LED Street Lighting Pics

[slavun]

Hi to All,
This is my first post here. I found this forum amazing. My interests are in LED Street Lighting and I would like to suggest you to discuss it here in this thread and post pics of real LED Street Lights which surround us. I do this because in manufactures websites "case studies" are a little bit manipulated in picture editors software.

 

[kaichu dento]

I'm interested in seeing how this pans out, particularly because if they can make fixtures bright and reliable enough for the streets, they'll be able to follow shortly with better house lighting options.

Welcome to CPF - now get out there and make your second post!

 

[jashhash]

I currently work for a company that does architectural outdoor lighting and street lighting. Right now I'm overseeing their LED projects. As it stands there are a couple of problems when trying to integrate LED's into street lighting.

First of all we are having major overheating issues when trying to retrofit existing street lamps to make them accept LED technology. To manage overheating LED's are under driven to 1 watt per LED since LED's become more efficient with lower drive currents.

The second problem is that LED street lights are extremely expensive and not many cities are willing to pay an extra $400-600 per street light. This is because it takes around 100 LED's to equal the output of a 150 watt Metal Halide lamp.

Right now we are actually looking for foreign generic brand LED's which can bring down the cost significantly. Unfortunately it's really difficult to gauge the quality of Chinese and Taiwanese LED's. Right now China and Taiwan are just exploding with generic brand LED's and what I'm interested in is evaluating their companies and testing their products. Basically It's probably gonna be a couple years before LED street lighting really catches on and when it finally does it probably won't be CREE, OSRAM, or Phillips LED's (unless their prices drop significantly). Also because of the economy lighting companies (aside from a few companies like Beta LED) don't have much of an R&D budget and there are very few people in the lighting business who really know how to deal with LED's effectively. In fact I bet anyone here who has been following LED tech could get a job as an LED consultant with a lighting company.

 

[KDK]

Here is a picture of our company's LED street Lighting Solution

http://etilight.com/eti_newsite/lucent.html

 

[jashhash]

There is no way a 50 watt LED street lamp (at 60lm/watt) would work in the US market since it just doesn't meet our lighting requirements. A fixture like this might well sell in asia where building codes aren't as regulated.

 

[slavun]

Right now China and Taiwan are just exploding with generic brand LED's and what I'm interested in is evaluating their companies and testing their products.

Have you found good Chinese or Taiwan manufacturers? They are so many
And what do you think of GE Lighting EVOLVE product? It is this year "Next Generation Luminaires™" Competition winner.

 

[jashhash]

So far the most successful LED street lights are those which are purposely designed around the LED board and are well heat sunk (like the GE Evolve). As far as I know the most sucessfull company to integrate LED's is BetaLED (www.betaled.com). What most lighting companies are looking for though is an LED module like a light bulb that is around 100 watts and wont overheat. Unfortunately I have yet to run across truly high quality Chinese LED's. So far I have tested the best at around 70 lm/watt.

 

[deadrx7conv]

Why are so many of the LED street lights so grossly overpriced from most manufacturers?

100w of LEDs =$100
extruded aluminum combination heatsink/housing =$100
ac-dc 100w driver/power supply= $50
glass or plastic lens = $30
assembly = $20
profit margin =$100
R&D =$100
fancy new eco-green product subsidized by taxpayer =$150
GREED =$150
Total=$800 (BTW this is what I was quoted for only one 100w streetlight for the poles out front, and I have 5 poles going down the driveway).

Toss in economy of scale savings and I'm a little irate and annoyed by the grossly overpriced LED street lights that are available. I could only imagine what the financially irresponsible gov't purchasing contracts are paying. Just wait 'til they start burning out LEDs, drivers.....

We're already having issues with those LED traffic and crosswalk lights. They just don't work as long as advertised.

 

[kushagra]

hey guys i am an electronics and communication engineer and i am getting a job in production of LED so is it fine as a future prospect plzzzz reply its urgent

 

[yowzer]

I currently work for a company that does architectural outdoor lighting and street lighting. Right now I'm overseeing their LED projects. As it stands there are a couple of problems when trying to integrate LED's into street lighting.

First of all we are having major overheating issues when trying to retrofit existing street lamps to make them accept LED technology. To manage overheating LED's are under driven to 1 watt per LED since LED's become more efficient with lower drive currents.

The second problem is that LED street lights are extremely expensive and not many cities are willing to pay an extra $400-600 per street light. This is because it takes around 100 LED's to equal the output of a 150 watt Metal Halide lamp.

I don't know any of the technical details or how (Or even if) they're addressing issues like heat dissapation, but Seattle seems dead-set on LED streetlights. They're supposed to be installing 40,000 of them over the next few years.

http://ballard.komonews.com/content/ballard-leds-way

The video in that links shows the fixture, but you can't see any of the actual emitters. Being very much on the pessimistic side when it comes to the city's ability to pick the best solution for anything, I'm picturing 5mm LEDs putting out a sickly purple glow.

 

[Lighthouse one]

Evolux has a 100 watt led light that uses a tiny fan to keep cool.
http://www.earthled.com/evolux-led-light-bulb.html

 

[jashhash]

That isn't a 100w led light, its a "13 watt equivalent to 100 watt incandescent." Good news though. Recently I have imported several different LED samples direct from Chinese manufacturers. Amazingly nearly all of them perform at light levels equivalent to a R2 bin cree. I have had some stability issues with a one 3 watt model, but the other models are proving to be quite reliable. All this at half the price of what Cree sells them at. Actually I'm thinking about starting a group buy with one of the 3 watt LED's (minimum order is 1,000 pieces)

Best LED I have found:

3000k warm white
105 lm/watt (tested in my own home brew integrating sphere)
I have run this model of LED's non stop at 700mah for 120 hours and they show no sign
of degrading.

 

[blasterman]

We've bantered this to death in the fixed lighting forum, and we've concluded the main costs savings with LED street lamps is not energy savings, but the lack of need to change any bulbs for 10 years.

Local city workers in my area make a ridiculous salary, pension, blah, blah, blah. So, its cheaper to install rather pricey LED fixtures and lay off a couple 'bulb changers'.

Personally I'd rather stick to 4100k halides and hire a couple college kids to change the bulbs each summer and everybody saves money. The LED lights they're testing down-town in my 'hood' are plenty bright, but are very high CCT and are hard on the eyes.

All this at half the price of what Cree sells them at.

Chinese are starting to figure out how to utilize the patents they're actually stealing. Go figure 105 l/per watt at 3000k is pretty impressive.

 

[made in china]

We've bantered this to death in the fixed lighting forum, and we've concluded the main costs savings with LED street lamps is not energy savings, but the lack of need to change any bulbs for 10 years.

Local city workers in my area make a ridiculous salary, pension, blah, blah, blah. So, its cheaper to install rather pricey LED fixtures and lay off a couple 'bulb changers'.

Personally I'd rather stick to 4100k halides and hire a couple college kids to change the bulbs each summer and everybody saves money. The LED lights they're testing down-town in my 'hood' are plenty bright, but are very high CCT and are hard on the eyes.



Chinese are starting to figure out how to utilize the patents they're actually stealing. Go figure 105 l/per watt at 3000k is pretty impressive.

Any of these manufacturers offering a 10 year warranty? as far as I know, it is only speculation how long these power LEDs will last. Some of the LED street lights in Seattle have already begun color shifting to green, which indicates the phosphor is being cooked.

 

[jashhash]

As far as I know there are very few LED's out there that have been tested to 50,000hrs and generic or not this number is an impossible claim for almost any street light manufacturer. Same thing holds true for flashlights and interior lighting. Nobody to my knowledge has ever run their flashlight past 50,000 hrs. Actually the vast majority of flashlights don't see more than 10 hours of use.

 

[made in china]

Yeah, as I recall, the old American made LEDs that were low intensity could last 50K hours before considerable loss of output. Everyone who wants to sell high power LED lighting wants to latch on to that old established fact. But a white, high power LED is living a hard life. Even if the LED could survive 50K hours, at what level of light loss? Also, I could see that the power supplies used in LED street lighting could be a weak link too.

As an anecdote, I saw a new Audi today with those LED daytime running lights and they had already shifted to a burned green tint.

 

[jashhash]

Premature degrading can also be a sign of poor thermal design. A lot of people aren't aware of just how much heat sinking is required for an LED system to last. Also I have witnessed 5mm, and high flux type of LED's (like the ones that may be used in the Audi) tend to degrade much faster than the 3 watt high power types. At work we had a salesman come in with this huge 60 watt foot long LED bulb that was composed of 960 5mm LED's. After testing it for 720 hours I measured a lumen depreciation of 17%.

The reason why I'm looking for Chinese LED's right now is to significantly reduce the cost of an LED fixture. As it stands a 100 watt LED board using CREE components would cost us about $400.00 minimum and that's a lot of money. In order for our company to turn a profit we have to sell that board for $600.00. Now when an architect calls in to place an order he has the option of either spending $400 on an HID fixture or $800 on an LED fixture which one would he likely choose? As you can see the only way we can increase sales of LED fixtures is by importing a generic Chinese LED board.

Well I have gone ahead and ordered two Chinese LED boards capable of 100 watts, I hope that these LED's can stand the test of time.

 

[made in china]

Another thing to note about LED lighting: Likely you won't be able to replace failed parts like power supplies or LED clusters when they fail. If a city spends $1000 per LED street light, and they find that 5 years down the road they start having failures, they'll probably need to replace the entire fixture. And at that time, Federal assistance won't be available. Because LED technology is ever evolving, I just can't see spare parts being available for long. Mr. Jashhash here has stated that he intends to import Chinese product. But will he have the same parts a few years down the road?
A standard HID street light can be easily serviced, a lamp can be replaced for $30 (parts) and a ballast less than $100 (parts).
LED lighting is very susceptible to lightning strikes also. We'll see...

 

[jashhash]

Your right that's one other huge problem with LED lighting. Often times they need to be heat sunk extremely well, which means the LED board needs to be bolted down tightly, and most electricians wouldn't have a clue how to replace a failed board (or know how to properly apply thermal grease). Like any other bulb system, there needs to be a standardized socket and plug. Unfortunately right now THERE IS NO STANDARD. If there is a standard then its up to each individual fixture manufacturer to invent one. Most companies out there have no plan for how to replace a failed board other than having the whole fixture sent back to the factory for repair. Also it is likely that the driver will fail before the LED's do, and so for the sake of argument there should be a standardized socket for the driver located at the base of the light pole.

In the coming years as LED's develop you should expect to see these problems addressed and solved.

 

[LEDMasterClass]

Here are some more functional steetlighting photos: http://www.flickr.com/groups/1492608@N23/pool/

regards,