KL1 vs. Arc LS vs. BB Yellow beamshots

geepondy

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The first three pictures of the individual beamshots were taken at a distance of 8 feet (ceiling height) at a shutter speed of 1/4 sec and a exposure setting of F3.6

arcls.jpg

Arc LS
The Arc LS is a recent flex failure second with a CR123 battery pack.

bbyellow.jpg

Badboy Yellow
The Badboy Yellow is in a minimag configuration. I happen to have alkalines in there at the moment but the battery configuration makes little different to the output.

kl1.jpg

KL1
The KL1 is mated to a E1 body as I wanted to keep all at a 3V configuration but at least with fresh cells, my eyes can't tell the difference in brightness whether attached to an E1 or E2 body. Sorry the beam is off center but I'm not going to retake it at this point!

Finally a shot of them all together.

together.jpg


The camera appears to be exaggerating the coronas in all three lights unless the camera is true and my eyes are being fooled. Use for brightness comparision only and as you can see, the Surefire wins in this category.

Conclusion: To my naked eyes, both the Arc LS and Badboy have relatively white center areas with a slight green corona. The badboy beam is slightly more purer out of the two but it's close. The KL1 is violet thruout, even in the center but is noticeably brighter then the other two, certainly in the center hotspot. For my personal preferences I think I prefer the warmer tones of the badboy and ArcLS. The slight green corona is not apparent in real life use whereas the violet beam of the Surefire appears to be more so. As we all have come to know however, there is no such thing as a perfect Luxeon and even Surefire appears not to be immune to it's deficiencies.

What is your opinion for the most desireable beam out of the three?
 

Darell

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Nice shots, geep.

My choice is the forth one on the left. The 5W white that doesn't quite exist yet...

Do you suppose Lumileds will EVER get any consistency in these things?
 

KenBar

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Hmmm.

Looking at the above pictures, the ArcLS First that I just got looks exactly like the KL1 in both the 3 pics and the stand alone one. Perhaps that was what Peter meant when he said that this batch of LS's were some of the finest he had seen.

I had a little issue with the case but it is getting fixed AND I was a little afraid to let go of the head as it is the nicest LS that I have seen....of course I prefer the white/violet LS over the other "shades". I had thought of sending it back and waiting a few more weeks for the next release.....but I am deathly afraid of getting any shade of GREEN...even a light one and this one is next to perfect..IMHO
smile.gif
.
 

this_is_nascar

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It's pretty interesting how things vary so much between luxeons. With 4-KL-1's in my possession, I can tell you they are as inconsistant as the ARC-LS.

All 4-of my KL-1's have a slightly different tint. They also put out different levels of brightness, as measured by my LM631.

I also feel the runtime tests released by SF have been exagerated. Unless I have 4-defective heads, don't expect the 4-4.5 hours of constant regulated brightness. Brightness starts to drop off rapidly after 3.5 hours.
 

e=mc²

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I have two KL1's and I've noticed the same issue with runtime. Both units, with fresh SF batteries installed, lasted like Ray noted above, approx 3.5 hrs. Then the usefullness of the beam, which is subjective, is spent(IMHO). I do, however, like the flat regulation that these units offer for the first 3.x hours. I can't stand direct drive at all due to the "usefullness" of the beam at some set time. Overall, they are keepers.

e-
 

Mr Ted Bear

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Once you guys have done the "runtime" tests 15 or 20 times, then we can talk.

Thats exactly what I did... went through 200 123's in about 4 weeks doing tests on the KL1, KL2 and KL3; duracells, sanyo, energizers and sf123s. Yes I had some runs around 3 1/2 hours; but then again, I had some at 5-5 1/4 hours too.

A majority of the tests (using the brands mentioned above) were in the 4 - 41/2 range, which just happens to coincide with the SF results.
 

this_is_nascar

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That doesn't make sense to me Jeff. If I'm testing with cells with 3.28 volts each time, I'd expect the same results everytime, assuming the environmental factors are consistant. Since I'm testing in the house, I expect they are.
 

vcal

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Originally posted by Mr Ted Bear:
Once you guys have done the "runtime" tests 15 or 20 times, then we can talk.

Thats exactly what I did... went through 200 123's in about 4 weeks doing tests on the KL1, KL2 and KL3; duracells, sanyo, energizers and sf123s. Yes I had some runs around 3 1/2 hours; but then again, I had some at 5-5 1/4 hours too.

A majority of the tests (using the brands mentioned above) were in the 4 - 41/2 range, which just happens to coincide with the SF results.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">After reading the above posts, I was wondering.... why the discrepancy between those and the extensive chart that Brock created on his site?

Added: I'll answer my own question:
grin.gif
because there are Luxeons and then there are Luxeons...-even with regulation.
icon15.gif
 

geepondy

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Originally posted by Mr Ted Bear:
Once you guys have done the "runtime" tests 15 or 20 times, then we can talk.

Thats exactly what I did... went through 200 123's in about 4 weeks doing tests on the KL1, KL2 and KL3; duracells, sanyo, energizers and sf123s. Yes I had some runs around 3 1/2 hours; but then again, I had some at 5-5 1/4 hours too.

A majority of the tests (using the brands mentioned above) were in the 4 - 41/2 range, which just happens to coincide with the SF results.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">If you've done that many runtime tests, did you notice any runtime vs. battery manufacturer differences for these lights?

P.S. I hope you were on the payroll!
 

Sean

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Originally posted by Mr Ted Bear:
Once you guys have done the "runtime" tests 15 or 20 times, then we can talk.

Thats exactly what I did... went through 200 123's in about 4 weeks doing tests on the KL1, KL2 and KL3; duracells, sanyo, energizers and sf123s. Yes I had some runs around 3 1/2 hours; but then again, I had some at 5-5 1/4 hours too.

A majority of the tests (using the brands mentioned above) were in the 4 - 41/2 range, which just happens to coincide with the SF results.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I guess what you are saying is that the 4 1/2 hour runtime is an average. You may get a "good" one & you may get a "bad" one, etc.
 

Catdaddy

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Ok. That's it!!!

I took it long as I could... and this is a welcomed mental break from the stress in my personal life.

So I ordered a KL1...AND...paid for overnight and Saturday morning shipping!!!! I know...how stupid can you get? Maybe you are like me and dispise the WAIT and WAIT and WAIT, after making a flashlight purchase. I have told some of you already. I honestly get a rush when the FedEx truck drives slowly by my house.

I think the nice guy and Bright Guy thinks I have lost my mind. He couldn't believe what I was willing to pay for delivery.

And to think that I am short on money and needing to sell some stuff.
frown.gif
 

e=mc²

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With regard to you testers who performed your "runtime plots", we must not forget the fact that you did NOT have final production runs, maybe not prototypes, but preliminary runs. Now that full production is happening, more deviation from the "norm" will be seen. My results, far from being scientific, have been performed 3 times on SF lithiums, twice with brand spankin' new Duracells, and twice with Energizer e² lithiums, all with expiration dates > 2011. Haven't seen a runtime last more than 3.5 hrs yet. How many tests must one perform to draw any conclusions? Please note that this is only a representation of MY two samples, not the general populace of KL1's. And on a final note: These are by far, the best LUXEON based flashlights that I own, that is, 2 E2e's both outfitted with KL1 modules. (Others: 2 CMG Reactors, 3 Arc SLS's, 1 MadMax, last but certainly the least, the InGon flashlight sold by lifestylefascination.com).

e-
 

Alan

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Would it be caused by efficiency variation on different LS? Feeding same voltage to different LS might draw different current, thus different brightness and runtime.

Alan
 

Sean

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Ok, I broke down and did a runtime test on the E2 w/KL1 using the cheapest batteries I have. Toshiba CR123A's. With all the 3 hour runtimes reported I just had to know how long mine would last.
smile.gif


I got fully regulated output (tested by shining it at a solar cell) for 4 hours & 10 minutes then measured light output dropped like a rock. 25 minutes later output was at less than 1/3 original brightness. After another hour brightness was about the same as my photon II & getting dimmer. So I guess I got a pretty good one.
 

brightnorm

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KL-1 vs SLS with fresh Reactor and fresh AAALe as reference. All fresh lithiums except AAAle.

0-4 hours: KL-1 tight focused, bright, strongly colored purple-blue beam perceived as "unpleasant". SLS somewhat less bright, much wider and "whiter" beam. This relationship held for much of the four hours, with the SLS slowly giving up surprisingly little brightness to the KL-1's total regulation.

4 hours (approx): KL-1 began sharp decline, SLS going strong

5hr 12 min: KL-1 dim but still significntly brighter than fresh AAALe. SLS noticeably brighter than fresh Reactor

5hr 40 min: KL-1 roughly equal to fresh AAALe., SLS still brighter than fresh Reactor.

6hr 05min: KL-1 dimmer than fresh AAALe, SLS still brighter than fresh Reactor

6hr 20min: KL-1 dimmer than fresh AAALe. SLS and fresh Reactor closer, harder to tell which is brighter. SLS seemed brighter on light colored or white surfaces. Over the last 2hr 20min as the KL-I dimmed, the corona became more subtle until the hotspot stood virtually alone. It was clearly apparent just how tight the diameter was; about equal to the Le's, maybe even slightly tighter.

7hrs 15min: KL-1 now dimmer than original fresh Infinity (without aggressive tightening) . SF says 15 hours of "post mortem light" so to speak. At this rate I'm not so sure. SLS much dimmer than fresh Reactor, slightly brighter than fresh Le.

Test terminated.

My subjective BRH (Bright Runtime Hours) opinion:

KL-1: 4:05 hrs
SLS : 6 hrs.

Given the inconsistencies of Luxeons, these results may be valid only for these particular lights

Brightnorm
 

this_is_nascar

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I agree e=mc2. I've done several test, all starting with a set of cells with the same voltage and have gotten the same results consistantly. This is across 4-different KL-1 on E2E setups.

Now I want to focus on testing the KL-1 on E1E setup. I really like that size to carry.
 

MY

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This is really confusing. I thought that the KL1 had a much longer runtime and brightness than the ARC LS1? Your results do not show this or am I missing something.
 

Sean

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The Arc LS1 has longer runtime because it drives the LED at a lower current. The KL1 drives the LED at a higher current so it burns for a shorter time and if all things were equal the KL1 burns brighter as a result of the increased current.

The above test was with an Arc LS w/2 AA lithiums and I would assume the KL1 was tested on an E2(e). So you are about equal as far a battery capacity. The results were about what I would expect. The KL1 was brighter until it fell out of regulation (~4 hours in this case). The Arc LS burned longer becuse it was using less current (read:dimmer).

I have just done a runtime test on the KL1 w/E1. At 1 3/4 hours my KL1 was at roughly 90% of original brightness, falling to 70% at 2 hours & down to 30% at 2 hours and 10 minutes.
 

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