Newbie: CR123 question

[Senorx]

I know I'm gonna get told to "search" for the answers, but I have been researching for about 2 hours and can't get a straight answer. I just can't understand the technical speak,ie. volts,amps, ohms, protected,bulb wattages etc.

First, i'm not really into the whole "hardcore" flashlight scene. I'm just a Law Enforcement Officer, that uses flashlights on a daily basis at work. I must admit that I have been buying a few to many flashlights lately and this forum is fascinating. So here it goes. I carry a Streamlight Stinger (Dept. issue) and recently purchased a Streamlight Strion. I love that I can just place them on a charger and forget about them until the next day. I also own a Surefire Executive Elite, that I carry off-duty in my pocket. I also own a Surefire G2 and Surefire G2 LED. Here is my problem, I find myself not wanting to use my CR123a powered flashlights (E1E, G2s), because I just can't bare to change batteries everyday. What a waste and not to mention the cost. I mainly work the graveyard shift and use up many batteries. So, I decided I needed to buy rechargeable CR123a for my trusty lights. I went on Ebay and purchased a no name brand CR123 charger and two batteries for twenty bucks. Then I came across this board and read all the nightmares about rechargable batteries blowing up and ruining expensive flashlights. I also don't understand what "protected" and "unprotected" (which my batteries are) means????

My question: What rechargeable batteries can I purchase to run my Surefire G2, G2 LED and Executive Elite? I don't want to burn down my new home or ruin my flashlights. Please give me a hand with this situation. I want to use my Surefires GUILT free!

 

[Monocrom]

My question: What rechargeable batteries can I purchase to run my Surefire G2, G2 LED and Executive Elite? I don't want to burn down my new home or ruin my flashlights. Please give me a hand with this situation. I want to use my Surefires GUILT free!

Get AW protected RCR123 cells. They are the best. But you'll need to use Lumens Factory aftermarket lamps in your two inca Surefire models. Once charged up, don't just grab the cells off the charger and toss them into your light. Take them off the charger, and let them stand for a few minutes.

I'm not sure about using rechargeable cells in a G2L, but I doubt it would be a good idea.

Never use "Made in China" primary CR123 cells. Those are the ones that produce the horror stories. I personally only use Surefire or Duracell brand, Made in America, cells. Those are the ones where quality control is strong. Rather than buying cheaper cells, the best way to save money on primary CR123s is to buy online. Case of 12 from Surefire is about $21.

Best place to get AW cells and Lumens Factory lamps is www.lighthound.com

I can tell you from personal experience that Lighthound is an A+ site. If you prefer, they even take money orders. The place is very professional.

 

[Robocop]

I am by far no expert however most of the problems I have seen are usually associated with using 2 rechargeable cells in a light together. I had the same fears as you and learned that a single cell light does much better (safer) than a multi cell light using rechargeables. After reading all I could I decided to stay with single cell applications for my R123 lights. I am not sure how to explain it but from what I learned it seems at times one cell will discharge and somehow make the 2nd cell vent or run very hot. I am not sure but do know it is bad to use 2 rechargeable cells together if the voltage is greatly different between the two.....so to be safe I only use single cell lights when using rechargeables that are not protected by a safety circuit.

I have to tell you that thus far the best set up I have found is the E1E using any of the Lumens Factory lamps designed for rechargeable cells. The power to size ratio is amazing as well as is the tint for an incandescent. I believe the highest power one is rated at 90 lumens on a R123 and the lower power R123 designed lamp is 50 lumens. Maybe you should try this set up as it will allow you to have much more output and run a safer set up while only using a single cell light and rechargeable cells.

 

[SilverFox]

Hello Senorx,

Welcome to CPF.

The most dangerous time when using Li-Ion cells is during charging. You want to make sure your charging area is secure from flammable items.

Now, as I understand it, you already have some R-CR123 cells and a charger. Do you also have access to a volt meter?

Charge your cells up in your charger, and at the end of the charge check the voltage of the cell. If the voltage is above 4.2 volts, you should consider tossing that charger and getting a different one. The Pila IBC charger is a little more expensive, but highly recommended.

The voltage of Li-Ion cells is higher than that of the CR123 cells. This means that if you just change the batteries, you will blow the lamp.

Lumens Factory makes a lamp that fits the E1e and is designed to run off of the higher voltage of the R-CR123 Li-Ion battery. You have two options, one is brighter, but only has a runtime of around 30 minutes, the other is plenty bright but dimmer than the first on, and has a runtime of around 50 minutes.

I would recommend the dimmer one. The HO-E1R specifications can be found here.

I would recommend keeping your G2 stock and continuing to run primary CR123 cells in it. This is a good back up light if you find yourself in a situation where your rechargeable batteries are all used up. You can continue to pump primary cells through the G2 until the situation resolves. Since you are keeping this light in reserve, your expense would be minimized.

The G2L runs great on 1 Li-Ion battery. You need a 17670 sized cell. This means that the cell is around 17 mm in diameter, around 67 mm long, and the 0 at the end means that it is round. Some manufacturers refer to this size as 600S or 168S. This size is about the size of 2 of the CR123 cells end to end.

To charge the 17670 cell, you need a charger to accommodate the extra length. The Pila IBC charger is set up to charge batteries of this length, but requires a spacer to charge the R-CR123 sized cell. The spacer can be a bolt and a nut of the correct length, or a chunk of brass or aluminum stock. You are just trying to take up the space between the end of the cell and the charger contact with something that is conductive.

Li-Ion cells can "rapidly vent with flame" if you charge them to too high a voltage, or charge them after they have been deeply discharged. To guard against this, some cells have a small circuit attached to the cell. This protection circuit limits the maximum voltage the cell can be charged to, limits the lowest voltage the cell can be discharged to, and limits the total current in the event of an external shorting of the cell. Cells with this protection circuit are called protected cells.

While the protected cells are safer to use, in the strictest sense they can be less reliable. If you drop your light during use, it is possible for the protection circuit to be damaged and your light will go out until you change the battery out. In normal use this is not much of an issue, but in your job you may want to think about reliability.

If you decide that you should use bare cells (unprotected), you need to have a charger that limits the maximum voltage to 4.2 volts, and you need to recharge frequently. If you notice the light dimming down, don't continue to use it. Shut it off and change the battery out. If you are in a situation that you need to continue using the light, when you are done, toss the battery and don't try to "recover" it. When you put a battery on the charger, measure its voltage before you do so. Your cells should be above 3 volts. If they are below that, you have over discharged your cells and have done some damage to them. The lower the voltage, the more damage that has been done.

We are all here to help you figure things out. There are dangers associated with storing energy, but once you figure things out, they are manageable.

I would also like to thank you for your efforts in making the world, and your community, a better and safer place to live in.

Tom

 

[Senorx]

Silverfox, Robocop, Monocrom...........Thank you for the quick response. Sorry for the late response. I keep "vampire" hours for work.

Silverfox: I think I'm gonna go with the Pila IBC Charger w/600s rechargables for my G2L. Excellent idea on using the CR123A G2 for a backup. Where do I get the best bang for my buck on CR123a batteries? Brand? Price? Website? Radio Shack was getting to expensive.

Thanks again guys! BTW, I just bid on a Fenix and Cree lights on Ebay. I might of caught a new bug, to add to my AR15.com and EDC forums obsessions.

 

[SilverFox]

Hello Senorx,

www.SureFire.com has CR123 batteries, as does www.BatteryStation.com . If you have a Sportsman Warehouse in your area, you can check out the StreamLight CR123 batteries. You can also check out the Duracell CR123 cells at www.batteriesandbutter.com .

If you stick to name brands, you should get good quality cells. It appears that Panasonic makes cells for SureFire, StreamLight, BatteryStation, and a few others. Then there are Sanyo, Energizer, and Duracell.

A Google search should come up with several options for on line purchases at decent prices.

Tom