging them.
 

Fringe

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Jan 8, 2006
Messages
996
Tony,

Thanks for speaking for me to answer Ned's question. I feel like you are my Aleph agent.

Ned,

I plan on running primary 123's with my Aleph, as I don't know about much else yet. When I bought my TK Aleph II, 2x123 from the shoppe, which has a DB917 with 60 ohms, I picked up a 1x123 body and extra 60ohm flat top McE2s. My original thought was to put the flat top with my Aleph II 2x123 configuration and take the stock McE2s switch, wich I believe is flared and pair that with the 1x123 and whatever Aleph head and engine I had built for that, but after the purchase, I found out that the ohms were to much to drive that configuration, so Chop, being the man that he is, made me an additional PCB board ratted at 10ohms to switch out and properly drive the 1x123 configuration. This is good cause now I have an etra PCB board so I can swap them out and run the higher ohms on my Surefire E2e/Kl1 set up and have the joy of a two stage. (I hope I am correct with this) Not to mention being able to swap out the heads and engines, thoughtfully, and have the different Aleph cofigurations! Ned, you are right, I have learned so much in this short, but fun journey. It is exciiting to know all that goes into these spectacular flashlights and the people behind them. I have gone to snearing at my buddies Inova lithium 2 cell a few years ago, because it and the batteries were expensive, to PDs and Alephs, and now I am about to buy that same friend a PD for his 40th birthday and welcome him to the awesome world of custom lights. Funny huh.
 

Chop

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Fringe,

Since you are relatively new to the flexibility of the Aleph system, I just want to caution you. The electronics inside of these flashlights are sensitive to input voltage.

If you mistakenly put the Downboy based light engine on top of the 1X123 body and run it, nothing bad will happen, except that you won't get bright light;however, if you mistakenly put the NexGen based light engine on top of the 2X123 body and apply 6v of power to it, the results could be catastrophic to the light engine. The light engine that I am sending you is clear marked "NG500/TXOJ."

You might want to devise a system or implement a practice that will help to avoid this confusion from happening.
 

Fringe

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Jan 8, 2006
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996
Tony,

Thanks for the heads up. I do understand this and will devise a system to keep me from running the smaller engine on the larger, more powerful body. When I first started, I was not aware of this, until Don told me. But thanks again for the fair warning and I am glad the engine will be clearly marked.

Look forward to getting it.
 

Kiessling

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Nov 26, 2002
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Having marked LEs is really important IMHO, as it can get quite confusing when you have more than a few ... :green: ... and doing the "blind test" is costly with LEs ... :D

Tony ... back on full throttle! :wave: :thumbsup:

bernie
 

Fringe

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Jan 8, 2006
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996
Chop or bernie,

I just got my Aleph II from the shoppe and it is nice, but I am having trouble with getting it to work. Everytime I take the McE2s switch off and replace it, it does not want to operate, then when I take it off and the switch itself comes out from its housing the light fires up when the metal on the side of the switch comes in contact with the metal of the light. It just seems to be real finicky. I had it working fine, but I went to play with it and remove the tail, and now I cannot get it to operate. Any suggestions?
 

Kiessling

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To much or too sticky lube on the switch or in the switch or battery tube?
Dirty contacts?
Switch jamming in the plastic boot?

Please describe your problem in a more detailed manner and name the switch ... is it a standard or hair trigger version?

Also ... have a look at the McGizmo General Info and FAQ sticky ... there are links to a lot of McE2S threads including those with troubleshooting the switch.

bernie
 

Fringe

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Jan 8, 2006
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996
Bernie,

I have two 60ohm switches and now neither one works in the 2x123 body, but they work fine on my surefire E2e with KL1. I cleaned everything real well and still nothing. I am wondering if there is a defect with the 2x123 body?
 

Kiessling

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What LE is in the 2x123 body?
Does the light work with another switch, like a SF Z57 or such? If not, you might experience a contact problem of the LE with the body which happens when the LE is screwed too far in the head.
Battery check?

bernie
 

Fringe

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Jan 8, 2006
Messages
996
Bernie, I love you. I loosened the light engine, DB917, and wola, it is working like a charm.

Thanks buddy!

Tim
 
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