FloodLights for Sign and Church Building

[gtjr92]

He everyone newbie here. We are looking into getting a sign for our church. We are probably going to get just a simple non illuminated sign. In a perfect world an LED backlit sign would be great, but they are double the money of a non illuminated sign.
Our plan is to put some type of dimensional lettering on our church building, and shine flood lights at the building and sign at night.
Ultimately we would like to use the lights to Light up basically the one wall on our building that our sign is on.
Our church building sits right off a major interstate, so we would want some nice bright lights which would allow people too see the building and sign from the interstate. The wall we want to light up is about 25 feet wide and maybe 30 feet high.
I am wondering if there is an affordable LED flood light solution to accomplish this?? One that would save us money long term.
Right now we have no real outdoor lighting solution on this portion of the building.

 

[DM51]

Welcome to CPF, gtjr92

I'll move your thread to the Fixed Lighting section, which is more directly applicable to your enquiry.

 

[LumenHound]

Sounds like a pair of simple, low cost 120 volt HID floodlights is what you need.

 

[gtjr92]

Sounds like a pair of simple, low cost 120 volt HID floodlights is what you need.

Right I know about those types of flood lights. I am concerned that those will add a lot to the cost of electricity, won't last as long etc. If there is an LED solution that is equel to something like this and is affordable that is my question.
We would light the building for 8-10 hours a night, that can really ad to your electric bill for a light like these.

 

[kingofwylietx]

It may not sound as expensive when you do the math. The light mentioned above shows to be a 70 watt unit. If you use it 10 hours per night x 30 nights a month, you get 300 hours per month. Now, since you are billed for kilowatt hours, you work out that 70 watts an hour is .07 kilowatt hours. Let us assume you pay 13 cents a kilowatt hour. Take 300 x .07 x $0.13. That works out to less than $3 a month.

Or, the same thing done differently. Take 70 watts x 10 hours a day. That gives you 700 watt hours, or .7kwh. Multiply it by 30 days, which is 21kwh. Take my assumed .13 cents a kwh and multiply it by the 21kwh.....still less than $3 a month.

I think that I did that right, somebody can confirm if I goofed.

This does not take into consideration any other costs, such as replacing bulbs.

 

[LumenHound]

I'm afraid there is not. HID lighting is still the most cost effective proven source for the amount of brightness you need.

You can buy commercial LED floodlights that will equal the brightness of a pair of those HID metal halide fixtures but the price just might give you a heart attack.

 

[gtjr92]

Thanks Guys!

 

[gtjr92]

I am not familer with HID lighting anyone care to elaborate?
Are these things I can find locally at Home Depot?
Thanks

 

[blasterman]

I would reluctantly go with HID / Metal Halide -vs- LED for this application.

The truth is that 'average' LED efficiency for brute force lighting is about the same as HID/metal halide, so there's no power savings. While state of the art cool-white emitters are indeed more efficient than HID/metal halide, you're going to pay a hefty premium to be state of the art. Once the better LED technology starts tricking down to lower cost emitters, this curve will change.

You're better off getting a decent 175 watt weatherproof HID enclosure from Home-Depot, Lowes, etc. Bulbs should last a couple years and are cheap to change.

 

[Ken_McE]

I am not familer with HID lighting anyone care to elaborate?

The High Intesity Discharge (HID) family:

Sodium lights (orangey)
Mercury Vapor (cold whitish)
Metal Halide (touch greenish, but best color)


Are these things I can find locally at Home Depot?

Easily. LED is not quite ready to do your project as described. For now use it for your emergency lighting and exit signs.

 

[deadrx7conv]

http://www.satisled.com/50w-led-floodlight-wall-washlight-white_p8.html

A 50w LED should light up a 25ft wall.

 

[JohnR66]

To elaborate on Kens's post:

Mercury vapor (MV) is inexpensive, but not as efficient as others. Color rendering is terrible (DX white bulbs are much better). MV fixtures were banned in the US in 2008.

High Pressure sodium (HPS). Moderate priced fixtures. Gives off that orange-pink light like you see with some streetlights. Color rendering is poor, efficiency high. If your sign lacks colors, HPS may work okay as the warmth to the light looks good. It looks okay when lighting masonry, for example.

Metal Halide (MH). By far the best color rendering of the three. High efficiency light source (a bit less than HPS). Most expensive fixture of the three, but it will pay for itself in electricity saved. Good choice when lighting objects with color.

 

[blasterman]

A 50w LED should light up a 25ft wall.

That's using a Semi based LED array I believe.

If thermal isn't too high in that light and it's using a decent driver to get 50k hours, then it's an interesting light. I wish we could see some product reviews on it though.

 

[Ken_McE]

http://www.satisled.com/50w-led-floodlight-wall-washlight-white_p8.html

A 50w LED should light up a 25ft wall.

At 4,000 alleged lumens it has the light output of three and one-third 100 watt incandescent bulbs. Not that much for a wall two and a half stories high. I also have serious reservations about the quality and honesty of an unknown Chinese manufacturer. The Chinese tend to grossly exagerate claims for lighting products.

 

[foxtrot824]

At 4,000 alleged lumens it has the light output of three and one-third 100 watt incandescent bulbs. Not that much for a wall two and a half stories high. I also have serious reservations about the quality and honesty of an unknown Chinese manufacturer. The Chinese tend to grossly exagerate claims for lighting products.

One other factor to keep in mind is that the emitter is rated at "50 watts" I do not believe that that power rating includes the power consumption for the driver. I had this problem with sourcing lamp fixtures from China (Not to bash China or their manufacturing) and getting a clear answer on the complete power consumption. This might mean that while the LED is seeing 50 watts the total fixture consumption might be closer to 70-75 watts.

 

[Lightdoctor]

I'd go with 70W/M98 or 100W/M90 pulse start ceramic metal-halide lumiaire. (They are more efficient than the old style probe start fixtures.) Go with name brand fixtures from Lithonia, Cooper, or GE. The fixtures that are sold at Home Depot or Lowes etc. are junk and will not last very long, especially the ignitors. Buy from an electrical wholesaler like CED or Graybar; they are a better value.

 

[deadrx7conv]

I bought the 50w floodlight from satisled. Its looks to be about twice as bright as my 1800-2000lm 24-watt 400-LED floodlight. And, it is very floody. The claimed 4000lm output doesn't seem overrated.

Using a kill-a-watt meter and plugged into my 120vac, it started out with 55watts cold and dropped to 47watts once fully warmed up.
That is the AC measurement from the kill-a-watt meter. Not sure what the conversion to DC would be.
I don't plan on running it on AC and am still waiting for my step-up DC to DC converter to show up.

Once I have it running off my 12vdc battery, I'll take some voltage/current measurements pre/post the dc to dc converter.

The driver in the light housing looks identical to this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320556079212