Lithium Batteries + Water = ???

[SilverFox]

I have several lights that use lithium batteries.

I use the lights in all kinds of weather.

I have heard that the lithium batteries and water don't mix.

Sometimes my lights leak a little.

Should I be concerned?

Tom

 

[billw]

Lithium metal itself reacts "vigorously" with water, but if
your lithium is leaking out of your batteries, or air is
leaking in, you already have problems whether or not they
get wet...

BillW

 

[JSWrightOC]

2Li + 2H2O = 2LiOH + H2 + HEAT

That's Lithium Hydroxide (a very caustic alkaline substance) Hydrogen gas (explosive) and heat (makes Hydrogen go BOOM). In other words, a very nasty situation.

 

[SilverFox]

I assume (remember that assume means that it makes an *** out of U and ME) that the Lithium batteries are well protected against water migration because of their shelf life.

Has anyone taken a Lithium battery and put it into a bucket of water (outside of course) to see if anything happens? I think a test run for a week or so should tell the story.

I have heard of Lithium button batteries "fizzing" when they got wet after they were damaged, but I can't find anything on 123 or AA batteries.

With the price of 123's in the reasonable range, I may have to conduct a test, unless someone else has already done it.

Tom

 

[JSWrightOC]

I think there is still metallic Lithium in dead cells, you could try that. Hence the "do not dispose of in water" warning. If the seals are designed to be airtight and aren't damaged, I don't think it would be an issue. Remember, this stuff has to be safe enough for "anyone" to use or else you wouldn't find them in your local Wal-Mart or drugstore. You might run into some electrolysis between the terminals during testing unless you use distilled water, though. Incidentally, that too makes Hydrogen /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[SilverFox]

Hello JSWrightOC,

Dead cells, I like that. Good call.

Tom

 

[JSWrightOC]

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Hey, it's worth a shot.

In case anyone ever wondered what exactly is in a DL123A you can check out this MSDS at Duracell's site:

http://www.duracell.com/oem/Pdf/msds_2003.4.pdf

That covers the 123 as well as a few other "large" Lithium cells. Note that they are not considered hazardous waste unless large quantities of open/damaged cells are involved, and can be disposed of with normal garbage. I don't know of any landfills that are watertight, and incidentally there is no mention about trash incinerators, despite the fact we all know that batteries EXPLODE when they get too hot. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ohgeez.gif

 

[Silviron]

I did a test last summer- threw a bunch of lithiums in a bucket of salt water ... a couple of used 123s, several used and one new Energizer L91s, a few Tadrians and Safts.

Left them in there for a couple of weeks. Nothing exciting happened. A little electrolysis of the terminals, a little rust. There was some "crud" at the bottom of the container, but nothing split, blew up or otherwise did anything of note.

I supppose that if left in for months, the water might work it's way in far enough to hit lithium metal.

I took photos, but will have to search to find them... I intended to post them back then, but didn't get around to it. Will post them here if I can find them.

Now, this just for MY experience. Your results may vary. It is possible that your lithium batteries may blow up and cause all kinds of damage if you carry your light in the rain. But I doubt that it is worth worrying about.

 

[JackBlades]

What if you intentionally shorted one out by wrapping it with foil or something? Would it burst? In water maybe??

 

[Kirill]

You can just look here: http://www.ixbt.com/digimage/energizer.shtml (whole article is in Russian). In the end of article there are some photos - disassembled Lithium AA battery, Lithium foil with water drops and final scene. CR123 and AA are made with double sealing (polyethilene rings and internal wrapping). So it's not a big problem. But if cover of battery is broken, it can be dangerous. Other danger thing is strong corrosion of battery cover, caused by electrolyze. When whole battery is in the water, current density is not high. It's higher when there are only come drops connecting "+" and "-", and it can make hole in external metal cover (especially if it's salt water).

 

[SilverFox]

Hello Silveron,

It looks like the test has already been performed. Thanks, and any pictures you can find would be appreciated.

As far as you comments on flashlights blowing up in the rain go:

"Now, this just for MY experience. Your results may vary. It is possible that your lithium batteries may blow up and cause all kinds of damage if you carry your light in the rain. But I doubt that it is worth worrying about."

I would normally not be concerned about this, but I did read the thread on water resistance...

Tom

 

[brightnorm]

Here's more evidence. Lithiums are manufactured with an internal plastic film covering the vent holes around the positive terminal. Water cannot enter, but when battery malfunction produces sufficient heat, the plastic melts and gases escape through those holes, somewhat similar to the functioning of a safety valve on a pressure cooker.

FILLED WITH WATER E2 SHINES BRIGHTLY


Brightnorm

 

[SilverFox]

All right.

It appears that the answer to my first question "Should I be Concerned? (about water and lithium batteries)"

is NO!!!

I just have to remember not to take the batteries apart in the bath tub.

When I was young, I used to play with rubber ducks in the bath tub, now flashlights???

Tom

 

[The_LED_Museum]

Awww crud!
That means I can't play with my CR123As in the toliet or fishtank either. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif
I've heard that the "evil white foam of death" can come from lithium batteries if you get them wet, but I have yet to have that happen.

 

[INRETECH]

The batteries are normally sealed againest any leakage, but Lithium doesn't like water, it will react as will soduim and produce a nasty gas