Light recycling

[trout]

This here light recycling thing that has been talked about intrigued me and being a
compulsive meddler I thought I would have a go .
the only results I can offer at the moment are there does seem to be something going on .

I made a few little collars for an XML I had with one of Ahortons aspherics here is a little Gif that Ahorton did with my 2 pics

I have no lux meter so photos were the only way to get any comparison

 

[Th232]

Looking good, glad to see this being experimented with.

At a rough guess, is your collar slightly off-centre, leading to the brighter bit of the die not being centralised?

If you don't mind sharing, did you make the collar using a mirrored half-sphere with a hole in the top, or some other method?

 

[trout]

Looking good, glad to see this being experimented with.

At a rough guess, is your collar slightly off-centre, leading to the brighter bit of the die not being centralised?

If you don't mind sharing, did you make the collar using a mirrored half-sphere with a hole in the top, or some other method?

Yes could be a little off centre

the collar was made on a milling machine with a 5 mm ball nosed cutter and polished with the trusty dremel

heres a beamsot gif of a previous attempt

 

[Th232]

Thanks for the info! Just so happens that I've got a 6 mm ball nose endmill lying around here.

I'm going to have to do this for my own thrower...

 

[ahorton]

Subscribed! I'd love to be able to use this tech.

 

[saabluster]

Subscribed! I'd love to be able to use this tech.

Just keep in mind that this tech is patented by W@vien. I'd be careful with a commercial use of it;)

 

[Mr. Tone]

Wavien is still only making collars for the Luminous LED's, right? I didn't see any for Cree when I checked last.

 

[fyrstormer]

Can you post a picture of the "light collar" you made? I'm trying to understand how something that is essentially a normal parabolic reflector could be patented as a concept as opposed to patented as a specific shape.

 

[Mr. Tone]

Can you post a picture of the "light collar" you made? I'm trying to understand how something that is essentially a normal parabolic reflector could be patented as a concept as opposed to patented as a specific shape.

Here is a link to Wavien with a pic. http://www.wavien.com/index.php/led-recycling-module

Does anyone know how to properly search for patents? It would be interesting to see what the nature of the Wavien patent(s) are. Also I wonder if they have true patents or if the are "patent applied for"?

Saabluster, if it would not be illegal and/or unethical it would be awesome if you could sell P60 type pills with the tech you are using in your DEFT EDC LR and the same LED, albeit with a toned-down driver since it wouldn't have the heatsinking and thermal path of your light. I bet I am not the only one who would be willing to pay good money for that.

 

[ahorton]

I only got as far as searching through the Australian patents. My wife is a lawyer so she pointed me in the right direction.

It looks like they applied for a patent here but never completed it. I can't tell if they got rejected or if they just didn't bother finishing it.

They do have a patent in the US and it's very thorough. It covers any method that achieves the same purpose even if the method itself is radically different.

Of course, I don't think any of these patents cover hobby non-for-profit use but I don't know the US system enough to say. I also don't know how the import rules work in the US. I think that in theory, an outsider could make them and sell them into the US, but anyone reselling them there would be in trouble.

 

[Mr. Tone]

Thanks, ahorton. If you found the patent info for Wavien can you post a link? I don't know where to find it. Maybe I am too dumb but I don't have luck on the U.S. patent website.

 

[uk_caver]

They do have a patent in the US and it's very thorough. It covers any method that achieves the same purpose even if the method itself is radically different.

Seems like it might also cover things like making slide projectors with curved reflectors to 'recycle' light that would have been wasted otherwise, or maybe even partially silvering light bulbs to block light in some directions and increase it in others.

At least it might, if they weren't things people had already been doing for decades.

 

[Th232]

Thanks, ahorton. If you found the patent info for Wavien can you post a link? I don't know where to find it. Maybe I am too dumb but I don't have luck on the U.S. patent website.

I think it's this one:

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-...e&OS=wavien+AND+recycle&RS=wavien+AND+recycle

If that doesn't work, look for patent no. 7,976,204.

Interesting how it covers all manner of concave surfaces including spherical, elliptical and parabolic. Spherical is obvious, but it seems to me that parabolic in particular would be near useless. Might just be standard "make it as broad as possible" legal stuff.

 

[Mr. Tone]

Wow, that link was intense. I am floored by how much legal jargon and redundant claims/explanations are in that patent info. I don't have a clue how to interpret a bunch of that. In addition I don't know how to discern the difference between the claims of a patent application and what is or can actually be patented and enforced. That is way over my head.

 

[saabluster]

Wow, that link was intense. I am floored by how much legal jargon and redundant claims/explanations are in that patent info. I don't have a clue how to interpret a bunch of that. In addition I don't know how to discern the difference between the claims of a patent application and what is or can actually be patented and enforced. That is way over my head.

The patent system, at least in the US, is broke and a joke. The radio show This American Life did an outstanding episode on it recently. Will open your eyes to just how disgusting the business world really is.

 

[ahorton]

You guys will need to make your own decisions, but I've decided (assuming that we can work out how to do it well), that I'm happy to use the technology for two reasons:

1. They don't have a patent here in Australia.
2. Reflectors have been used in ways similar to this in the past, so the patent is not very strong.

 

[trout]

pics of the collar used in the beamshots

2 slightly different ones will be in the mail today for you to have a mess around with Ash

 

[ahorton]

:) Looking forward to it!

 

[psychbeat]

Whoa- I wanna make one!

Maybe I could take the dremel to one of me old SMO reflectors...

I'm happy this is being experimented with garage style.

 

[bshanahan14rulz]

It would simplify it if there were a reflective coating that could be applied to the dome that is already there. Too bad there isn't such a thing available to us hobbyists..