Dorcy 1AAA Outdoors

[UnknownVT]

[ QUOTE ]
Aten_Imago said:one thing youmay also notice is that the coloration across the beam profile is uneven- with some 'rings' being blueish and others quite neutral. I found that by using the diffusion over the lens, a color blending occurs that reduces the effect of bluish regions, while generally bringing the whole beam into a more useful color balance. Shall we call it Chromatic Blending?

[/ QUOTE ]

I've been waiting for you to post something we discussed in our PMs about diffusing/blending withOUT your diffusion filter (LEE Hampshire 1/8 frost material).

Does that blend the colors too - without any light loss?

If so, that's got to be good news - everyone should badger AI to post his information and comparison before and after beamshots to show the effect (just remember to do the before beamshot first...... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif )

 

[Aten_Imago]

Ok I think you mean about abrading the LED's with fine 3M scrub cloth?
I do that regularly to Luxeon's now- works like a dream. I would do it to the Dorcy but haven't figured out how to get at the LED's and it's my only one. I will do that with & without LEE diffusion beam comparo- and you can bet I'll do the before prior to the After.
[ QUOTE ]
UnknownVT said:
[ QUOTE ]
Aten_Imago said:one thing youmay also notice is that the coloration across the beam profile is uneven- with some 'rings' being blueish and others quite neutral. I found that by using the diffusion over the lens, a color blending occurs that reduces the effect of bluish regions, while generally bringing the whole beam into a more useful color balance. Shall we call it Chromatic Blending?

[/ QUOTE ]

I've been waiting for you to post something we discussed in our PMs about diffusing/blending withOUT your diffusion filter (LEE Hampshire 1/8 frost material).

Does that blend the colors too - without any light loss?

If so, that's got to be good news - everyone should badger AI to post his information and comparison before and after beamshots to show the effect (just remember to do the before beamshot first...... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif )

[/ QUOTE ]

 

[UnknownVT]

[ QUOTE ]
Aten_Imago said:
Ok I think you mean about abrading the LED's with fine 3M scrub cloth?
I do that regularly to Luxeon's now- works like a dream. I would do it to the Dorcy but haven't figured out how to get at the LED's and it's my only one.

[/ QUOTE ]


That's the one.......

It is real easy to get at the LED - one simply UNscrews the head, the LED attached to the circuit board is not fixed to anything.

see pic:

The head is tightly screwed on - but it is relatively easy to unscrew wearing a pair of household rubber gloves
(I promise not to tell anyone about your pink ones /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif )



[ QUOTE ]
Aten_Imago said:I will do that with & without LEE diffusion beam comparo- and you can bet I'll do the before prior to the After.

[/ QUOTE ]

hmmm....... the use of the LEE diffusion filter is REVERSIBLE - so it really doesn't matter about the order of the beamshots -
the abrading of the LED is NOT reversible -
that's why the before beamshot HAS to come first......... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

 

[BillBill]

[ QUOTE ]
UnknownVT said:
[ QUOTE ]
Aten_Imago said:
the abrading of the LED is NOT reversible -
that's why the before beamshot HAS to come first......... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]


Do not try to abrade the LED so that its shape is altered. I've tried that once and a ringy, useless, dim multi-color beam resulted. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif The Dorcy AAA reflector is just not meant to catch much light. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif However if u can diffuse the LED for a more even beam that would be nice. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

 

[Aten_Imago]

OK
I' was really supposed to finish up some evals tonight but couldn't resist doing this quickie test for Vincent and the rest of the Dorcy AAA clan- since I managed to (easily) unscrew the head off my Dorcy AAA- Duh! what took me so long? Anyway, here's the URL to the results. Feel free to grab the whole page or pictures or whatever. No copyrights on this one. Let me know what you think. Basically I over-abraded the LED a tad. A more gently touch would probably have given me something close to B - the Lee filter effect. Still, the heavy blending effect is remarkable and highly usable for around the house. Next one I get will be abraded to about 1/2 of this one. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif
Well, Gotta go to Sleeeeeeeep
like him > /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/sleepy.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink2.gif
=======
UPDATE - Saturday 6/5/04
I just buffed down the over-abarasion on the LED with my polo shirt. Now the beam and brightless look much more like with the LEE 1/8 Hampshire Frost - Yay!
OK Back to evals.... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/sleepy.gif
=========
http://www.imagometrics.com/FLReviews/DrcyTst.htm
====================
[ QUOTE ]
BillBill said:
[ QUOTE ]
UnknownVT said:
[ QUOTE ]
Aten_Imago said:
the abrading of the LED is NOT reversible -
that's why the before beamshot HAS to come first......... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]


Do not try to abrade the LED so that its shape is altered. I've tried that once and a ringy, useless, dim multi-color beam resulted. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif The Dorcy AAA reflector is just not meant to catch much light. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif However if u can diffuse the LED for a more even beam that would be nice. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

 

[UnknownVT]

[ QUOTE ]
Aten_Imago said:couldn't resist doing this quickie test for Vincent and the rest of the Dorcy AAA clan- since I managed to (easily) unscrew the head off my Dorcy AAA
Anyway, here's the URL to the results. http://www.imagometrics.com/FLReviews/DrcyTst.htm

[/ QUOTE ]

You're a good man AI - thank you so much for the test and beamshots.

Now I'm not too sure if there is truly any loss of light from the abraded LED -
Could it possibly be just the light is spread more evenly - ie: the original hot-spot has been diffused and spread over the corona/side-spill - which is noticably brighter than the corona/side-spill of the other beamshots.

The light this way - may not seem as impressive - but I wonder if it is actually better to see by - with more even coverage/flood?

Thoughts?

 

[pedalinbob]

i find that the chrome reflector causes the ringiness.

i pullthe reflector and sand the chrome off. makes the beam very smooth.
you have to press the lens/reflector out. i used a bench vice.

Bob

 

[Moat]

[ QUOTE ]
UnknownVT said:
Now I'm not too sure if there is truly any loss of light from the abraded LED

[/ QUOTE ]

I tend to think there will be a light loss... imagine shining a flashlight thru a frosted window, vs. unfrosted - the side (room) FROM which you are shining the light will be moreso illuminated by the diffuse rearward reflections from the frosted glass, than the un-frosted - light that really "should" be traveling forward towards the target. I believe the LED's die would "see" the same thing looking forward thru the front of the LED's lens/encapsulant.

In effect, shining some of the light back towards the source, as well as nearby areas not able to reflect or refract it back forward and out. (although I used to have a Dorcy 4AAA "Cool Blue" who's reflector was designed to work with a roughly ground 5mm white - I mistakenly polished it to improve its performance, and BLECCHH! Ringy/splotchy yellow and blue - a quick re-scuff, and it was back to a very pure white. The diffusion of scuffing really does mix the colors up nicely!)

I've found that you can polish LEDs back to a mirror finish using a fine metal/plastic polish (I've used Honda's version of Simichrome).

re; your post topic... you're right - single 5mm lights are ideal, IMO, for outdoor, dark-adapted vision use. On a recent motorcycle camping trip, I found that a CMG Infinity Ultra was actually TOO bright for closer (picnic table) tasks - turn that on, and everything peripheral gets DARK! (great for walking around, though). The regular Infinity (or Pak-Lite on low) works much better up close.

As far as the color thing, maybe it has to do with the "greenery" outdoors, and the nearness of spectrum that may be to blueish LEDs - washing out detail, somehow... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thinking.gif

 

[Lurker]

AI, how do the diffusion methods you tried compare to WriteRight film? I used that on my Dorcy AAAs and got good results. Based on you pictures, it seems like my results were as good or maybe even a little better, but it is impossible to judge based on different samples and details that may not photograph perfectly.

Diffusion definitely helps reduce the rings and color blotches. Maybe someday the manufacturers will stop using smooth reflectors all together???

 

[Aten_Imago]

Vincent- It is visibly and measurably dimmer, though yes, some of that 'perception' is caused by some photons spreading away from the hotspot and 'becoming' part of the corona. I took readings across the beam with a FLAT diffuser attachment on the light meter and averaged out the readings.About 15% of the light from the "abraded" LED is 'lost' -probably through repeated bounce back into the LED itself. Like I said- a lighter 'touch' of the abrasion process would have minimized that. It is lovely to look a stuff now, even if I loose the 'focus'- of a hotspot- but it is a perceptually dimmer light. Now I don't really have use for my Super Duper home-made Dorcy AAA bare-bulb attachment (designed for small tent camping). Any takers? PM me your interest in this one-of a kind Dorcy AAA beam modulator-made from a ping-pong ball and some imagination. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
quote]UnknownVT said:
[ QUOTE ]
Aten_Imago said:couldn't resist doing this quickie test for Vincent and the rest of the Dorcy AAA clan- since I managed to (easily) unscrew the head off my Dorcy AAA
Anyway, here's the URL to the results. http://www.imagometrics.com/FLReviews/DrcyTst.htm

[/ QUOTE ]

You're a good man AI - thank you so much for the test and beamshots.

Now I'm not too sure if there is truly any loss of light from the abraded LED -
Could it possibly be just the light is spread more evenly - ie: the original hot-spot has been diffused and spread over the corona/side-spill - which is noticably brighter than the corona/side-spill of the other beamshots.

The light this way - may not seem as impressive - but I wonder if it is actually better to see by - with more even coverage/flood?

Thoughts?

[/ QUOTE ]

 

[UnknownVT]

[ QUOTE ]
Moat5606 said:single 5mm lights are ideal, IMO, for outdoor, dark-adapted vision use. On a recent motorcycle camping trip, I found that a CMG Infinity Ultra was actually TOO bright for closer (picnic table) tasks - turn that on, and everything peripheral gets DARK! (great for walking around, though). The regular Infinity (or Pak-Lite on low) works much better up close.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes that's exactly what I found too - both the Ultra-G (previous EDC) and Dorcy 1AAA (current EDC) are too bright for me to read by, unless the light is held at least about 3ft away.... not that it's impossible to read - but uncomfortable - ie: the lights tend to dazzle.

So for closer tasks I tend to use my keyring EDC the Photon 2 Yellow which least hurts any dark-adaption of my eyes - but still has the ability to see detail clearly.

Whereas the Dorcy 1AAA (and Ultra-G) are great for helping others' reading since the light can be held (by me) at about 4-5 ft away.

....and as I proved to myself - great for outdoors walking in the countryside - to see clearly enough but still allowing the eyes to see into the unlit areas.

As I am finding out brighter is not necessarily always better. There seems to be an optimum level of light and the 5mm white LED seems to give that for outdoors walking - (illuminating about 6-8ft in front) - for me.

Thanks for the input.

 

[Aten_Imago]

WriteRight film? As in the stuff you put on the PDA touch-screen? Nah! Too much light loss. It measures like a LEE 1/2 Hampshire Frost. The result is close to my heavy handed abrasion of the LED. If some one sends me a sample I can post a comparo beamshot.
By the way, stochastic reflector modulation is similar to LED 'frosting' - you'll measurably loose some photons at the expense of a beautifully even beam. I refer especially to the reflector formulation and stippling on the Brinkmann Legend and to an extent the Pelican M6 series. So to get a high value, minimum loss soft flood, I'd execute part of the diffusion on the LED ( say 1/4 strength) and the rest though the use of a stochastic reflector. That should result in a somewhat distinct hotspot- blending exponentially into a broad corona. Another trick I lucked on to is to pierce my diffusion filter with a round hole to allow more light to penetrate the diffuser in the center. It works well! (I used this method on a Vortex TC-1 using a 1/8" paper punch to 'drill' the hole out of a piece of LEE 1/8 Hampshire Frost
[ QUOTE ]
Lurker said:
AI, how do the diffusion methods you tried compare to WriteRight film? I used that on my Dorcy AAAs and got good results. Based on you pictures, it seems like my results were as good or maybe even a little better, but it is impossible to judge based on different samples and details that may not photograph perfectly.

Diffusion definitely helps reduce the rings and color blotches. Maybe someday the manufacturers will stop using smooth reflectors all together???

[/ QUOTE ]

 

[Moat]

[ QUOTE ]
UnknownVT said:
So for closer tasks I tend to use my keyring EDC the Photon 2 Yellow

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd guess the dimmable Photon Freedom would be an excellent choice, as well. One of my future hopes for a camping light would be Freedom-like dimmer capability in an Infinity/ArcAA-like package. That'd be /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif , IMHO!!

FWIW, satin Scotch tape on the Dorcy's lens does a pretty good job of beam smoothing (with some light loss, of course), and I've managed to color-correct the bluish beam on mine with a bit of yellow highlighter/magic marker on top of that - although by then the lumen loss was un-acceptable, and the highlighter would rub away in use. Kind of an interesting experiment, though.

 

[Doug Owen]

[ QUOTE ]
Moat5606 said:

re; your post topic... you're right - single 5mm lights are ideal, IMO, for outdoor, dark-adapted vision use. On a recent motorcycle camping trip, I found that a CMG Infinity Ultra was actually TOO bright for closer (picnic table) tasks - turn that on, and everything peripheral gets DARK! (great for walking around, though). The regular Infinity (or Pak-Lite on low) works much better up close.



[/ QUOTE ]

Something I've found (although without the benefit of the motorcycle camping trip...) as well. The light from a few mA is often plenty. I've got maybe a dozen different prototypes of the circuit used in the 'Milky Candle' spread around the house. They have a switch to select between levels. Most use the same 3 currents (30 mA, 8 mA and 1.8 mA) as the MC did, although there are differences in some. You can easliy try levels 'two f stops' (a factor of four) different.

Doug Owen

 

[Mgz]

[ QUOTE ]
PhotonBoy said:
Hmmm, haven't seen any in Canada yet, but I'm looking....

[/ QUOTE ]


They are selling those sweet Dorcy light @ http://allbattery.ca/ but it cost 15 CDN /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif (around 11USD)

 

[UnknownVT]

[ QUOTE ]
Doug Owen said:
[ QUOTE ]
Moat5606 said:single 5mm lights are ideal, IMO, for outdoor, dark-adapted vision use.

[/ QUOTE ]
Something I've found (although without the benefit of the motorcycle camping trip...) as well. The light from a few mA is often plenty.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks to both Moat5606 and Doug Owen in helping to clarify this.

As flashaholics we tend to strive for more and more brightness - but brighter is not always better.

There does seem to be an optimum level of lighting for the task -
of course it, may not be absolute - and probably will vary from person to person -
but we probably don't all need "light cannons" to read by........
of course YMMV -
and you might be wearing dark sunlasses at night..... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[Doug Owen]

[ QUOTE ]
UnknownVT said:
[As flashaholics we tend to strive for more and more brightness - but brighter is not always better.

There does seem to be an optimum level of lighting for the task -
but we probably don't all need "light cannons" to read by........


[/ QUOTE ]

Couldn't agree more.

Kinda runs counter to that 'Ugly American' bit though, doesn't it?

Maybe it's not really like we used to say in the dymanite business, 'if some's good, more's better!'?

Anyway, the insight is a good one, I think, when we get into looking at the cost of providing light. Longer run times are 'free' if we don't use more energy than we realistically need.

Doug Owen

 

[Moat]

[ QUOTE ]
UnknownVT said:
There does seem to be an optimum level of lighting for the task - of course it, may not be absolute

[/ QUOTE ]

Perfect reason (excuse??) for owning a wide array of lights, to cover all possible requirements... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

The Arc4+ interests me, for that reason - but from what I understand, it doesn't go quite as "dim" as an Infinity or PakLite - a requirement, for my needs. (Can't bring myself to purchase a 123 light, though - as well as I prefer a "floodish" to a "spot" type beam, anyways)

To further drag this off topic ( /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif ) - Doug, will the Milky Candle circuit you mentioned operate from a single 1.5v alkaline? I thought it was designed for either 1 or 2 123's?? If alkie, i'd maybe like to play around with that one.

BTW, a white Photon with a single CR2032 (3v) instead of the normal two CR 2016's (6v) is another excellent low-level light, and seemingly provides a dim but useable output far longer than the 2016 pair.

Or maybe we could just get McGizmo to build us some 2-stage tailcap switches for the Dorcy... ( /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif ... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/twakfl.gif )

 

[UnknownVT]

[ QUOTE ]
Moat5606 said:BTW, a white Photon with a single CR2032 (3v) instead of the normal two CR 2016's (6v) is another excellent low-level light, and seemingly provides a dim but useable output far longer than the 2016 pair.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yep, paulr has been telling us about using a single 2032 instead of a pair of 2016's in the shorter wavelength LEDs.

I did this myself with a 20 for $20 CountyComm LED that went stroboscopic on me.

I used a tired old 2032 to get a very dim "stealth" light -
and then experimented with a single 2016 and a home-made dummy battery - which gave a dim but usable light.

Please see these threads:

joys of a DIM flashlight

are Coin-cell LEDs Waterproof?

 

[paulr]

An Arc4 at level 16 is somewhat dimmer than a non-Ultra Infinity, but I'd say it's brighter than a white LED on a single 2032. It keeps its narrow beam pattern even at that very low level, which maybe isn't all that great since at low levels you often want wide-angle illumination.

I'm so spoiled by the Countycomm $1 lights that I can't bring myself to spend $20 on a coin cell light any more. But aside from that, the Photon Freedom looks like a real nice light.

Yellow LED's are nice for reading. They are easier on the eyes than blue or white, for some reason.

I'm not keen on the mouthlight concept. Whenever I've done that, I've drooled a lot on and around the light. I'd rather the light have some kind of handsfree capability, like a hat clip.

Another dim, long-running light I got recently is the Tektite Trek Lithium. That's a 1AA-sized light with a 3.6 volt lithium thionyl chloride cell, direct driving a single 5mm Nichia selected for suitable Vf. It's about halfway between an Infinity and Ultra in brightness, and is one of the toughest, most waterproof lights in existence, in addition to having almost no parts that can fail. Craig Johnson (LED Museum) reviewed it and measured the runtime at over 10 days nonstop with no significant dimming. Its main drawback is it's on the bulky side for a 1AA light, though it weighs less than an Infinity since it's made of plastic.

I'm going to try making something similar based on the Tekna Splashlite and a 2/3AA 3.6 volt cell. There's a 2/3A sized cell with that voltage with slightly higher capacity, but they're difficult to obtain.