Incandescent Bulbs Return to the Cutting Edge?

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Ken_McE

Flashlight Enthusiast
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Jun 16, 2003
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"When Congress passed a new energy law two years ago, obituaries were written for the incandescent light bulb. The law set tough efficiency standards, due to take effect in 2012, that no traditional incandescent bulb on the market could meet, and a century-old technology that helped create the modern world seemed to be doomed"


New variation on Incans may save them from obsolescence:


http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/06/business/energy-environment/06bulbs.html
 
I never understood why GE and Toshiba discontinued 9011 and 9012 bulbs. So much can be done with HIR technology and they just stopped?
 
Regarding HIR: The technology works, but the HIR bulbs I see online are uncommon. My initial suspicion is that HIR coatings simply add too much to the price of a household bulb to be justified. HIR Halogen doesn't impress commercial/industrial users because they've already converted to way more efficient and durable T8/T5 or metal halide, and residential users are addicted to bargain packs of Incan bulbs for $1.50 (or already converted to CFL).

So, this kinda leaves HIR in Limbo.

While the new technologies here are interesting, they seem to me just another way for bulb companies to milk some more profits from consumers addicted to Incan bulbs.

Are we seriously seeing a potential for reducing the energy required for lighting needs, or just making existing halogen bulbs brighter? For instance, how much less power does a high-tech 75-watt Incan use compared to a cheap grocery store Incan? Gee, they use the same. So, where exactly is the improvement?:thinking:
 
So you're saying that you don't see a difference between two bulbs that use the same amount of power but put out more light?

Well, this also means that you can use a bulb that uses less power to get the same amount of light as a conventional bulb that uses more power.


Basically, if your house has all 55W bulbs, and you switch them to 55W HIR bulbs, your energy bill will be the same but your house will be much brighter.

You could also replace those 55W bulbs with, say, 30W HIR bulbs (arbitrary number, I don't know if there are 30W HIR available) and use less electricity but still have the same brightness in your house.
 
HIR bulbs are awesome alternatives to using HID's in cars... dodge stealth has them stock ;)
 
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I've got some is300 oem fog projectors waiting to go into my car. when that happens, you can be sure I'm getting them some Toshiba HIRs
 
Not trying to be bossy guys, but wouldn't the car talk be more constructive in that forum?

So you're saying that you don't see a difference between two bulbs that use the same amount of power but put out more light?

No, because:

(1) It doesn't make the dial on the power meter outside my house spin slower. Using CFLs (and my custom LED lamps) does.

(2) A good CFL is still more efficient, brighter, and will last longer.

(3) Using a halogen PAR with a good reflector and projecting the light where it's intended is more efficient than any round globe with an HIR halogen in it.

this also means that you can use a bulb that uses less power to get the same amount of light as a conventional bulb that uses more power.

Maybe...maybe not. Example: if we see 40watt Incan bulbs using the new technology that put out the same lumens and color temp as current 75watt bulbs, then we have something to talk about. I honestly doubt that's what we'll see though.

If as I suspect all we see is brighter conventional bulbs by 10-15%, then nothing has really been accomplished other than re-tool Chinese plants to make the new filaments and jackets. Marketing +1

Basically, if your house has all 55W bulbs, and you switch them to 55W HIR bulbs, your energy bill will be the same but your house will be much brighter.

Be brighter yet if you used a 40 watt 3500k CFL.....Again, I don't see what positive is being accomplished here...other than allow McMansion owners to turn down their dimmers by 10% and make some more heat that the high tech bulbs are more efficiently converting to light. :duh2:

What *I'd* like to see is rather than stupid bans on conventional Incandescent bulbs is put a hefty tax on the darn things because the frosted Incan bulb really needs to die a screaming death. Halogen PARs that use HIR or the new technologies get exempt from the tax.

Or better yet, start pushing modular PAR lights that allow just the bulb to be replaced like all the bi-pin halogens I use in my DJ lights. Basically you buy the reflector casing you want, and never have to change the entire glass and fixture, but just the bi-pin bulb by unplugging it. This will drastically decrease the price of the bulb and save a crap load of mess filling up landfills. Put HIR and all the new tech into just the bi-pin bulbs, and combined you have a pretty radical improvement in light out-put, decreased manufacturing costs, and a huge decrease in what goes into the landfill. We rarely change car headlamps anymore and just change the lamp. It would work even better for fixed lighting.
 
Not trying to be bossy guys, but wouldn't the car talk be more constructive in that forum?



No, because:

(1) It doesn't make the dial on the power meter outside my house spin slower. Using CFLs (and my custom LED lamps) does.

(2) A good CFL is still more efficient, brighter, and will last longer.

(3) Using a halogen PAR with a good reflector and projecting the light where it's intended is more efficient than any round globe with an HIR halogen in it.



Maybe...maybe not. Example: if we see 40watt Incan bulbs using the new technology that put out the same lumens and color temp as current 75watt bulbs, then we have something to talk about. I honestly doubt that's what we'll see though.

If as I suspect all we see is brighter conventional bulbs by 10-15%, then nothing has really been accomplished other than re-tool Chinese plants to make the new filaments and jackets. Marketing +1



Be brighter yet if you used a 40 watt 3500k CFL.....Again, I don't see what positive is being accomplished here...other than allow McMansion owners to turn down their dimmers by 10% and make some more heat that the high tech bulbs are more efficiently converting to light. :duh2:

What *I'd* like to see is rather than stupid bans on conventional Incandescent bulbs is put a hefty tax on the darn things because the frosted Incan bulb really needs to die a screaming death. Halogen PARs that use HIR or the new technologies get exempt from the tax.

Or better yet, start pushing modular PAR lights that allow just the bulb to be replaced like all the bi-pin halogens I use in my DJ lights. Basically you buy the reflector casing you want, and never have to change the entire glass and fixture, but just the bi-pin bulb by unplugging it. This will drastically decrease the price of the bulb and save a crap load of mess filling up landfills. Put HIR and all the new tech into just the bi-pin bulbs, and combined you have a pretty radical improvement in light out-put, decreased manufacturing costs, and a huge decrease in what goes into the landfill. We rarely change car headlamps anymore and just change the lamp. It would work even better for fixed lighting.
I agree that they should tax or increase the price of Incandescents. Simply because I'm tired of 'cheapos' looking at $0.60 vs. $2.60 (CFL) and not looking at the entire picture. I'd also like to see people look at more than just energy efficiency because there is A LOT more to the over all picture than that. Reduction in 'mercury' and 'watts' is not always the best case, but 'energy concervists' want you to believe it is.

Having said that, I think the A-IF lamps and other incandescents have their place in lighting just like anything else does. There's nothing wrong with using a dimmer in your ceiling fan with Incan. or Halogen lamps. Reliable dimming technology for CFLs just isn't there currently.
 
HIR bulbs were developed for cars so that they could put out more light. This doesn't mean that every single HIR bulb in the world is going to be 55W only.

can't you see that by producing more light with the same electrical power you can use fewer lights?

this also means that it is feasible for manufacturers of HIR bulbs to also produce bulbs that produce the same amount of light with half the power.

Please, I don't know how else to explain
 
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HIR bulbs were developed for cars so that they could put out more light. This doesn't mean that every single HIR bulb in the world is going to be 55W only.

can't you see that by producing more light with the same electrical power you can use fewer lights?

this also means that it is feasible for manufacturers of HIR bulbs to also produce bulbs that produce the same amount of light with half the power.

Please, I don't know how else to explain
Efficacy is very important in lighting. The only problem is, 'using fewer lights' don't enter the mix when the lamps are installed in existing luminaires. I think that is the point of reference Blasterman was speaking about. If the lighting was designed around HIR's and less fixtures were installed, then ok. That begs the question of, will the replacement be kept up with using HIR instead of standard halogen. I can say with certainty that most of the time, it will not.
 
(3) Using a halogen PAR with a good reflector and projecting the light where it's intended is more efficient than any round globe with an HIR halogen in it.

You know they have HIR halogen PARs right? I've been using them for years. As far as CFLs are concerned I've had 4 burn out this year as opposed to 0 incandescent/halogen bulbs. So much for their claimed long life. Lasted less than a year.
 
You know they have HIR halogen PARs right? I've been using them for years. As far as CFLs are concerned I've had 4 burn out this year as opposed to 0 incandescent/halogen bulbs. So much for their claimed long life. Lasted less than a year.
4 CFL failures in less than a year. I can guarantee it was one of these reasons why:

- Incorrectly installed.
- Cheap brands.

Correctly installed and a decent/good brand's CFL will not have those issues.

Some advice: typically stay away from Home Depot, Lowes, OSH, etc. brand lamps and make sure you read the fine print. Majority of the 'cheap' CFLs are not rated in a recessed, Base up, photo controled, Timed, or enclosed application.:thumbsup:

As far as 'claimed life': I have a 26W-5000k lamp that has been installed 24/7 for a minimum 3.5 years.
 
I agree with Pony.....
The only CFL I have replaced are the ones above the sink...pin type....and considering how long they stay on, I would say I'm getting close to 10K hours out of them......

I have yet to replace any CFL's in the house.....

The one's I'm watching are in the garage door opener....2 12W units.....they see the most on/off cycling....we will see how long they last..
 
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