Highest capacity AAA NiMH batteries currently available?

[JerryM]

Thanks for the reply.
The reason I have the Tenergy Premiums to test is that is what I bought at the time. I have not used Tenergy batteries until probable 3 months ago, maybe less. I did purchase some Centuras, and in time will see how they hold up. Eneloops do hold their charges well, and maybe even better than the Centuras, but we'll see in time.
I really do not care how tests turn out, but I am just interested to learn something. I have more eneloops than I might ever use, but it is fun to use and fool with others.

Jerry

 

[MidnightDistortions]

Just FYI, the one that worked immediately (i.e. charged up as if 10 years never happened) was a 2500mAh. The one I just resurrected last night is a 2300mAh. But I have no way to know actual capacity until there's enough $$ for an analyzer.

Well if they were left in good condition to begin with maybe they were easy to resurrect. I found some 2000mAh and the newer 2300mAh cells completely drained and ran some tests and they work fine under 500mAh loads. The same pile had some Rayovacs and a few of them while they reached a decent amount of capacity the voltage was lower than the Energizers. They may also have been subjected to severe overcharging which i was purposely trying to get them to overcharge a bit because i figured it wouldn't take much for them to go back to 0 volts under load without the overcharging.

The good thing about eneloops, is that you don`t even have to test them.. you just simply know they will work well!
no discussions necessary, no hours of waiting.. Just take them when you need them, and they will work.


Not saying that tenergy are bad cells.. I never had them.. and honestly, I would like to try them out (because you like them so much). But they just don`t look as good as eneloops :thumbsup: (which might not be of importance to some)

and maybe someone should send CPF member HKJ some tenergy cells for testing.
as well as CPF member PowerMeUp for some heavy cycle testing.

I'd definitely like to see some Tenergy's go through the same torture tests we've seen from the gen1 vs gen4 Eneloops, and Japanese vs Chinese Eneloop testing. Even if they only perform half as well, maybe they're worth the price.

I think the consensus here is that Eneloops are suitable alkaline replacements. I use my crap batteries in low drain devices like WITL does. I actually ran into the idea myself since the Duracells worked just fine in my PC mouse and they even work in lights and other low drain. I only found out they were crap when i tried using them in a USB cellphone charger when i couldn't even get my charge to exceed 10%. When i got the La Crosse charger they definitely came up as crap batteries and had under 60% or roughly about 1,300mAh batteries, designed to hold 2,300mAh. Not to mention they had some voltage depression they couldn't maintain a 1.2 voltage under load. Even though i got a pack of Duracells (Eneloop Pro) it was about when i discovered the Eneloops and ever since then, Eneloops has been my favorite brand, they hold their charge for months on end and still have a relatively good charge. It's nice to know Duracell took advantage of the Eneloop technology since they were my favorite alkaline brand and they do well with rechargeables as well. Energizers newer 2300mAh batteries are pretty good as well. I use them in an EDC AA incandescent Maglite and they work for quite a long time, though at least until the batteries are drained lol.. i was thinking about testing the run time but never got around to doing that.

WITL, i'm with you on that.. they seem pretty good but only have the 9 volts and it would be nice to have some extras to run those torture tests.

 

[Viking]

I have a couple of their 9 volt Centuras. They seem like decent batteries, but we'll see if they still hold up in a few years. My 8.5 year old Eneloops still have almost all their original capacity, have excellent LSD, and can still be used in high-drain devices. Every other non-Eneloop I've owned has degraded to only handling low-drain devices by that time.

Comparing the durability of a 9v Tenergy battery to an eneloop cell won't tell you much about the difference in quality between the two brands. 9 volt batteries are known to not have near the same lifetime as individual cells.

This is because the individual cells within the battery won't be exactly equally drained.
One or more of the cells will usually become weaker and weaker due to being repeatedly over discharged.
This is further enhanced by the fact that they usually don't get properly charged either.
When charging cells in series you should on a regular basis over charge them with a gentle 0.1C rate for about 16 hours to make sure all the cells in the battery are evenly balanced and full.

If you wanna prolong the life of your 9 volt batteries , I will advise you not to deplete them to the same extent you normally do for individual cells.

 

[snakebite]

a li-ion has a discharge charectaristic very close to 3 nimh cells in series.
the spacer can be as simple as the cardboard sleeve from a t5 fluorescent tube cut to length or even cereal box cardboard curled up to take up the space/eliminate rattle.
not sure what the size would work out to.the i.d of most lights is just too tight for a 26650.so maybe a 24500?

Officially, this is the first confirmation I have of this swap... but I had sort of picked up on that it was possible. Just for my edification, (anyone), if the 3 AAA battery was a single cell, what would it be called (what is the diameter and height of the carrier?)? And of this "spacer," for the 18500, can (anyone) please describe it? Thanks. Any other similar swaps for the 3AAA carrier?

 

[Neilbenecke]

a li-ion has a discharge charectaristic very close to 3 nimh cells in series.
the spacer can be as simple as the cardboard sleeve from a t5 fluorescent tube cut to length or even cereal box cardboard curled up to take up the space/eliminate rattle.
not sure what the size would work out to.the i.d of most lights is just too tight for a 26650.so maybe a 24500?

Just curious snakebite are you a herper or is your handle snakebite for some other reason ?


Sent from my iPad using Candlepowerforum

 

[ChibiM]

I don't dispute that, however, there is an implication that it is not true for other brands. You admit you have not used Tenergy. How then can you say they are inferior?
I do not really have a dog in this fight, but since the price of Eneloops is so high compared to Tenergy, for instance, it is reasonable to determine if they are that much better. In my unscientific tests they are not. I did not charge the batteries I used, but let them deplete as they would. As to liking Tenergys, I had never heard of them until somone asked what was the best AA/AAA batteries for the buck. I checked prices and thought that eneloops, at $3-$4 each vs Tenergy at $1.68-$1.75 each, had about priced themselves out of many folks market, at least mine if you are looking for the "best bang for the buck.". I wonder how one can give the best advice if he has never tried other brands that are less expensive. Who stores their batteries for a year and does not recharge them before use?

Years ago my ME prof made the statement "The answer to an engineering problem is not efficiency, but dollars and cents." That was before NASA and that might not always be true. However, if you cannot afford the best efficency you must make compromises.

I wish that instead of bad mouthing everything except eneloops you who have a greater knowledge than I do would do a run test with some other brands than eneloop (include eneloop) and prove with tests how other brands perform in specific lights and how long they put out enough light to be useful under most circumstances.

I do not have experience regarding how slowly various brands of batteries self discharge. Does anyone here have such data? It would be helpful. It is of little importance to me if an eneloop will remain charged for 5 years and be usable. I don't have so many batteries that charging them after a month or more is a problem.
So I would challenge (a friendly challenge) anyone here to make some comparisons as to length of time since charged and run times, and compare the prices of Tenergy (or other brands) vs eneloops and show that eneloops are worth the difference at current prices. I realize it would take months to do such, but it won't happen without "the first step." Isn't that the kind of thing one does for fun?

Maybe then one can say anything but eneloop is junk, but so far no one had proven such. "Saying a thing don't make it true."
One could do curves showing how long it takes for a XX month old to reach X % of charge.

Best Regards,
Jerry

Hi Jerry.

stay calm!

you dont need to jump to false conclusions.
Where did I say that your tenergy cells are inferior? Although I think so, I don`t know of a post I openly wrote that.
If something has a great record for great batteries for 10 years, why would I have to try every new cell on the block?
I dont have the time and tools to do that.
And, where do I badmouth all batteries except eneloop? :fail:

I read (a lot of) reviews about different NiMh batteries, so I (me) don`t feel the urge to double check everyones review to see if they are true. (I even send non-eneloop batteries to people to test) I see that eneloops are reviewed as one of the best cells in the world. Over and over again.
There is a very very low rate of failing eneloop batteries. Even after long time (ab)use.
I have read tons and tons of stories about other brands, failing.. even after a few months. Even 1 out of 8.. or even 1 out of 4.
So the choice is easy for me.

I know eneloop are great batteries so I recommend them to everybody!
I wouldnt recommend tenergy batteries.. Simply because they dont have a proven track record. no one has proven they are great "saying a thing don`t make it true)
If they did have a proven record, and you can get them cheap, I would probably let people be aware of them.. (I dont badmouth all batteries except eneloop.. and I dont say that anything but eneloop is junk !)

Depending on where you live, you can get eneloops definitely for less than $4 a piece, especially standard ones.
I even sell them for less than that. and thats Including worldwide shipping, paypal fees, and currency exchange loss.

So on the same note: Tenergy batteries are more expensive for me than eneloops!!..
Shipping from the US is a killer. Why would I have to buy them? Are they better?
So for me its very simple: Eneloops are the way to go!
Cheaper, high quality, reliable, long history, BEST looking, readily available.

ps. As much as I love my eneloops, I too am interested in other batteries. I read most of the battery NiMh battery reviews on CPF and other forums. It doesnt mean I will buy them.. unless they are proven much better, in terms of quality, discharge rate, reliability, long term testing. Which hasnt happened yet.

 

[chillinn]

Depending on where you live, you can get eneloops definitely for less than $4 a piece, especially standard ones.
I even sell them for less than that. and thats Including worldwide shipping, paypal fees, and currency exchange loss.

So on the same note: Tenergy batteries are more expensive for me than eneloops!!..
Shipping from the US is a killer. Why would I have to buy them? Are they better?
So for me its very simple: Eneloops are the way to go!
Cheaper, high quality, reliable, long history, BEST looking, readily available.

ps. As much as I love my eneloops, I too am interested in other batteries.

$3.75/cell (8 for $30) is not in any way cheap! That is paying a premium for the NAME. Find me more expensive batteries! There are no batteries more expensive than brand "Eneloop."

From NLee the Engineer's reviews on Amazon, Tenergy Centura (with capacity equal or better than Eneloop Pro, and all the true Eneloop clones, which I'm not sure these are) perform just as good as eneloop's LSD, and far less expensive (1/2 the price at least!), making them the smarter purchase. You get twice as many cells with the same, or better, specs than Eneloop.

The best price I see on (in quotes) "eneloops" (AAA) are 4 for $8 on eBay, and those are ion core duraloops. If you spend twice that for a label, with no increase in performance or longevity... all capitalist republics thank you for keeping the economy rolling.

WHO PAYS FOR SHIPPING??? ON HEAVY BATTERIES????!!! Don't do that.
Go to Amazon, pad your order over $35, and get free shipping.

Edit:
that said, I am strongly considering relocating to Tokyo. "... I really think so...." Not just for the access to Eneloops.

 

[MidnightDistortions]

Comparing the durability of a 9v Tenergy battery to an eneloop cell won't tell you much about the difference in quality between the two brands. 9 volt batteries are known to not have near the same lifetime as individual cells.

This is because the individual cells within the battery won't be exactly equally drained.
One or more of the cells will usually become weaker and weaker due to being repeatedly over discharged.
This is further enhanced by the fact that they usually don't get properly charged either.
When charging cells in series you should on a regular basis over charge them with a gentle 0.1C rate for about 16 hours to make sure all the cells in the battery are evenly balanced and full.

If you wanna prolong the life of your 9 volt batteries , I will advise you not to deplete them to the same extent you normally do for individual cells.

I didn't realize i had this one device that drained 9 volt batteries pretty quickly, which i used to discharge/refresh my 9 volts. They got discharged to about 2volts each before i managed to pull them off. I would have liked to have them only discharged to about 4 volts, but considering these batteries will be used in multimeters and my infrared thermometer i'm not too worried about these cells and should last quite a long time regardless (since i got the Tenergy charger with it and has -dV).

 

[ChibiM]

Hi shilinn, your missing my point.
You are taking a few things out of proportion. We weren't merely talkin about eneloop pro.
But yeah, do what you like, and get yourself Tenergy batteries. Until they are proven to be better I'll stick with the old trusty eneloops.

 

[JerryM]

Hi ChibiM,
I hope I am calm, but your post implies that all are inferior to Eneloop. If the price does not bother you, then there is no reason to buy other that which has proven to be great. That is if you have no interest in exploring other options for advice to questions. I admit that you are an acknowledged expert. I do not say that with any sarcasm. So why do you not find out more about other products if you want to give the best advice?
As stated, I had never heard of Tenergy or EBL or others until a couple of months ago when the question was asked on a forum whether or not Eneloop was enough better than Tenergy to justify the price difference. I became curious and bought some Tenergy batteries to see what I thought. The results of my opinion are posted so I will not reiterate them. I will never use all the batteries I have on hand, but it is interesting to me to examine options to any item that becomes more expensive than others that MAY be as useful to an individual. I agree with chillinn that $3.75 per battery is not cheap. If I had need for more batteries, and thought that a particular brand would meet my needs better than anything else, then I would buy it. I am just doing something I find interesting.
It is OK to recommend Eneloops, and I agree that they are great batteries, but that does not answer the question as to whether they are so much better that they justify the much greater cost. Until it is proven by time and tests that they are then the question remains unanswered

You said, " I read (a lot of) reviews about different NiMh batteries, so I (me) don`t feel the urge to double check everyones review to see if they are true."
That is fine, but have you ever seen a detailed review of Tenergy batteries that would indicate to you that they are not as good as Eneloop? That is the kind of thing I have looked for. In fact when looking at battery curves regarding performance, I have never noticed anything about Tenergy. If, for example, it could be shown that Tenergy depleted to XX% in half the time as Eneloop, that would be helpful.
All I am attempting to do is determine if Eneloop is twice as good to justify twice the price. Obviously each individual would have to examine all the requirements including, cost, longevity, and performance in specific lights to make a considered decision.

You stated "As much as I love my eneloops, I too am interested in other batteries. I read most of the battery NiMh battery reviews on CPF and other forums. It doesnt mean I will buy them.. unless they are proven much better, in terms of quality, discharge rate, reliability, long term testing. Which hasnt happened yet."
Have you tested Tenergy, for example, with those criteria? There is no way to prove except by experience (time) and tests that others are inferior. I realize that it would be impractical for you to test every battery. But when you state that A is better than B or C you should be able to provide some element proof, and not just an opinion, albeit a considered opinion. So far I have not seen data to support that Tenergy batteries are inferior to eneloops. In time if their longevity is too short I will re-consider.
Thanks for the reply and I do value your expertise.

Jerry

 

[chillinn]

Hi shilinn,

O.O

Hello, ChibiM! Greetings and salutations!

your [sic] missing my point.

If that is the case, and if you are so inclined to be understood, then please be more clear.

You are taking a few things out of proportion.

Ah, one or two many to list, I suppose?

We weren't merely talkin about eneloop pro.

Nor was I. But if you'd like to elaborate, rather than fruitlessly saying nothing, I am willing to entertain your point, if there is one other than: "I only eat candy. Its delicious. No point in ever tasting anything else." There is absolutely nothing wrong with that, btw, except that you can't really say one way or the other what anything else tastes like.

But yeah, do what you like, and get yourself Tenergy batteries.

From the bottom of my heart, I thank you for your permission! Now I can get this party started.

Until they are proven to be better I'll stick with the old trusty eneloops.

I have doubts, but here is your proof:

By*NLee the Engineer
This review is from: Tenergy Centura AA Low Self-Discharge LSD NiMH Rechargeable Batteries, 1 Card 4xAA (Electronics)
The product description of this item (Tenergy Centura AA Low Self-Discharge (LSD) NiMH Rechargeable Batteries) makes many similar claims as the original SANYO eneloop. The manufacturer even provided several charts, showing performance of Tenergy Centura to be nearly identical to that of Sanyo eneloop.

Frankly, I don't have much confidence in Tenergy products. But the present low price (30% less compared to eneloop) is just too hard to resist. So here are my test results, using my old La Crosse BC-900 Battery Charger:

- Right out of the package, the average remaining charge measured was only 520mAh, or 26% of the rated capacity of '2000mAh'. In comparison, Sanyo eneloop typically arrives with ~75% of rated capacity.
- After the first recharge, two cells reached ~1250mAh, while the other two reached ~2100mAh. I'm surprised to see this discrepancy, because it never happened to other name-brand LSD cells I have tested.
- After the second recharge, all four cells reached ~2100mAh. Subsequent charge/discharge cycles gave average capacity of 2108mAh. This is very similar to the capacity of Sanyo eneloop.

It will take a few more months before I can have any long-term self-discharge data. As of right now, the Tenergy Centura seems to perform as well as advertised - at least after two full discharge/recharge cycles. So I consider Tenergy Centura to be a good low-cost alternative to Sanyo eneloop. But for mission-critical applications, I will still trust eneloop over all other brands.

[Aside]
Make sure you shop around for the best unit-price. Presently the 12xAA package is actually more expensive than three 4-pack, after you factor in shipping cost.

[Update on Sep 24, 2011]
Long term self-discharge data: After 3 months in storage, a pair of Tenergy Centurs AA cells retained 1770mAh, or 84.3% of original capacity. This number by it self looks great. But a disturbing finding is that, after two more charge/discharge cycles, the average capacity is now just 2015mAh, or 4% lower than what I measured before. I have observed this kind of capacity reduction previously in off-brand precharged cells (such as Lenmar Ready-2-Go R2GAA), but never in Sanyo eneloop cells.

[Update on Nov 27, 2011]
Tested another pair of Centura AA cells after 5 months in storage. The results are similar: They retained 81.0% of original capacity, but their new average capacity dropped by 4% to only 2030mAh.

[Update on Nov 19, 2012]
I re-tested all four Tenergy Centura AA cells again on the same BC-900. To my surprise, their capacities are back to normal between 2070 and 2110mAh. I assume my previously measured lower capacities were affected by different ambient temperaure? Anyway, I have to restore my rating to 5-star since I can find no faults with this product.

 

[Grijon]

I am enjoying my flashlights very much. I have 5 AA Fenix lights that take a total of 16 AA batteries.

I am enjoying my batteries and chargers very much. I have 16xAA Tenergy 2600mAh, 16xAA Duracell Ion Core 2400mAh, and 16xAA Eneloop 4th gens; I have a Maha MH-C9000 and an old Intertek Energizer-branded charger. I have 16xAA AmazonBasics 2400mAh MIJ in the mail along with another C9000. I have a Tenergy TN156 that broke in less than 3 months' use and is going to be replaced by the vendor I bought it from (the excellent fenix-store.com!).

My Tenergy AA batteries have broken wrappers. They split open within 2 weeks of being put into service. I was assured that they are fine to use and that the damage is purely cosmetic. The charger broke down about a month later; it doesn't charge in any bay and it doesn't recognize any battery in the left-most bay. The LCD indicators for the other 3 bays loop endlessly while the charger doesn't do anything to the batteries in them.

I have 16 Tenergy batteries with wrappers that broke within 2 weeks and a Tenergy charger that didn't last 3 months.

I have used my Maha to Refresh and Analyze my 16 Duracell Ion Cores, which are accepted on CPF and elsewhere as being rebranded high-capacity Eneloops. The results of a 1000mA charge followed by a 500mA discharge for each of the 16 resulted in a low of 2,348mAh and a high of 2,407mAh. These batteries have less than 4 cycles on them.

I have used my Maha to Refresh and Analyze my 16 Tenergy 2600mAh batteries. They have less than 10 cycles on them, all within the last 3 months. The results of a 1000mA charge followed by a 500mA discharge for each of the 16 resulted in a low of 1,760mAh and a high of 2,295mAh.

Duracell 2400mAh set of 16: All within 3% of each other and all within 3% of their rating. Average of the 16: 2,390mAh

Tenergy 2600mAh set of 16: Over a 30% spread in capacity with the best falling short of their rating by nearly 12% and the worst falling short by over 32%. Average of the 16: 2,045mAh

While these are not IEC ratings, they were all done on the same C9000 under the same conditions with the same settings after being used in the same lights.

 

[Grijon]

I'd like to add that I will be doing the IEC testing procedure on all of my batteries, which will take some time. I'll be very happy to post those numbers when I have them!

 

[Grijon]

One last thing, then I'll shut up for the night.

My previous post is to share my experience and show some actual data. I am not endorsing or condemning any of the brands, just sharing.

lovecpf

 

[JerryM]

[I have 16 Tenergy batteries with wrappers that broke within 2 weeks and a Tenergy charger that didn't last 3 months.]

I would say that is not good for Tenergy. However, I have about the same number that I have used for about 3 months without any similar problem. So far so good.:0 I will be interested in your results.
Jerry

 

[StorminMatt]

[I have 16 Tenergy batteries with wrappers that broke within 2 weeks and a Tenergy charger that didn't last 3 months.]

I would say that is not good for Tenergy. However, I have about the same number that I have used for about 3 months without any similar problem. So far so good.:0 I will be interested in your results.
Jerry

I also had a Tenergy charger conk out on me prematurely. A couple of different things happened. First of all, the wires to the sliders started to break. This was not too big of a deal, as I could just solder in new wires. But still, this should NOT be happening on a charger that isn't even six months old. Secondly, the charger would randomly terminate the charge early. This is certainly more serious, as it can lead to reverse charging on batteries that you think are fully charged (but which are NOT). Perhaps the WORST thing about this is that the warranty on the charger is only three months! So because this happened after about five months, they basically told me to screw myself. NICE! I bought a Maha 808 to replace it, and never looked back. I will NEVER buy another Tenergy charger, and would never recommend one to anyone.

As far as their batteries, I have generally had REALLY good luck with them. I have C and D cells in both Premium and LSD Centura flavor. And they have been solid performers. After over two years, my oldest cells are still going strong. However, I can't speak about their AA batteries, as I have none. Back when I got my AA batteries, Tenergy batteries were only available online. So I generally went for what was available in stores (original 2000mAH Duraloops). However, I would think they should be as good as their C and D cells.

 

[darklord]

Meanwhile, months (years?) after the OP........

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/4x-AAA-Ni...POSTAGE-/231690295802?&_trksid=p2056016.l4276

I'd be likely to consume these with a pound of salt, I think! But 1800 is the claim :huh:

 

[MidnightDistortions]

I have seen these http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00HIW3Q0Y/?tag=cpf0b6-20 but EBL is not entirely reliable. Also this, http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000WL3R5M/?tag=cpf0b6-20 but i think i would rather invest in some Eneloop Pros instead for the LSD quality.

 

[ChibiM]

Anyone ever sent those EBL to HKJ?

 

[TinderBox (UK)]

I have never tried these AAA 1100mah but they are cheap.

https://www.7dayshop.com/rechargeable-aaa-batteries/filter/7dayshop

John.