Sanyo / Eneloop Info:

SilverFox

Flashaholic
Joined
Jan 19, 2003
Messages
12,449
Location
Bellingham WA
Hello Al,

I am not sure I would consider charging at 8.5 amps particularly gentle...

It looks like their line up ranges from 15 minutes to 10 hours for charge times for the Eneloop cells.

Tom
 

Al

Enlightened
Joined
Sep 27, 2001
Messages
459
SilverFox said:
Hello Al,

I am not sure I would consider charging at 8.5 amps particularly gentle...

It looks like their line up ranges from 15 minutes to 10 hours for charge times for the Eneloop cells.

Tom

Look more closely ... unless I'm mistaken the chargers bubble-packed with Eneloop cells do not include Sanyo's MQS04 15 min. charger (8.3A).

Following are: MQN04 - 250ma, MDU01 - 850ma, MDR03 - 600ma.
 

elgarak

Flashlight Enthusiast
Joined
Jul 30, 2004
Messages
1,045
Location
Florida
This seems to qualify as a datasheet, does it not? It's for Eneloop AAs. It says Twicell on it, which was the name I found in their industrial line-up. Are industrial Twicell identical to consumer Eneloops?

Recommended charge rate is 1C... Funny if they really do not follow their own recommendations with their chargers. However, I know that things can be radically different with pulsed charging processes as opposed to constant current processes -- faster, yet less damaging to the cell.
 

Doug S

Flashlight Enthusiast
Joined
Jun 20, 2002
Messages
2,712
Location
Chickamauga Georgia
Yes! That's it. I searched long and in vain for that on the Sanyo sites. Substituting the AAA part # in your link leads to the AAA datasheet also:
http://www.eneloop.info/uploads/media/Datasheet_-_HR-4UTG_01.pdf
Thanks! Let me know if you ever run across the Rayovac Hybrid datasheets. I have been looking for those too.

elgarak said:
This seems to qualify as a datasheet, does it not? It's for Eneloop AAs. It says Twicell on it, which was the name I found in their industrial line-up. Are industrial Twicell identical to consumer Eneloops?

Recommended charge rate is 1C... Funny if they really do not follow their own recommendations with their chargers. However, I know that things can be radically different with pulsed charging processes as opposed to constant current processes -- faster, yet less damaging to the cell.
 

Al

Enlightened
Joined
Sep 27, 2001
Messages
459
Hello Tom,

So was I when I got the info to begin this thread. Although page 8 details Sanyo's "fast" charger (MQS04) at 8.3A for AA's and mentions Eneloops, page 6 shows that they do not bundle the MQS04 charger with Eneloop batteries. The highest rate charger packaged with Eneloops is MDU01 at 850ma. I wonder Sanyo is protecting the less knowlegable public by not packaging the MQS04 with Eneloops (shorter usable life of NimH's repeatedly charged at high rates)?

I hear that the separator in an Eneloop battery is saturated with DI water. Picked up that bit of info on Steve Digicam's discussion forum from someone who posts as SilverfoxCPF.

http://www.stevesforums.com/forums/view_topic.php?id=96500&forum_id=51
 

SilverFox

Flashaholic
Joined
Jan 19, 2003
Messages
12,449
Location
Bellingham WA
Hello Al,

I believe the solar charger will charge 2 cells at close to 1 amp, but I don't think they bundle it with Eneloop cells.

The separator information came from a patent search. I am not sure if that is what they are using, but the claim suggested similar results.

Looking at the bundle packaging from a marketing perspective, it makes sense to bundle expensive batteries with cheap chargers. However, if they bundled the expensive cells with their most expensive charger, they probably would suffer reduced sales, and would not be competitive with Duracell and Energizer.

I have two chargers that came with Eneloop cells. The first one is the MDR02. It has 2 charging slots for AAA and AA and charges at 380 mA for AAA and 550 mA for AA. The second one has a cover that has Eneloop on it. It is not listed in their catalog. It is the MQN05U. It has 4 charging slots for AAA and AA cells, and charges at 150 mA for AAA and 300 mA for AA cells.

I have emailed Sanyo several times asking why their chargers charge at such low rates while their technical publications recommend charging at 0.5 - 1.0C. No answers yet.

Tom
 

bp044

Enlightened
Joined
Feb 15, 2006
Messages
237
elgarak said:
This seems to qualify as a datasheet, does it not? It's for Eneloop AAs. It says Twicell on it, which was the name I found in their industrial line-up. Are industrial Twicell identical to consumer Eneloops?

Recommended charge rate is 1C... Funny if they really do not follow their own recommendations with their chargers. However, I know that things can be radically different with pulsed charging processes as opposed to constant current processes -- faster, yet less damaging to the cell.
VERY CONFUSING . Sanyo datasheet recomends charging Eneloops at " 2000ma fast charge " .Is there any reason not to use 1000ma ? Would'nt this prolong life of the cell ?
 

elgarak

Flashlight Enthusiast
Joined
Jul 30, 2004
Messages
1,045
Location
Florida
This document outlines Sanyo's recommendations for industrial Twicell batteries; I cannot find anything specifically for Eneloops. However, since the Eneloop site linked to the Twicell datasheet I already posted, I guess this is the best bet for recommended charging procedures.

No surprises: Standard constant current charging @ 0.1C for 16 hrs. Fast charging @ 0.5C-1C for the appropriate time (1.1 hrs for 1C or detecting suitable end conditions, i.e. voltage drop). No mentioning of anything higher than 1C. The 8.3A charging current for 15 mins that Sanyo themselves publish for one of their chargers when using Eneloops seems way out of bound.

bp044, 1A (1000mA = 0.5C) appears perfectly fine with me.

The problem is that there are many ways to get the batteries charged. The manufacturer cannot check all. They use one and guarantee that it works safely for a certain amount of cycles; the usual one is constant current @ 0.1C and something like 500-1000 cycles.
 

gunga

Flashaholic
Joined
Nov 29, 2006
Messages
8,079
Location
Vancouver, BC, Canada
Silverfox, do you have ny more info on the MQN05U eneloop slow charger?

Is it a smart charger?

I just got a set (did not remember this thread) and tried charging the packaged eneloops. Since they should be new and ready to go I assumed the charger would stop after 20 minutes or less.

It had been going for say 3 hours when I stopped it. Batteries were warm but not too hot.

Fresh out of the package, shouldn't the enloops terminate much sooner in this charger?
 

SilverFox

Flashaholic
Joined
Jan 19, 2003
Messages
12,449
Location
Bellingham WA
Hello Gunga,

No updates.

I have only charged discharged cells on that charger. My cells did not get warm (<95 F).

Tom
 

redbird

Enlightened
Joined
Dec 25, 2000
Messages
258
Location
SW lower Mi USA
I 2nd the need to find a dealer on the web here in the US. I had bought from HHGregg around christmas time but they are no longer carrying them. Any other suggestions?
 

TorchBoy

Flashlight Enthusiast
Joined
Jan 15, 2007
Messages
4,486
Location
New Zealand
I know it's already been answered in other threads but for completeness - www.thomasdistributing.com has Eneloops and other good brands of NiMH.

They're a bit more expensive, and I bought my first Eneloops from them, but their international shipping is quite a bit.
 

Brody

Newly Enlightened
Joined
Oct 19, 2002
Messages
174
Location
Seattle
I got mine at www.kitscamera.com
If you are new to using google checkout, you can get $10 off on your first order that is over $10 (I was, and it made it a great deal!)
 
Top