Dammit, I should have entered raffles to buy L0-Ti from many dealers...

[jeffb]

Seems that for many. it's pricing gouging and poor spirit; If I (or you if you're "I"!!)do it it's capitalism? The market will dictate what price is paid and in our society, we refer to "supply and demand".

I believe that we have tremendous opportunity to be prosperous and I am thrilled if others are, even if I'm not., today. Also know that giving is much more satisfying than receiving.

just my pennies worth and it's not worth that.

jeffb

 

[Handlobraesing]

Forgive my eBay illiteracy but can someone explain to me if I'm seeing this correctly:
gromit28387( 0 ) US $170.00 Dec-26-06 15:04:45 PST
gromit28387( 0 ) US $160.00 Dec-26-06 15:03:50 PST
gromit28387( 0 ) US $150.00 Dec-26-06 15:03:22 PST
gromit28387( 0 ) US $145.00 Dec-26-06 15:03:04 PST
gromit28387( 0 ) US $135.00 Dec-26-06 15:02:42 PST
gromit28387( 0 ) US $125.00 Dec-25-06 19:28:04 PST

To me that looks like they were outbidding themselves ????? Up $35 in 2 minutes with no other bidders interspersed????

That guy's been registered on eBay for 3+ years and it's just suspicious he still has no feedback. Such account is often created for use for shill bidding(such as in family member's name, employee's personal account, etc) The pattern you're seeing is quite typical of a shill bidder, either using a secondary account or collusion between two or more users.

On eBay, if starting bid is $9.99 and someone bids $50.00, the price stays $9.99 for that bidder. If a second bidder bids for $25.00, the price goes up to $25.00. The winning bidder will pay the price the next lowest bidder has bidded for.

The "maximum bid" amount placed by a buyer is not available to anyone but the bidder himself until it is surpassed, then it becomes public. What shillers do is repeatedly bid in a small increment until the bid price is surpassed, or desired price is reached, whichever comes first.

The shill bidder risks winning the item himself if he bids way above the maximum bid of the next lowest bidder, but if that bidder had bidded $50 and he's only surpassed by a little, he'll raise the bid amount again to maintain his winning status.

As an avid eBay buyer, this kind of practice really **** me off. If you're a bidder and you see this sort of activity on an item you're bidding on from someone especially a well aged, extremely low feedback eBay account, I suggest you retract your bid as there's a good chance the seller is artificially inflating the price.

 

[Handlobraesing]

I used to really want one of these titanium Fenix lights. But, after seeing all the unabashed profiteering by several who were fortunate enough to be able to buy one these lights at a normal price, I'm no longer interested. It's clear to me that more than a few folks bought these lights with the sole intent of making a few fast bucks off the backs of other CPF members with a quick resale. Some community $pirit huh?

eBay =! just fellow CPF members. My personal opinion was that this was also deliberate on Fenix' part. From the L0-Ti thread, it was stated that Fenix made a rule that raffle was to be done in PUBLIC, and the release itself was a limited edition. Artifical scarcity known as "limited edition" is a common technique used to raise demand to supply ratio and to increase gossip.

 

[thelightdude]

Great advice.

As an avid eBay buyer, this kind of practice really **** me off. If you're a bidder and you see this sort of activity on an item you're bidding on from someone especially a well aged, extremely low feedback eBay account, I suggest you retract your bid as there's a good chance the seller is artificially inflating the price.

 

[4sevens]

eBay =! just fellow CPF members. My personal opinion was that this was also deliberate on Fenix' part. From the L0-Ti thread, it was stated that Fenix made a rule that raffle was to be done in PUBLIC, and the release itself was a limited edition. Artifical scarcity known as "limited edition" is a common technique used to raise demand to supply ratio and to increase gossip.

Handy, you need to get your facts straight before you post. That and you
need to present the WHOLE picture. Anything short of that makes you look
ignorant.

As stated by Fenix, "Limited edition" means there were a limited number of units
made and that it is not a regular production item. Only 250 serialized units
were made.

That was stated from the very beginning before a single unit was sold.
Of course it was deliberate, but it was not deceptive as you seem to imply.
It is not "artificial scarcity" as you say rather it is ACTUAL scarcity.

The only rule that was requested of the dealers was to sell them for no more
than $100 not including shipping. What folks choose to sell for on the
secondary market is up to the seller and dictated by the market. For all I
care, anything sold on ebay is pretty much second hand. I doubt that seller
is a dealer, and if he is a dealer then he's violating his agreements - but thats
not for you to stick your nose in.

Secondly, you are wrong about the raffle. Fenix never made a rule that these
were to be sold by means of raffling. Sorry but that was your ASSUMPTION.
That was the route that Fenix-store.com (one of many dealers) chose to
take with permission from the CPF staff.

 

[whippoorwill]

We don't have to buy anything from these dealers, Ebay sellers or anyone. It is a conscious decision on our part to whip out the old credit card and spend away. I looked at the L0-Ti and said 'no way'. Never crossed my mind to accuse anyone of anything. Smart marketing on the part of Fenix, that's all. But this is done every day by every company out there.

Basic Economics 101, folks. Supply and demand. The law of diminishing marginal utility might blow your mind!

 

[mcmc]

Handlo, just report it to eBay then. sheesh.

 

[Handlobraesing]

Handlo, just report it to eBay then. sheesh.

Someone asked what these repeated bids mean, so I explained what's behind it. I could report it to eBay, but that doesn't help the guy with the question.

 

[tron3]

The one user gromit28387

( 0 )

bid 7 times and yet has no feedback. I also suspect shill bidding going on to raise the price.

The bid before his was $76, then gomit bid $100. The whole thing is suspicious. Without his bidding you can take off about $55 from the auction.

In my eyes, my LO-Ti is now worth about $200. Not the $260 selling price.

 

[ViReN]

what is so special about L0-Ti... it doesnt even have a Cree! :sigh: or (i m not sure f it has) Digitally controlled levels...... just another Ti light let it go Handy...

there will be better lights in market... lot cheaper than that ebay thingy...

 

[EngrPaul]

Yeah, and what's so special about those old 50's cars people keep spending all kinds of money on? Everybody knows newer cars are more efficient!

 

[ViReN]

Yeah, and what's so special about those old 50's cars people keep spending all kinds of money on? Everybody knows newer cars are more efficient!

:huh:

 

[BrightGal]

"price gouging?" I think that's a relative term. I mean, after all, it's not gasoline.

If you are suggesting that price gouging is somehow related to or limited to gasoline, I don't get the connection.

The point was that dealers can mark things up 300% or more and nobody thinks anything of it, but when somebody makes five bucks in B/S/T or on Ebay some folks go "oh me oh my whatever happened to CPF spirit/community/cult/bbq/flashlight of the month club.." or whatever and such.

Dealers are in business to make a profit. They must mark up their merchandise and make a profit or their business will fail. If they price their merchandise too high, customers will go elsewhere. I have no problem with dealers selling things to make a buck; it's literally their business. And, as I said in my previous post, I know of no dealers selling the L0 Ti at higher than the Fenix directed price of $100 plus shipping.

Just strikes me as naive. I think the CPF spirit is the sharing of knowledge regarding flashlights and electronics. That's what this sight should be and IS about to me.

If somebody happens to make money on their L0P-Ti, I say good for them. If you don't like it, too bad I guess.

With respect to members at large, and not dealers, I agree with you. You state sharing of knowledge regarding flashlights and electronics is what CPF should be about. If this is so, why then should a CPF member who is not a dealer expect to make a profit off a light sold to another CPF member? You seem to think that is quite alright; I simply do not as it's not in the spirit of what CPF should be.

 

[greenLED]

why then should a CPF member who is not a dealer expect to make a profit off a light sold to another CPF member? You seem to think that is quite alright; I simply do not as it's not in the spirit of what CPF should be.

These type of threads seem to be a recurrent topic on CPF. I'm "Mr. Community Dude" on CPF, but if the market allows a fellow CPF'er to make a profit, I have absolutely no problem with that.

The market will dictate whether the asking price is a fair one (which can only be determined between the buyer and seller, not by us on the sidelines). As I said before, vote with your wallet and move on.

 

[BrightGal]

GreenLED, you and I simply disagree on this. It's no big deal though.