Charging battery - serious venting incident

[johns]

Just want to give you guys a warning - might have been discussed here in the past.
I have an EDC Ultimate 60 that I bought with a charger and the MP rechargable batteries. I use it mainly when on vacation and walking the dogs at night -don't want to step in anything while walking them at the motel dog walk areas. Hadn't used it for a while and tried it only to find that the battery was dead. I had an extra battery with me, so I put it in and put the dead one in the charger.
Went to bed and woke up a couple hours later to see orange sparks shooting across the motel room followed by the smoke detector
The room filled with smoke pretty quickly as I unplugged the charger and threw it out the door. The battery was glowing red and the plastic charger had melted a bit.
Luckily the motel clerk had the room next to ours open and we were able to switch rooms. My wife and I were both blowing black soot out of noses and carrying the smell of burnt plastic for the next few hours.
She has informed me that I will no longer be charging batteries in the house

 

[1996alnl]

Re: Battery charging warning

Wow,i'm glad you and your wife are ok,that could of been tragic.
I use rechargables in all my lights,RCR123's,LifePo4,18650's etc..never had a problem.,however i've never charged any of them overnight as it only takes about 2-3 hrs to charge these cells besides i wouldn't be comfortable with it.
I'm not at all familiar with your kit,but you can tell your wife that charging these batteries are about as safe as charging a cell phone.
It's cheaper and environmentaly friendly.
I haven't bought disposable batteries for anything in my house (including my remotes) in about a year.

 

[AndyTiedye]

Re: Battery charging warning

Is "MP" the brand name of the batteries?
It would be useful to know what kind of charger it was.

 

[Federal LG]

Re: Battery charging warning

What kind of battery ?? AA ? CR123 ??

Which brand ?

 

[Sgt. LED]

Re: Battery charging warning

Yeah give the details on what to avoid!


Don't sleep while recharging, I am writing that one down.

 

[Oznog]

Re: Battery charging warning

I warned you, but you forgot the most important rule: Never, EVER feed them after midnight.

 

[Sgt. LED]

Re: Battery charging warning



RETRO!

 

[kramer5150]

Re: Battery charging warning

Never fall asleep while charging lithium-Ion cells... overnight charging is a no-no. One of the things I like about the 16340 cell is that it "only" needs about ~60 minutes to recharge, considerably less if you are merely topping them off after sporadic use during the day. So its relatively painless to monitor them while charging... IMHO.

The higher capacity 18650/17630 cells need ~4-5 hours to recharge, which almost requires you to recharge overnight or unattended.

 

[Juggernaut]

Re: Battery charging warning

I charge my 18650 batteries over night just because that DSD charger is as slow as dial-up. though I charge mine in a steel lock box taped to heavy gage plate of stainless steel on the floor. If it goes well I just hope it doesn't set off the fire detector. I posted a pick in my resent 18650 thread, but I need to overkill that thing so I'll post pictures of it later. Who was it that charges batteries inside of a dead dryer:thinking:? I've seen pictures on here somewhere:shrug:.

 

[johns]

Re: Battery charging warning

CR 123 batteries - just say MP (I think they were supposed to be protected). I'm on vacation right now, but I'll check when I get home to see what the brand of charger is. I have another one that does a little higher output, from the same manufacturer. Its made of plastic and holds 2 cr 123s. Its not the DSD - I have one of them as well. Tried searching the net for 1 just now, but can't find it. I think I bought my EDC direct and got the batteries and charger as a package deal.
Just did some more searching - I see one on the battery junction website that IS NOT THE SAME ONE - but about the same size and shape except that mine was black plastic - not grey.

 

[DM51]

Re: Battery charging warning

I am glad to hear you seem to be right - however, if you have inhaled any of that smoke, which by the sound of it you have, you ought to see a doctor as soon as possible.

It is important to post full details of incidents of this type, so that other members can learn from them. It would be a help if you could post the exact brand name of the cell and charger, and any photographs you may have of the aftermath of this incident.

This thread belongs in the Batteries section, so I'll move it there now.

 

[Fallingwater]

Re: Battery charging warning

CR 123 batteries - just say MP (I think they were supposed to be protected)

Waitwaitwait. CR123, or RCR123?
You didn't try to charge a primary, did you?

 

[Black Rose]

His original post says "MP rechargable batteries".

 

[SilverFox]

Re: Battery charging warning

Hello Johns,

MP is a pretty decent R-CR123 Li-Ion unprotected cell. I have a few of them and think they work very well.

The problem with Li-Ion cells is that when they are over discharged, the chemistry changes inside the cell. When you go to charge the cell, the damage done during over discharging can result in what you experienced. Unprotected cells allow you to run the cell all the way flat, but I believe the Ultimate series of lights is supposed to shut off prior to over discharging the battery.

If you haven't used the light in awhile, it is possible that there was a parasitic draw on the cell from the light, and this allowed the cell to become over discharged. In the future, when you store your light, you may want to remove the cell from it before storage.

As others have already mentioned, don't charge Li-Ion cells unattended. Most of the problems with these cells occur during charging, so you should pay attention to what is going on during that time.

The fumes released while these cells burn can be dangerous, but the cell is small, and if the room was reasonably sized you, and your wife, may have only had a small exposure. Pay attention to your health and it wouldn't hurt to talk to your family doctor to have an idea of what adverse effects to watch for.

Tom

 

[Fallingwater]

His original post says "MP rechargable batteries".

It wouldn't be the first post that says "rechargeable" when they are really primaries. Still, if silverfox says they are RCR, then that's probably what they are.

 

[45/70]

Yes, MP's are RCR. They have been around since way before the various "xxxxFire" RCR's and are a very reputable brand. I am not aware of MP ever offering a protected cell, however.

A bit OT, but it bugs me how many people think that by having lithium primaries in their front pocket, they are "Safe". I know of no incidents where a Li-Ion cell has "exploded/vented with flame" in one's pocket. There are however, many incidents where primaries have, at least, come close to doing this. I'm not saying that it's not possible for this to happen with a Li-Ion, but lets just say that it is much more likely to happen with a primary.

On the other hand, I don't understand why, as many references as there are on the forums about Li-Ion's "exploding/venting with flame" while charging, and the reasons why this happens, seem to be largely unnoticed.

A very simple safety consideration:


Lithium primary = Danger in your pocket

Li-Ion = Danger when charging (but not nearly as much as charging a primary ).


In either case, instances are rare, and good quality cells make a difference in safety level.

johns, glad you and your Wife are OK! :thumbsup:

Dave

 

[Fallingwater]

On the other hand, I don't understand why, as many references as there are on the forums about Li-Ion's "exploding/venting with flame" while charging, and the reasons why this happens, seem to be largely unnoticed.

From what I've read, it happens much more rarely. Though if you add to the equation high-current LiPo cells, then all bets are off...

 

[johns]

Sorry for the confusion about the batteries - they are rechargeables.
I have the charger and remains of the battery in the back of my truck (for now) they are in a plastic bag and the smell coming from it is awful. I'll try to take a picture of them and post it when I get a chance. Leaving early in the morning to drive down to the Keys (for a couple days), so it will be a couple days before I can post them.
I had charged both of the batteries I had for that light a month or so ago and was supprised that the one in the flashlight was dead as I hadn't used it since last charging the battery.
Actually I'm glad that it happened in that hotel room and not in my newly remodeled condo or back at my home. I'm sure that it will take some serious cleaning to get that smell out of that motel room. Hoping that they don't decide to add a cleaning charge to my credit card bill:shakehead

 

[mikespike2]

Please do post up photos.. and what brand was the charger?

 

[LEDcandle]

If they were unprotected cells, like Silverfox said, yes, this might happen when they are over-discharged and put to charge again after that.

I've had a couple of unprotected cells that were over-discharged and when I put them into the charger juz to see if they could be brought back to life, they got hot within a minute. Fortunately, I predicted this would happen and I was standying by the charger and touching the battery to monitor it realtime.

Since then, I throw out any li-on that seems potentially bad.