My son just sent me small box of Surefire 123's he obtained from the PD (roughly 30 pieces). Some are new but most have been used for a very short time only but none are marked as such. I hope to use them in my 2 and 3 cell lights but I have no way of telling the condition of each battery except for a volt meter. Is it feasible to test each battery and use the ones closest to each other in voltage? Eventhough the batteries were free, I still would not like to junk them if unable to use in multi cell lights.
Determination of Used 123's
- Thread starter Reaper
- Start date
Black Rose
Flashlight Enthusiast
I don't know 100% if this is the correct way, but this is what I do.
I test their open circuit voltage to attempt to get matched pairs and then use the battery test function on my DMM to see what voltage they give under load.
zenlunatic
Newly Enlightened
- Joined
- Apr 3, 2008
- Messages
- 112
I wouldnt recommend using them in multi-cell lights. I personally would not. You can also use a ZTS mini tester to see the remaining capacity of each cell.
Kestrel
Flashaholic
I would very much recommend reading this recent thread, which also has some links off of it that are also interesting reading.
Even after being very familiar with the links in that thread, I would not risk using these in multi-celled lights, unless I was 100% sure that I could ascertain their exact state of charge.
Besides the main accident link which was linked off the thread above, there is also a SF G2 thread (somewhere on CPF) where the tailclap was blown through a cupboard door like a projectile, where mismatched cells were considered to be the most likely culprit. It included some cool pics.
There are now some very very good single-CR123 LED lights - I use a SF L1 for my mixed-state CR123's.
Even after being very familiar with the links in that thread, I would not risk using these in multi-celled lights, unless I was 100% sure that I could ascertain their exact state of charge.
Besides the main accident link which was linked off the thread above, there is also a SF G2 thread (somewhere on CPF) where the tailclap was blown through a cupboard door like a projectile, where mismatched cells were considered to be the most likely culprit. It included some cool pics.
There are now some very very good single-CR123 LED lights - I use a SF L1 for my mixed-state CR123's.
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I had been thinking about a ZTS meter on and off for a long time but for me it would not be cost effective. It'll be used only for 123's and I only go thru maybe 5 batteries every 1 1/2 to 2 years. This amount of 30 batteries would last me 6 or more years if they were all new. If the ZTS matched up these batteries in 2 and 3 units then that's it, the ZTS would sit in a corner somewhere for years on end. I can go down to Surefire and get a box of 123's for less than the cost of the ZTS Mini but then these slightly used batteries would just be sitting there getting wasted away. The only 1 battery unit I had was a Milky L1 that I loaned to my son a while back so I considered that gone for now.
I hate the thought of good batteries going to waste and not being used. Call me cheap.
Thanks Kestrel, I'm going to read that link now.
I hate the thought of good batteries going to waste and not being used. Call me cheap.
Thanks Kestrel, I'm going to read that link now.
Kestrel
Flashaholic
I'm sorta in the same boat as you - I have a sizeable quantity of partly-used CR123's that I got for free. Therefore, guilt-free lumens in my SF L1 (Cree) EDC. (I also gave a bunch of them away to four friends who have SF L1's.)
My 'technique' (if you could call it that) to test those cells, BTW: I drop each one into my SF L1 and try to get the 'high' mode - threw away maybe 5-10% of the cells that couldn't run the L1 on 'high'. Very expedient.
If you gave your old L1 to your son I'll bet you could use another. :devil:
Edit: And for my 2x CR123 & 3x CR123 lights, that's why I have 1x18650, 2x17500, and 2x18500 LiIon configurations - those are the ones that get the heavy use anyway.
My 'technique' (if you could call it that) to test those cells, BTW: I drop each one into my SF L1 and try to get the 'high' mode - threw away maybe 5-10% of the cells that couldn't run the L1 on 'high'. Very expedient.
If you gave your old L1 to your son I'll bet you could use another. :devil:
Edit: And for my 2x CR123 & 3x CR123 lights, that's why I have 1x18650, 2x17500, and 2x18500 LiIon configurations - those are the ones that get the heavy use anyway.
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I "could" ask my son for the Milky L1 back but it would seem like "Indian Giver" thing but he works as an electrician in SF and I figure that he could use a better light than the cheap lights he has. Right now my EDC (and everything else) light is my Malkoff MD2 / M61 with a 6P running a Malkoff (what else) M60L 3 x 123 as a back-up in case I need longer run-time. I know that these lights might be considered a bit on the heavy side by some but not for me. I only run bright, fairly long lasting lights on primary batteries (Surefire) since my '89 SF quake now.
Battery Guy
Enlightened
I will add to the chorus of people who are saying to not use these cells in a multi-cell pack.
I recently worked on a project where we need to determine the SOC of lithium-MnO2 cells (which is what you have) that had been used for an unknown amount of time. The problem is that below about 95% SOC, the OCV value is very constant, so the difference between an OCV of 3.00V and 2.95V can correspond to a large difference in capacity.
If you were absolutely determined to do this, then I would recommend that you find a new cell from the same manufacturer (and preferably a similar age), and create an OCV vs SOC plot. Basically, discharge to 95%, let the cell rest a day, measure OCV, discharge to 90%, let the cell rest a day, measure OCV, repeat as necessary. You can then use this plot to estimate the SOC of your unknown cells based on OCV.
Cheers,
Battery Guy
I recently worked on a project where we need to determine the SOC of lithium-MnO2 cells (which is what you have) that had been used for an unknown amount of time. The problem is that below about 95% SOC, the OCV value is very constant, so the difference between an OCV of 3.00V and 2.95V can correspond to a large difference in capacity.
If you were absolutely determined to do this, then I would recommend that you find a new cell from the same manufacturer (and preferably a similar age), and create an OCV vs SOC plot. Basically, discharge to 95%, let the cell rest a day, measure OCV, discharge to 90%, let the cell rest a day, measure OCV, repeat as necessary. You can then use this plot to estimate the SOC of your unknown cells based on OCV.
Cheers,
Battery Guy
mdocod
Flashaholic
Open circuit voltage can be very misleading on CR123 primary cells. If I understand correctly, it's actually possible for a recently slightly used cell to measure higher voltage than a cell that has never been used but may have been sitting for several years since manufacture date.
Mixing CR123 batteries in different states of charge was eventually proven to be a way to stimulate a vent-with-flame event. It's not just a fluke type of thing that might happen. The proper differential in states of charge of the cells produces repeatable results. A cell venting.
Eric
Mixing CR123 batteries in different states of charge was eventually proven to be a way to stimulate a vent-with-flame event. It's not just a fluke type of thing that might happen. The proper differential in states of charge of the cells produces repeatable results. A cell venting.
Eric
Not an issue if you were planning to use them in a single-cell ight such as an L1 or a Ra Clicky.
I hate to waste CR123 cells as well. I use my lights on a regular basis. But still rare for me to go through a case in a year.
Cheap isn't the word. None of us want to read a future topic about how your favorite multi-cell light exploded in your hand. Think of the cost of replacing that light, the bill from the Emergency room, or worse . . . Your wife demanding that you sell off your lights because she previously had no clue that they could explode!
You'll end up saving more money in the long run.
I hate to waste CR123 cells as well. I use my lights on a regular basis. But still rare for me to go through a case in a year.
Cheap isn't the word. None of us want to read a future topic about how your favorite multi-cell light exploded in your hand. Think of the cost of replacing that light, the bill from the Emergency room, or worse . . . Your wife demanding that you sell off your lights because she previously had no clue that they could explode!
You'll end up saving more money in the long run.
Thanks everyone for the info. on multi-battery set-ups. Not taking a chance of anything going "bang or boom" so it's off to one cell usage. I just got a M30F so it'll be perfect for my 6P with one cell + a dummy or 2xAA's with the A19 extender. 30 slightly used plus the new Surefire's I have means I'm good for a long long long time. THEN I'll start on the AA's.
Life is good
Note: If my wife is worried about anything going "boom" it is definately not going to be about
batteries, it's going to be about all the reloading powder I have - Heh heh heh
Life is good
Note: If my wife is worried about anything going "boom" it is definately not going to be about
batteries, it's going to be about all the reloading powder I have - Heh heh heh
You did tell her that unlike black powder, modern smokeless powder is not an explosive; right. (More like fizzle than boom.)
Also, you made the right decision regarding those cells.
