Gen-1 nightvision device on clearance at Harbor Freight

PhotonWrangler

Flashaholic
Joined
Oct 19, 2003
Messages
14,472
Location
In a handbasket
I saw a cheapie gen-1 unit marked "clearance" at Harbor Freight today. It was going for $69. I don't know if all of the stores are clearing them out, but if you're interested in getting your feet wet, you can't go too far wrong for the price.
 

Avatar28

Enlightened
Joined
Jan 27, 2003
Messages
352
Location
Nashville, TN
What are the differences with the different generation devices? I should be getting my grubby hands on a set next weekend that I can play with a little. Military provided so presumably the newest generation stuff? Just don't know much about it and it might make for some good talking points.
 

paulr

Flashaholic
Joined
Mar 29, 2003
Messages
10,832
Why do you think this is a gen 1 unit, i.e. that it has any intensification at all? It looks like an infrared scope to me, basically a webcam with an IR led and an eyepiece.

IR scope: no intensification, just like using your camcorder in nightshot mode
Gen 1 = crappy image intensification
Gen 2 = much better but still crappy
Gen 3 = the good stuff
Gen 3+ aka Gen 4 = sorta like 3 but better
 

LowBat

Flashlight Enthusiast
Joined
Jan 4, 2005
Messages
2,527
Location
San Jose, CA
I think you mean this one: http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=54879

I once tried a gen 1 pocket scope. It was so crappy that the only time it was better than my own vision was in complete darkness using it with the IR light on. The IR light sort of gives you away if you have to use it. You're better off just using a flashlight then wasting money on a gen 1. A decent set of light gathering binoculars (big objective lens) isn't a bad choice for seeing at night, and better yet for seeing at a distance too. The only thing is there must be at least a little light on the subject you're looking at.
 

PhotonWrangler

Flashaholic
Joined
Oct 19, 2003
Messages
14,472
Location
In a handbasket
Why do you think this is a gen 1 unit, i.e. that it has any intensification at all? It looks like an infrared scope to me, basically a webcam with an IR led and an eyepiece.

IR scope: no intensification, just like using your camcorder in nightshot mode
Gen 1 = crappy image intensification
Gen 2 = much better but still crappy
Gen 3 = the good stuff
Gen 3+ aka Gen 4 = sorta like 3 but better

Paul, can you explain which generations are image amplifiers and which are true far-infrared scopes?
 

paulr

Flashaholic
Joined
Mar 29, 2003
Messages
10,832
Far-infrared (FLIR) doesn't figure into this. The gen1/2/3 stuff operates with visible wavelengths. The IR scope as I understand it is a near-infrared camera with LED illumination. FLIR is far more technologically complex and I had always thought FLIR cameras required chilled sensors but apparently they found a way around that recently.
 

PhotonWrangler

Flashaholic
Joined
Oct 19, 2003
Messages
14,472
Location
In a handbasket
Far-infrared (FLIR) doesn't figure into this. The gen1/2/3 stuff operates with visible wavelengths. The IR scope as I understand it is a near-infrared camera with LED illumination. FLIR is far more technologically complex and I had always thought FLIR cameras required chilled sensors but apparently they found a way around that recently.

Thanks, Paul. I do recall reading about a new room-temperature bolometer being the big breakthrough in IR imaging.
 

Avatar28

Enlightened
Joined
Jan 27, 2003
Messages
352
Location
Nashville, TN
Okay, wait. I thought FLIR was more of a mid infrared range. If FLIR is far infrared, then what does a thermograph use (those pictures you see where different levels of heat show up as different colors)?
 

BB

Flashlight Enthusiast
Joined
Jun 17, 2003
Messages
2,129
Location
SF Bay Area
FLIR technically stands for Forward Looking Infrared:

The term "forward looking" is used to distinguish FLIR systems from sideways tracking infrared systems. Such systems were/are typically used on aircraft and satellites. They normally involve a 1D array of pixels which uses the motion of the aircraft or satellite to move the view of the 1D array across the ground to build up a 2D image over time. Such systems cannot be used for real time imaging, and must look perpendicular to the direction of travel, to some extent they have been made obsolete by the development of imaging, ("forward looking"), systems.

And:

A forward looking infrared (FLIR) is the North American English term for a camera that takes pictures using the infrared portion of the electromagnetic spectrum. Elsewhere in the English speaking world, these are typically called Thermal imagers or "infrared cameras".
Since FLIRs use detection of thermal energy to create the "picture" assembled for the video output, they can be used to help pilots and drivers steer their vehicles at night, and in fog, or detect warm objects against a cold background when it is completely dark (such as a cloudy, moonless night). Note that the wavelength of infrared that FLIRs detects differs significantly from that of Night vision, which operates in the visible light and near infrared ranges (0.4 to 1.0 micrometres).


There are two basic ranges of infrared; long-wave infrared and medium-wave infrared. The long-wave infrared (LWIR) cameras, sometimes called "far infrared", operate at 8 to 12 micrometre and can see heat such as hot engine parts or human body heat a few miles away, but longer distance viewing is made more difficult because the infra-red light is absorbed, scattered and refracted by the air and water vapor. Some long-wave FLIRs require their detector to be cryogenically cooled, although moderately sensitive FLIRs are produced that do not require cryogenic cooling.

Cameras which operate in the 3 to 5 micrometre range are called medium-wave infrared (MWIR) and can see almost as well, as those frequencies suffer less from water vapor absorption, but generally require a more expensive sensor array, and cryogenic cooling.


-Bill
 

Sigman

* The Arctic Moderator *
Joined
Sep 25, 2002
Messages
10,124
Location
"The 49th State"
Cheap - but how would it be for looking up at stars? (I know nothing about night vision equipment - other than Gen1, Gen2, Gen 3...gets progressively better in quality.)
 

BB

Flashlight Enthusiast
Joined
Jun 17, 2003
Messages
2,129
Location
SF Bay Area
My cheap Gen 1 is useless for looking at stars... If nothing else, they are too small for the standard resolution of a 50mm lens. And I am not sure how much near IR comes from starts.

-Bill
 

Dantor

Enlightened
Joined
Dec 7, 2006
Messages
338
Location
Oregon
I've been meaning to get into this, and will. I keep wanting to get some 1st Gen stuff (to learn and experiment) but the better half says it's not worth it. And with all the other "expenditures" it's hard to save up! But when I do I'll be here more :)
 
Top