Have XP-E size dies nearly reached their brightness/efficiency limits?

[brightnorm]

If so, will future advances occur only with increasingly large LEDs, mandating larger flashlight heads?

Brightnorm

 

[laur]

I would like to know more about this also. I have a Tiablo A9 that I want to upgrade (my Tiablo came with a CREE Q5) and still keep the original throw characteristics. I have been told I will need the smaller die size of a XPE LED to accomplish this.

Thanks,
laur

 

[brightnorm]

Unfortunately, judging by the poor response, it appears that this subject isn't of interest to many people.

Brightnorm

 

[waddup]

technology advances,

im positive one day there will be smaller and brighter and more efficient. :candle:

 

[defloyd77]

For now, I think so, but I think in the future (how long it'll take, I do not know) the dies will continue to get smaller and brighter as die and phosphor technology improves.

I could be wrong now, but I don't think so.

 

[Henk_Lu]

Unfortunately, judging by the poor response, it appears that this subject isn't of interest to many people.

Brightnorm

There's a huge interest I'd say, but you need somebody involved in the manufacturing process of emitters to give you an answer!

I can only guess that waddup is right and that technology advances and that the efficiency of LEDs is far from having reached its theoretical end, thus the surface brightness could raise as well.

The question is, what the market wants? I have a feeling, floodier lights are preffered by most people, as throwers are more or less niche products. The XP-G emitter is bigger than the XP-E and has less surface brightness, the beam is much more homogenous and people like it.

We'll see what the future will bring, my guess is that they focus on total output and efficiency. We surely would like to see a tiny little emitter that's blinding as the sun, giving the denomination pocket thrower another dimension... lovecpf

 

[BigHonu]

brightnorm,

Maybe the optic manufacturers just need to catch up and turn out something for the larger dies.

 

[Dark Laser]

Sooner or later, more efficient chips will come out in a XR-E-similiar size, because they cannot always get larger. Some applications just need such small LEDs. Surface brightness was at least a aim of Lumileds when they came out with their Rebel.
We'll see...

 

[csshih]

see: nichia low power LEDs. I am confident that they will someday achieve this in a high power LED.

 

[saabluster]

Unfortunately, judging by the poor response, it appears that this subject isn't of interest to many people.

Brightnorm

Well posting this in the correct forum probably would have helped some. We most certainly have not reached the limits in surface brightness yet. The LED manufacturers have to make advancements that will yield profit in the short term and making larger dies is essentially low hanging fruit. Improving the die itself will take significantly more R+D. It will happen though.

Two things I'd like to see in production is the use of quantum dots(on the die level and at high output) and more stress put on reducing thermal resistance.

 

[kaichu dento]

Quantum dots and less heat sounds good to me!

 

[DM51]

posting this in the correct forum probably would have helped some.

Agreed. Moving it to LED.

 

[bshanahan14rulz]

Nah, there will always be new advances and improvements. Right now I think the manufacturers are taking the easier way by increasing die size, creating larger high-powered dies or arrays for large area lighting, etc.

The technology is getting closer to its theoretical max efficiency, but there's still some ways to go. I wonder if Cree will bring back the SiC substrate.

 

[MichaelW]

Isn't the xp-e up to R3 output?

 

[fyrstormer]

The XP-E die is the same as the XR-E die. The second letter only refers to the casing configuration -- the third letter refers to the die configuration.

While they can keep tweaking emitters and their phosphor coatings bit by bit to get minor improvements, I don't think major advances in white-LED efficiency will be possible until they figure out how to grow large single crystals of Gallium Nitride. The present inefficiency in green, blue, and white LEDs is due to defects in the +/- interface caused by using a base layer of sapphire instead of a slice of GaN crystal. Red and yellow LEDs don't have this problem because they are made from Gallium Arsenide, which is very easily grown into large crystals, so all the diode layers are made of the same "stuff" and the atoms in the +/- interface line up perfectly with each other. Unfortunately, red and yellow LEDs aren't very useful for making phosphors glow, so they're not an option for producing white LEDs.

 

[LEDninja]

Quantum dot based phosphors can double brightness at the expense of lower CRI.

At present only 5 mm LEDs had been available (the company is under restructuring so we can't get any)

As TV and computer monitors use only RGB, I see lots of demand for LEDs that produce only red (quantum dot) green (quantum dot) blue (LED die). Once the patent and production issues are sorted out...

 

[zzonbi]

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=2952733&postcount=4

 

[technology]

Although a bit old news, Cree has officially updated XP-E spec - can be driven upto 1A.

 

[Swordforthelord]

For now, I think so, but I think in the future (how long it'll take, I do not know) the dies will continue to get smaller and brighter as die and phosphor technology improves.

I could be wrong now, but I don't think so.

It's a jungle out there.

 

[fyrstormer]

Although a bit old news, Cree has officially updated XP-E spec - can be driven upto 1A.

Good thing, considering the only difference is the die carrier.