Need a cost-effective self-defence light

[deflight]

Hello, I need some help in selecting a light for myself. I have been looking at several, but am really confused on what to get. As these lights are really expensive, I really need to choose the best

I will give you the criteria of the light I want:

1. Very bright, to blind an assailant, long enough, for me to either escape or attack. Preferably, a light so bright, as long as I am holding it, an assailant will not be able to look towards me.

2. The flashlight should be shock-resistant, so that it could be used as as a "strike weapon" if the need arises(a last resort indeed) I envision the tactics of such a weapon, as first blinding, and then following it up with a strike.

3. Cost effective; the cheapest light that fits the above criteria, yet of good quality.

This light will be delivered to the UK, if I am ordering from the US, will I incur custom charges?

I am not sure how many lumens I need to achieve the blinding phase. I have seen lights from 60-250 lumen. How many lumens is sufficient to achieve the objective of blinding. How many are sufficient in ensuring the assailant cannot look in my direction.

The lights I am currently considering are:

Surefire E2D
Elektrolumen tri phazer
Pelican M6
Streamline ultrastinger/strion/TL-3
Surefire destroyer(?) (probably out of my budget)

Thank you.

 

[thesurefire]

You probably want an LED light as they "blind" better. A Pelican M6 LED might work.

 

[357]

If size is NOT an issue, get the EL Tri-Star Phaser. 216 lumens with fresh batteries is plenty to stop an attacker from looking in your direction. And as a last ditch resort, it can double as a baseball bat (being a 4C flashlight).

 

[MR Bulk]

Or like THIS?

$65 (excluding 2C Maglite). /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

 

[ksbman]

[ QUOTE ]
MR Bulk said:
Or like THIS?
$65 (excluding 2C Maglite). /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Dang! I didn't know you were still selling those. I just paid $75 for one on B/S/T.

 

[Joe Talmadge]

[ QUOTE ]
deflight said:


I am not sure how many lumens I need to achieve the blinding phase. I have seen lights from 60-250 lumen. How many lumens is sufficient to achieve the objective of blinding. How many are sufficient in ensuring the assailant cannot look in my direction.


[/ QUOTE ]

There's no guarantee that in a lumen range suitable for an easily-carried handheld light, the bad guy won't be able to even look in your direction. Your best bet is not to depend on, or expect, complete blinding. If it happens, great. If not, don't be shocked.

In general, 60 lumens focused reasonably tightly is enough to cause a lot of discomfort for dark-adjusted pupils, though doing something as simple as putting your hand in front of your eyes can give you a pretty good view of the person holding the light (on the other hand, that does give you some edge). At 250 lumens focused in a tactical beam, you're generating a significant amount of head-turning light. Remember, it's not the amount of lumens generated that is blinding -- it's the brightness of the part of the beam that's in the bad guy's eyes (basically, peak beam candlepower).

 

[Catman10]

I would recommend a Tigerlight. You can often find used one's for under $100 here. I think that you can get shock isolated lenses too. Nice, extremely bright focused beam. It also feels very solid and well made.

 

[Size15's]

deflight, Welcome to CPF!

I suggest that you don't [yet] need a flashlight for self-defence.
What you need is to go on training courses in a variety of selt-defence techniques and advance to low-light courses which feature the use of light as one of the topics.
(if you already had this training and were skilled in such techniques I bet you'd already have a suitable flashlight).

Based on the flashlights used on the course you'll have a better idea of the type of lights that can be used etc.

If I was going on one of those courses I would take an L2 and a G2Z (with P61). Learning how to use your EDC light as a tool in a variety of situations (for example as a kubotan) as well as using light itself is a useful exercise because you're more likely to have your EDC flashlight with you more often.
Also, the high output G2Z would be useful to see whether it has any advantages over my EDC that would make it useful to carry specifically for self-defence use.

My point is that just because you have a "self-defence" flashlight doesn't mean you'll know, or be able to use it for your self-defence without specific training etc.

Good Luck

Al

 

[Stingray]

One very good choice would be a 9P with a P91 and a TID. You can use a 6P with an A19 in place of the 9P as well. I prefer the old round body style in this type of defensive role as it fits in the fist nicely, similar the old roll of quarters improvisation, without having to orient it in the hand first.

 

[Steve C]

You guys can use an object to defend yourselves now???

My brother-in-law-once-removed (he is the brother of my wife's brother's wife) is a copper in Cumbernauld, Scotland.

Last time I was over there, he and I were talking about how the average Brit citizen is basically at the mercy of the goblins. Submit, and get thumped (or worse). Use anything that could be construed, by the wildest stretch of the imagination, as a weapon to defend yourself, and get locked up.

I thought I had not heard him correctly. I did. I then asked him how, in good conscience, could he arrest someone for defending themselves against an unprovoked attack? Because, he said, he had no choice.

I wonder about that. This fellow is pretty level-headed, and as as I have been a cop for 26 years, I've got a pretty reliable BS meter. He was quite serious. And he said it was worse in England.

God help you guys... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif

 

[JohnK]

Steve C is absolutely correct !

England, and some of the "enlightened" countries, have decided that self defense, against all manner of atrocious individuals, muggers, rapists, etc., is ILLEGAL !

There are many cases in which a good citizen is spending the rest of his/her life in prision, for defending their life.

Earlier in English history, it was considered your DUTY, to hunt down, and deal with highwaymen, muggers, and the like.

The idea here, when terrrible crimes occur, is to disarm, and render ineffective, the defenses of all of the rest of the potential victims.

These "enlightened" countries are finding out what chaos results.

I teach tactical light use here in the states, along with the (thankfully) methods for further dealing with the threat.

 

[Lightraven]

I wouldn't worry too much about the legal consequences of defending yourself or someone else. The legal system is a lot more reasonable and forgiving than the thugs on the street.

One of my friends was convicted of cracking some guy's skull with a trophy in a fight when he was in college. No jail. My friend is a criminal investigator for the government today.

I think a knife would make a better weapon than a club type weapon. Of course a gun would be even better. With very restrictive laws, there is no risk-free option. Take your chances with the bad guys or with the courts.

That Mr. Bulk flashlight looks like the answer to the original question, though.

 

[TORCH_BOY]

D cell M@glight with a halogen globe.
I used to have the same, sold it to my friend Con the security guard he will never part with it.

 

[notrefined]

as stated before, any weapon is more or less worthless without basic competency in unarmed combat, save for a firearm when employed outside of striking distance. in fact, if you don't have basic unarmed combat skills a weapon is more likely to be taken and used against you than to help you in a fight.
That being said, within several feet of an opponent the best self-defense flashlight to my mind is the one of an appropriate size and weight to throw at an opponent, thereby distracting him while I take more diffinitive action. At greater distances I do see the utility of a light bright enough to discourage an aimed shot at my person, assuming my opponent is armed with a projectile weapon of some sort.
My ultimate choice would be the cheapest light I could find taped to the end of the best quarterstaff I could afford or make- if you insist on a light.
No offense, I do appreciate the utility of a flashlight as a tool (obviously, or I wouldn't be here)- but it's just not a weapon I would actually choose as my primary. Not the light-producing aspect, anyway. If it's any consolation, I don't think much of any pocketknife as a weapon, either. In fact, I think they have about equal utility as distractors.

 

[PhotonBoy]

http://www.pocketlights.com/ncm60.asp

NightCutter M60L Combat Light

 

[Lightraven]

There is a school of thought that says you must walk before you can run, and that unarmed combat must come before weapons mastery. This seems to arise mostly from the martial arts.

I would prefer someone get up to speed more quickly. You could be attacked tomorrow. The Mr. Bulk smacker could not only lay out an attacker, it could deter his attack in the first place. Whatever unarmed skills you believe you possess are known only to you and your training partners. Deterrence value is nil.

I addressed the issue of weapon takeaways on another thread. Basically, your attacker(s) will often, though not always, have a weapon already. Weapon takeaways are a constant danger for us. But we only remove our weapons in a secure facility, not out in the world. There are better ways to deal with this danger.

Using a flashlight where you could face a firearm requires a tactical skill set that, frankly, probably doesn't exist outside a few counter terror units. We had a gunfight earlier this year that illustrated the point. If you see a gun, open distance as fast as possible and put cover between you and the threat. Darkness will be your friend.

 

[SJACKAL]

I think of tactical lights as something that takes away darkness so that I can see and prepare myself, take away the cover of darkness from someone, avoid an confrontation with someone waiting in the darkness, etc, <font color="red">RATHER </font>than something to blind an opponent.

The 'blinding' word is often sales hype that gives a false sense of security. Its not that easy to blind someone with a torchlight, really. Look at the torchlight, where the light only comes out from a 1 to 2 inch small opening and you have to aim it <font color="red">DIRECTLY</font>into his eyes at <font color="red">CLOSE RANGE</font>at least 3 ft or so to have an effective blinding effect. And if you allow your perpetrator to come within 3 ft, you are already in the <font color="red">red </font> zone of being stabbed/slashed/clubbed.

In fact I feel that tactical lights works better in assault than defense, I am no SWAT guy but IMHO I feel that a team storming into a room with Surefire M6s mounted on their weapons achieve more blinding and surprise effect (if flashbangs have not already did) than a normal guy with the same light but on the defensive especially when the mugger is already prepared and readied.

 

[Double_A]

deflight-

"3. Cost effective; the cheapest light that fits the above criteria, yet of good quality."

I understand what your saying. You want something that works without being the most expensive out there. But maybe you might want to rethink this. How much do you value your life? You're not asking us to recommned a household flashlight, you've asked us to recommend something that may in fact save your life.

I dunno, if you ask me life safety equipment should be ultra reliable, supremely effective and even if I never have to use it feel confident in it. That doesn't come cheap.

Only Surefire comes to mind with your criteria. I would buy nothing less. It would be a lifelong (long life?) investment.

With the value of the dollar dropping lights should be cheaper for you than ever. I would suggest the following two cell surefire lights, E2e, G2z or the M2. For a three power light perhaps a C3 or preferably an M3.

The G2z would be my first pick because it would be the cheapest and you could run it with the Hi-output 100L lamp. Personally I don't care for the E2D, I keep hearing more comments about how they chew up pockets and need to be carried in a holster. Not only that, they scream "I intend to go armed" a sticky complicating factor where there is no right to self defense. I'd hate for you to carry it on your belt and get an expensive light confiscated, leaving you with out.

GregR

 

[deflight]

Yes, self-defence in UK is construed as a crime. We are not allowed guns, knifes, batons, sticks etc. So there are three things we can do:

1: Just hope nothing ever happens
2: Phone 999(911) and wait for the law enforcers to arrive
3: Plan on doing some time

I have been caught up in many situations(I was never the aggressor) where I was attacked outside and at home. Also as a child, my family faced a lot of violence. Our windows were broken, we were terrorized at home, shoved around in the streets. Whenever this happend, we would dial 999: the first 2 min was explaining our situation, the next 15-30 min(sometimes 2 hours) was waiting for them to arrive.

The tactical flashlight appealed to me, because of it's potential to "blind" or disorientate momentarily. I read about it in a few articles(not just sales hawking) I also like the idea of having a lot of light to illuminate wide streches of darkness. This is the closest to a weapon and self-defence tool I can have. This is better than nothing.
I do not have a lot of self-defence training, but humans are resourceful creatures, in times of crisis, I am sure I would know what to do. Again, it is better than nothing.

I do not have time to do a self-defence course, I am very busy. "A cost effective light" is a light that does everything I want it to, at the lowest cost to me. If It was within my budget, I would have gone straight out and got myself a surefire destoryer(?) to ensure the greatest in quality and power, but it's much more than what I need.

I am considering the tri-phazar seriously now. I also like the look of the steamlight ultrastinger. Is it really the brightest light streamlight has?

 

[deflight]

I saw a great offer for a tactical light, that is claimed to be 90 lumens, it is from Hong Kong, called "police" priced at under £10(+10 P&P) Is it too good to be true?