Headlamp that uses Fenix LD10/L1D/L1T head and tailcap?

[Egsise]

Now don't laugh, a picture is worth a thousand words...:)

Theres no need to design something new, just use what Fenix has already built.
The designing, manufacturing and maintenance costs would be minimal compared to something built from scratch.

 

[Oddjob]

I remember someone suggesting something similar. Basically it would be a headlamp and switch assembly where all you would have to do is screw on the head of a light. Maybe it was in one of the Quark discussion threads.

 

[davidt1]

I think it's a good idea. Will you be the first to do it?

 

[dracodoc]

I think if you put 2 AA with the headlamp, it will be too heavy. That's why other headlamps use a battery box and cable, right?

 

[Egsise]

There are many many cheap 3xAAA headlamps, 3xAAA Eneloops weight 36g, 2xAA Eneloops weight 52g, so I dont think that the weight is an issue.

And with Fenix LD10 head even 1xAA is enough.

Interesting point thought, why not separate battery case?
It would be still possible to use LD10 head and tailcap to minimize designing, production and maintenance costs.

 

[dracodoc]

You must consider all the cost involved. Compared to LD10 head, tailcap and other structure you need in this design, a specialized headlamp don't have to have a higher cost. There will be less parts, less connection. I bet lots of material and structure in LD10 head and tailcap can be removed in a specialized design.
Will shared LD10 head and tailcap have a significant lower cost compared to a new headlamp parts? I doubt it. Any flashlight we talked are still in very small batch compared to industry level mass production.
If you have the shared structure consideration in the beginning of design, like Quark series, that design could save lots of costs. But an afterthoughts conversion? I think I never see any example like this.

 

[Egsise]

You must consider all the cost involved. Compared to LD10 head, tailcap and other structure you need in this design, a specialized headlamp don't have to have a higher cost. There will be less parts, less connection. I bet lots of material and structure in LD10 head and tailcap can be removed in a specialized design.
Will shared LD10 head and tailcap have a significant lower cost compared to a new headlamp parts? I doubt it. Any flashlight we talked are still in very small batch compared to industry level mass production.
If you have the shared structure consideration in the beginning of design, like Quark series, that design could save lots of costs. But an afterthoughts conversion? I think I never see any example like this.

Well there is no need to design anything else than the case where you screw the head and tailcap.
No need to design new driver, reflector etc.
And like in many new designs they need to be tested, Fenix heads and tailcaps have been in the market for years.
And because you could use the same head and tailcap in normal flashlight, the manufacturing costs would be smaller due mass production.
And would you pay 40-70$ for a headlamp, just for a headlamp?
Many average consumers would think you are insane.
But if you could buy 1 head, 1 tailcap, 1 flashlight body and 1 headlamp case combo pack with 60-90$ now that makes more sense.
The price would be still very high to average consumer, but there are so many old Fenix L1D and L1T flashlights that could be easily upgraded to a headlamp.
Just buy the new combo pack and use the old L1D/L1T parts to headlamp.

Like with Quark series, shared design.

I don't care who makes this case and what brand the flashlight/headlamp combo would be.
I emailed 4Sevens about this a few weeks ago, but they never replied to me.
Fenix, Nitecore, 4sevens, Surefire etc, are the engineers so narrow minded that they never thought this thing?

 

[dracodoc]

We are different from "average consumers". :P
Even you could buy a combo pack with $60-90, average consumers still think you are insane.
So let's leave average consumer out.
I paid $60 for a headlamp. Because there is no cheaper alternative satisfied my need. Even a headlamp with LD10 head and tailcap cost $40 and I can use a LD10 as alternative, I still will not buy it. My H501 is so much smaller, have numerous advantages compare to that design.
There are all kinds of diffusers to convert regular lights to even beam, all kinds of methods to put lights into headlamp position. There is prism kit now.

Anyway, this is a interesting idea, but my main point is, this will not save much in cost. Of course I'm not expert about this, so it's just my 2 cents. Maybe somebody have more knowledge can chime in.

 

[Egsise]

We are different from "average consumers". :P
Even you could buy a combo pack with $60-90, average consumers still think you are insane.
So let's leave average consumer out.
I paid $60 for a headlamp. Because there is no cheaper alternative satisfied my need. Even a headlamp with LD10 head and tailcap cost $40 and I can use a LD10 as alternative, I still will not buy it. My H501 is so much smaller, have numerous advantages compare to that design.
There are all kinds of diffusers to convert regular lights to even beam, all kinds of methods to put lights into headlamp position. There is prism kit now.

Anyway, this is a interesting idea, but my main point is, this will not save much in cost. Of course I'm not expert about this, so it's just my 2 cents. Maybe somebody have more knowledge can chime in.

Banging my head to the wall....
Let me ask it this way, for average consumer, is it easier to sell a 50$ flashlight, 50$ headlamp, or combo pack for 70$?
Average consumer, thats where the big money comes from.

I agree that dedicated headlamps are better, I have the ZebraLight H50 which is as bright as H501, just smaller, simplier and floodier than H501.

 

[dracodoc]

I think average consumer will not buy any flashlight above $30.
These flashlight company are not enjoying the big money from average consumer, but they can produce different lights every several months, then we will buy new light against common sense.

It's just my feeling, I don't want to persuade you to change your view. So let's stop here.

Back to your idea, it's interesting, if one company can make their most products exchangeable, legoable, that's a good thing. Quark series is a good example, I believe the design make them slightly cheaper than comparable products. However, the visual style of light is very important to me, while Quark series need to be compatible with different batteries, so their Quark AA is not too good looking to me, which is a deal breaker. Other than that, it's a good design. Besides, when they don't need have that compatibility they can make better looking light, like Quark mini.

 

[Egsise]

The good part is that this headlamp case doesnt need to be made by Fenix or other flashlight manufacturer.
Because it is just a piece of aluminium I expect that DX or KD brings this to market.

 

[NonSenCe]

neat idea for some home hobbyist to make to himself.

but in my mind it would be very expensive and difficult to manufacture in a factory.

the whole casing. is it single material and of one piece.. plastic or aluminum? if plastic.. cant be that alone.need metallic parts. if metallic.. very expensive work ahead.

if plastic you need to route pos and neg ends of the batteries to tailcap and head. (wiring.. needs someone routing and connecting them manually.. and companies hate manual labor)

if aluminum.. still needs routing for the positive end.

if plastic. extruding such an elaborate case takes a rather complicated form.

if plastic.. it still needs two conductive screw-in threads.. aluminum probably (for tail cap and bezel) to be made. you need to route the connecting + and - wires from batteries to them. and they need to be mounted very solidly on the plastic while maintaining waterproofness.
you do need to twist the bezel and tailcap in and out. and the studs cant get loose in time.

again takes some desinging to manage that. and manual labor fitting them together. it is hard to join aluminum and plastic so that they will be solid for some abuse and keep water out.

if aluminum.. need a cnc milling machine to do a ALOT of work to create that kind of body. you need a solid hulk of aluminum that you shape for desired form. (lots of if ends up in recycling bin) just milling the slots for the diffusor and the screw in studs for the bezel and tailcap demands very much..

and also need to mill or drill holes for the wiring. you still need to separate the positive end of the batteries from the aluminum even if you still use the negative to run thru the body of the casing like in many normal flashlights made today.

you need mill the battery storage and the lid for it. and also keep that water tight. plastic can strecth a bit so the battery compartment parts
could fit snugly and tight together. but aluminum needs to be made with tight tolerances and somekind of rubber o-ring or gasket in between the parts. and then you need to make a some kind of latch design that really is easy to lock and open. (making one adds cost too)

hmm.. did i forget something? hmm.. plastic difficult to make a form/forms. aluminum needs alot of cnc work. and material loss is huge. it is just so much cheaper to make aluminum tube with screw threads than anything more complicated.

for some home mechanic with free time and knowhow..
and with lathe and mill or cnc machine etc hometools..
and plenty of enthusiasm..

could make one for himself.. and spend hours and hours just making the casing threads, slots etc..

if he would ask for price for the manhours he poured into it, the price would be thru the roof. (my guess: some 30 hours minimum.. per each casing.. and i think that might be really low end estimate.)

cool idea.. but very unlikely anyone nor any company would make one for decent price.

 

[dracodoc]

Plastic is not a good choice for thermal conducting, and moulding means lots of investment. Metal light body basically is a tube being machined, which can be done in much small batches.
I believe one competitive advantage Zebralight have is the lens need moulding, that is a substantial investment for competitors.

 

[jankj]

I remember someone suggesting something similar. Basically it would be a headlamp and switch assembly where all you would have to do is screw on the head of a light. Maybe it was in one of the Quark discussion threads.

Well, I did suggest that, but that was last winter or something. The easiest is to use a separate LD10 body. You mount it wherever you want it, make one positive connector where the positive battery pole is usually found (a small spiral spring works well) and make the LD10 body negative.


I actually made one by cutting a LD10 body in half, mounting the two on a home made bracket with hexagonal holes and add some wiring and stuff. Two hexagonal holes, one for the head and one for the tail/switch. The bracket was mounted on an old, but not too shabby 3*AA with some bluish 5mm LEDs. Outdated technology, but good headband and host. This was going to be my dedicated running & skiing light.


This was not finished before spring came and no more dark nights. This fall I'm all for neutral white and quarks. I'm going to test the LD10 contraption for running anyway, but a knee injury has prevented me from doing so.

 

[tedh]

It's a clever idea. I think one of the challenges of using a Fenix head would be keeping the bounce to a minimum. It's a fairly heavy chunk of aluminum to begin with. Then, figure there would be some sort of hinge to let the angle of the light change, so the leverage of the headlamp weight on the band would be even greater.

As an initial test, could you graft a fenix head onto the Pelican VersaBrite 2200? The casing lacks a switch, but that should be easy enough to remedy. and the built-in hinge in the housing should help minimize bounce. Put it on a headband, and you'd be halfway there...

Ted