Sanyo out of the nimh business?

357mag1

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So according to the linked article when Sanyo was bought out by Panasonic they had to sell off the nimh portion of their business.

http://www.twice.com/news/panasonicsanyo-divest-nimh-battery-operations-fdk-0

I see Sanyo still carries the Eneloops on their website so does FDK provide these batteries to Sanyo.

I also see on Cheap Battery Packs website they sell Twicell batteries claiming to be Eneloops in everything but name. If you click to buy these cells there is a warning that they are not for high current draw.

Just wondering if anyone has some actual facts on these Twicell batteries. It is still cheaper to buy Sanyo branded Eneloops from places like Thomas Distributing from what I can tell.
 

Rosoku Chikara

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Your link is for a 2009 press release. To my knowledge, Sanyo no longer sells any Eneloops. But, Panasonic is still selling, and as far as I know, intends to keep selling the Eneloop products, but under their Panasonic name (as in: "Panasonic Eneloop Battery").

The Twicell batteries are made by Fujitsu, who makes pretty good computers, but I don't know much about their batteries. I will look into it. But, in the meantime, I would stick to Eneloops, whether the older versions made by Sanyo, or the current ones made by Panasonic.
 

BillSWPA

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The FTC order can be found here:

http://www.ftc.gov/sites/default/files/documents/cases/2010/01/100108panasantodo.pdf

The order specifically excludes Sanyo branded retail batteries.

The issue that concerned the FTC was batteries that were specially designed for specific devices. If, for example, a police department needed new batteries for their radios, and the battery was specially designed for those radios, they would need to either pay whatever the only seller wanted to charge, or switch to a totally different radio. There are numerous sources of AA and AAA batteries, as well as less limitation to NiMH technology.

I recently purchased a bunch of Eneloops, and they had both Panasonic's name and Sanyo's name on the packaging.
 

Rosoku Chikara

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Well, I looked into this matter a little bit, and here is what I have found. These are the batteries in question, as they are currently being packaged and sold in Japan (left is the standard Eneloop "equivalent" and the Eneloop Pro "equivalent" is on the right):



Until 2009, a Sanyo subsidiary called "Sanyo Energy Twicell Co, Ltd." manufactured Eneloops in Japan. But, as the FTC order posted by BillSWPA above details, when Sanyo sold its "battery business" to Panasonic, they decided to sell their actual battery manufacturing subsidiary to Fujitsu, to avoid problems with US and European anti-trust laws. So, this manufacturing company is now called "FDK Twicell Co., Ltd." and this is still the exact same physical production facility where Sanyo Eneloops used to be manufactured. (Presumably, Panasonic now manufacturers their Eneloops at their own production facility somewhere? Or, perhaps they actually purchase all their Eneloops from FDK?)

According to an August 21, 2012 review of these Fujitsu batteries, they are physically identical to the old Eneloops. The reviewer provides a number of physical features as "proof" of this fact, including the following photos. He says that the small imperfection in the positive terminals of both batteries demonstrates that they must have come off the same production line.


This reviewer did, however, find some differences in electrical performance...




He writes that the Eneloops have, in general, better performance (but, the Fujitsu batteries perform better in "burst" applications, such as a camera flash). My impression is that he did not seem to think that the differences in performance are all that significant, but that overall the Eneloops were a bit better. (By the way, the light blue line in the graphs is said to be an Eneloop that has been cycled 20 times. I am not sure that I understand what he means by this... Are only 20 recharge cycles enough to make any difference in performance?)

Anyway, his conclusion was that the Fujitsu batteries are manufactured on the exact same production line, to the exact same physical specifications as Eneloops, but they have slightly different chemistry due to the use of slightly different "ingredients." His primary complaint about the Fujitsu batteries seems to be that they cost more than Eneloops. (Judging by the prices I found on the Japanese internet today, they now appear to be priced about the same, or even slightly less than Panasonic Eneloops.)

Well, that's all I could figure out, so far. Perhaps those on the forum with a better understanding of battery performance graphs can help us out a bit more here? Are these Fujitsu batteries really "Eneloops"?
 
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Rosoku Chikara

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Update: A Japanese Wikipedia article on FDK contains the following paragraph. (I should have checked Wikipedia sooner!)

QUOTE (My rough translation)

This company was the "Eneloop" NiMH battery manufacturer for the Sanyo Electric group of companies, and even today FDK manufacturers the batteries sold under the Sanyo brand. (As of April 26, 2013, Panasonic has been the sales company, and the brand name was also changed to Panasonic, but FDK expects to continue the manufacturing despite this change. Furthermore, since 2012, Fujitsu has also sold these batteries as "Fujitsu Rechargeable Batteries.")

UNQUOTE

So, there we have it. If we can believe what is written on Wikipedia, then FDK is indeed the true "Fountain-of-all-Eneloops." Perhaps others on this forum already knew this, but it was certainly news to me.

By the way, according to this same Wikipeida article, this company began its life as "Sanyo Energy Takasaki Co., Ltd." when the Toshiba Electric group sold off their NiMH battery business to the Sanyo Electric group in April, 2001. (It was renamed as "Sanyo Energy Twicell Co., Ltd." in April, 2003.) So, interestingly enough, the original Eneloop technology may have been developed by Toshiba.
 
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Curious_character

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We might be getting Eneloop equivalents from this factory. Or we might not. Without the Sanyo oversight, who will insure that the factory buys the same quality components, continues to use the same processes, and maintains the same quality control? Whatever name gets put on the new batteries, it will have to establish its own reputation for quality, because we can't automatically assume that what comes out of the factory is and will continue to be the same as Eneloops.

c_c
 

357mag1

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We might be getting Eneloop equivalents from this factory. Or we might not. Without the Sanyo oversight, who will insure that the factory buys the same quality components, continues to use the same processes, and maintains the same quality control? Whatever name gets put on the new batteries, it will have to establish its own reputation for quality, because we can't automatically assume that what comes out of the factory is and will continue to be the same as Eneloops.

c_c

FDK has had the business since sometime in 2009 if I understand everything right so we should be good if the last 4 years are any indication. Most Japanese cells have been damn good cells anyway.
 

ChrisGarrett

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FDK has had the business since sometime in 2009 if I understand everything right so we should be good if the last 4 years are any indication. Most Japanese cells have been damn good cells anyway.

Yep...we all need to do our 'long term' tests to know what we know. I just put some 2400mAh DuraLoops in storage to see what I see.

They are what they are.

Chris
 
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