Flashlight Reliability

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[ QUOTE ]
nikon said:
The E1e uses one battery. All the other Surefires require more than one. There is a possibility that a battery may suddenly die. A flashlight which uses two batteries has twice the probability of a battery dying (and rendering the light useless) as does a light which uses only one battery. For a light requiring three batteries the situation is even worse. The number of batteries required by a light is a factor in reliability.

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if this is true then this could be true as well. if you use a kl1 on an e2e since the head is regulated if one cell dies the kl1 can still run on the decreased voltage of one cell where as the e1e would be dead completely if its single cell were to die. for the light to die both cells or in 3 cell units all three would have to simultaniously die to be without light. so multiple cells on a regulated head increases your reliability due to battery redundancy. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/touche.gif
 
Re: MiniM@g Reliability

[ QUOTE ]
detenebrator said:
I don't see how you've killed so many MM's...On the other hand, there's not a lot to go wrong. ...I've never seen one "break".

[/ QUOTE ]

You must really baby that MM. Try dropping one, or better yet, drop one while it's powered up. I'm not talking about a sissy drop, drop one real hard /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Somewhere around here, I saved a video with a mag (solitaire I think) and an Arc doing a drop test. I gotta dig it up and send it to you, it's pretty cute. I think it's called the Uh-oh Darell video.

CM
 
Meanwhile...
[ QUOTE ]
Well said Lightraven! To keep things in a positve light let's keep to recommendations of what's reliable for you.

I was looking for recommendations from people that use their lights on the job every day (night).

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JB
 
I rely on my E1e+KL1, cell redundancy or no... it has always been there for me /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif Buying cells from a good, reputable vendor helps as well. Cheap generics.. well, you get what you pay for. The backup to the KL1, and long-reach incan light is the C2. The P60 based lights have always been reliable IMHO, partly I believe it's due to not abusing the crap out of cells with +2 amp drains like the HOLAs. Normal output SF lamps usually take 1A. Just my 2c and one data point.
 
[ QUOTE ]
rackness said:
[ QUOTE ]
nikon said:
The E1e uses one battery. All the other Surefires require more than one. There is a possibility that a battery may suddenly die. A flashlight which uses two batteries has twice the probability of a battery dying (and rendering the light useless) as does a light which uses only one battery. For a light requiring three batteries the situation is even worse. The number of batteries required by a light is a factor in reliability.

[/ QUOTE ]


if this is true then this could be true as well. if you use a kl1 on an e2e since the head is regulated if one cell dies the kl1 can still run on the decreased voltage of one cell where as the e1e would be dead completely if its single cell were to die. for the light to die both cells or in 3 cell units all three would have to simultaniously die to be without light. so multiple cells on a regulated head increases your reliability due to battery redundancy. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/touche.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

That's why I specified that the E1e is more reliable than any other Surefire INCAN.

In the case of the KL1 on a multi-cell body, what you say is true only if the dead cell will allow sufficient current to pass.
 
Spelunkers, who demand the ultimate in reliability, carry at least two flashlights, many times three. They also carry chemical light sticks, and candles with waterproof matches. When you are in a dark cave, and your lights fail, you have got problems unless you have spares.

I spend a lot of time in a boat. I always have a light that can be powered by the boat electrical system, three LED flashlights (two white, one red), chemical light sticks (green, red, and white), and a two flare guns that are never past their expiration date.

No flashlight is ever going to be 100%. Spares and multiple backups are the only option to ensure that you always have light.
 
[ QUOTE ]
cornkid said:
Well... A nuclear blast sends out a large ray of EMP. This would destroy all regulation ciruitry in the L series. So... the L's arent good if a nucear detonation is imminant.

-tom

[/ QUOTE ]
If I am that close to an EMP blast I have more serious things to worry about. Shucks, I may not even need a flashlight as I may be glowing in the dark and be my own light source.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eeew.gif
 
So far, I have never had a problem with the TT2L I carry on my belt most days. This includes the Kroll switch on it which has never failed to light up with a press.

My Madmax mini has never failed, but the Kroll on it got flaky just as I was showing it off at Frys a while back. It seems to have gotten back to normal.

None of my Rayovac Industrial 2D or 3D lights have ever failed. My PT TEC40, Attitude, Blast, and Impact have always been reliable.

I honestly don't feel too bad relying on any of my lights. Now, wanting a super bright light always available narrows the field a bit!
 
The most reliable lights will be those that meet the following criteria;

1) The components are under driven. That includes the LED, the electronics, the switch and the batteries.

2) Use circuitry that allows it to run a partial brightness as batteries near depletion.

3) Have all major components potted to reduce the chance that things will break loose when dropped.

4) Has sufficient heat managment that the components never get near their maximum rated temperature.

5) Low enough draw on the batteries that they don't cook themselves to death or hit thermal shutdown.

6) It's case has to be sturdy enough that minor accidents don't render it unusable.

There are some fairly good lights that meet these criteria. For low power, The Innova X5 snd some of the UK eLED lights come to mind. I don't know of a high power light that meets all of the above.

Some of the high power contenders only miss by a little. Very few have thermal control. Almost all suck power from the batteries like a kid drinking lemonade on a hot summer day. Almost all the high power lights drive the components at or over thier design voltage, current or temperature limits.

After saying all that.... Most lights can be reasonably reliable if used as they were designed to be used. I don't know of any manufacturer that currently designs anything to withstand dropping a long way onto a tile or concrete surface without at least surface damage. Some equipment has instructions that caution you to lube, tighten or change something every few months. It's not the designer's fault if you don't follow the instructions.

I have about 50 lights. I use a dozen of them regularly. None of the stock lights have failed in the last 6 months except for used up batteries. Well, except for the ARC AAA and ARC AA that are subject to recall, but that's another story.

Daniel
 
Thanks for reminding me of ARC AAA (and Infinity Ultra by extension).

Certainly, neither of them have even considered failing!

I have a LOT of faith that the Inova X0 will work when needed too, so that's a reasonably bright reliable light.
 
At least two of the Mini Mags had lousy threading. The tail caps jammed partially shut when they were cross threaded and batteries could not be removed. I would carefully "unscrew" the cap to fit it into the threads, but they still jammed. Pliers couldn't unscrew the tailcap after that. Another MM was bad out of the package--its head was loose on the body and turned by itself. I used it anyway until the switching mechanism just stopped working and it wouldn't light with new lamps or batteries. I don't remember what went wrong with the others, but I think it was similar problems. Of course, in cold weather these lights using alkaline batteries didn't function--something I (southern california boy /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif) learned the hard way on Army field exercises. For what its worth, my limited experience with full size Mag lights suggests they are better construction.
 
You have some lousy luck, Lightraven. I've owned almost a dozen minimags over the last 20 years. None had threading problems, though I do take care to never cross thread them and Certainly never force them if the tailcap resists screwing on.

I used to have a minimag in each car, tool box and one at work, in the kitchen, etc. The most frequent cause of death was leaking batteries. Second highest was forgetting it behind or in a piece of equipment. Sure, the bulb dimmed or died on occasion, but that happened to all incan lights at some time. Only one still has an incan bulb in it. The rest have various LED mods.

Better luck in the future.

Daniel
 
The perfect light would then be the SF U2.

Your choice between super long runtime and high power.
LED
Lithium powered
Bomb proof and watertight
Sufficient throw and flood.

bernhard - drooling /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
[ QUOTE ]
nikon said:
[ QUOTE ]
rackness said:
[ QUOTE ]
nikon said:
The E1e uses one battery. All the other Surefires require more than one. There is a possibility that a battery may suddenly die. A flashlight which uses two batteries has twice the probability of a battery dying (and rendering the light useless) as does a light which uses only one battery. For a light requiring three batteries the situation is even worse. The number of batteries required by a light is a factor in reliability.

[/ QUOTE ]


if this is true then this could be true as well. if you use a kl1 on an e2e since the head is regulated if one cell dies the kl1 can still run on the decreased voltage of one cell where as the e1e would be dead completely if its single cell were to die. for the light to die both cells or in 3 cell units all three would have to simultaniously die to be without light. so multiple cells on a regulated head increases your reliability due to battery redundancy. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/touche.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

That's why I specified that the E1e is more reliable than any other Surefire INCAN.

In the case of the KL1 on a multi-cell body, what you say is true only if the dead cell will allow sufficient current to pass.

[/ QUOTE ]

not trying to start a e-fight but i guess i mistook all surefires to mean ALL surefires (it was in a previous post that you talked about incan):) the batts will pass enough current i have had it happen numerous times but i get your point. sorry if came off a little abrasive it has been one of those days. no ill will intended /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif
 
I've never had a problem with the build quality of Mags either (light quality is another thing entirely). I've had at least 20 AA Minimags, AAA Minimags, and Solitaires, as well as another 6 or 8 D cell Mags over the last 12-15 years. Never had a problem with the construction/build quality of any of them, even the D cell mags I have used as hammers for tent pegs.

-Keith
 
The Arc AA/AAA and Infinity Ultra are overdriven to kingdom come. They do fail sometimes, though I don't know how many of the failures are definitely due to the LED popping.

Maybe after Arc catches up with its AA/AAA order backlog, it can then think about making some AA/AAA's with UNDERDRIVEN Luxeons, for both better reliability and smoother color.

I'd try the Tektite Expedition series (3 C cells), with the multiple leds. That way even if one or more leds burn out, the thing is still making light. The single-led Trek Lithium also seems pretty foolproof (direct drive on a 3.6 volt lithium battery). Or if you carry some spare bulbs, the older incandescent Tekna Monolith or Splashlite are simple enough that if anything else goes wrong, you can probably fix it with a pocket knife.
 
Re: MiniM@g Reliability

[ QUOTE ]
CM said:
You must really baby that MM. Try dropping one, or better yet, drop one while it's powered up. I'm not talking about a sissy drop, drop one real hard /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
CM

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, if you drop 'em the bulb dies. Once or twice, it broke. But with a new bulb, presto, it works. I don't really see what else there is to break. I once dropped a 4D M@glite about 15' onto rock. It landed square on the tailcap. The installed bulb lived, but the beam was very distorted as the filament frame was bent. The spare bulb died, but didn't shatter. The suprising thing, though, was that the batteries were damaged - one just went high-resistance - it had 1.4V+ into a meter, but wouldn't flow any useful current. With new bulbs and batteries, though, the light lived. I've dropped the 2AA's plenty of times, too. There's really nothing to break (in the AA especially) - the switch is just a spacer with a contact that touches the body of the flashlight.

I'm not really here to defend M@g - there are certainly lights I like better, but other than the MM bulbs, the reliability isn't bad at all, in my 20 years of experience with them. They're sure better than the crappy lights that were generally available pre-1980.

By the way, I have owned at least 8 MM's (lost 3, gave away 2, have 3 in different toolboxes), a 4C (my first M@g back in '83 - I forget what happened to it), 2 4D's (gave away 1 - keep 1 in the house), and 2 2D's (in the cars). Never had any threading problems with any of them.
 
Re: MiniM@g Reliability

I`ve to second GadgetLover (page 5)
Inova X5 and X5T are the most reliable lights I own. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/buttrock.gif(unfortunately not the brightest and NO throw!) /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif
Cheers,
Wolfgang /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink2.gif
 
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