The right battery choice for my maglite builds?

[hk dave]

This is not a troll thread

Just trying to figure out the best answer to my current confusion.

I'm building 3 flashlights soon... the relevant specs are...

3 D Maglite Hosts
SSC P7 C Bin
2.8amp 3 Mode Drives.

I've been researching the many awesome posts about batteries and chargers on CPF but I haven't quite been able to figure this part out.

It seems a lot of people believe the eneloops are great batteries. I also read I might be better off using eneloops then non low discharge full D sized NIMH batteries simply because the chemistry inside the batteries needs to be used on a normal basis or it goes bad.

The alternative is the Accupower low discharge 10000mah D sized batteries.

The eneloops make sense financially... buy the $30 amazon kits that comes with a charger, 8 AA 2000mah batteries and 4 D battery adapters. Buy a few more AA eneloops and 5 more D adapters and I'm in business for around $50. If I want to add more cells, it's a relatively inexpensive thing to do.

If I go the Accupower route... we have $120 for the batteries and it seems everyone is saying I need a decent charger to take care of these beauties... and that goes for around $100? So I'm in business here at $220 but get 5 times the runtime.

So here are my questions... and I ask them because I'm a newbie and despite my reading, for some reason I learn best through conversation and interaction...

#1 Is there a reason outside of the obvious need of having to carry a bunch of AAs around... one would not get a ton of AA eneloops over the Accupower D variety? Pros and cons?

#2 Is there a cheaper alternative to the Accupower D cell for my maglite builds? Meaning another D cell that you guys think puts out good energy at a cheaper price?

#3 Do I need a charger with the fancy displays that show me everything that is happening with the batteries? If so, why? If there is a good reason such as, "You'll ruin your $100 worth of batteries if you do it wrong" I'm all ears! haha (i do own a MultiMeter)

#4 What can go wrong with a cheapie charger? Should I just pony up and buy one of the pretty MH-C808M or something like that?

Thanks for your responses! I love CPF!

 

[hk dave]

Anybody?

 

[gswitter]

#1 Is there a reason outside of the obvious need of having to carry a bunch of AAs around... one would not get a ton of AA eneloops over the Accupower D variety? Pros and cons?

Probably just comes down to price, capacity and simplicity. What are your goals/needs for the lights? Are you going to be content with a 3D host running on 3xAA? Is 2Ah sufficient capacity for your needs? If not, do you mind carrying extra cells, and have you factored that into your price comparison? Using 2AA->D parallel adapters is an inexpensive option for increasing capacity, but that will double your battery cost and your charging requirements.

#2 Is there a cheaper alternative to the Accupower D cell for my maglite builds? Meaning another D cell that you guys think puts out good energy at a cheaper price?

There are plenty of decent non-LSD D cells available for significantly less, and given their initial capacity, even if they sit unused for months they'll probably still have more usable capacity than fresh AA's. I've been happy with the 12Ah Titanium cells from Battery Junction, and others have mentioned the Powerizers from Battery Space (there's an 8/$50 deal on the latter).

#3 Do I need a charger with the fancy displays that show me everything that is happening with the batteries? If so, why? If there is a good reason such as, "You'll ruin your $100 worth of batteries if you do it wrong" I'm all ears! haha (i do own a MultiMeter)

I'm no expert on this, so I'll leave it for someone else.

If we were talking about AA, people would probably chime in about the need for conditioning charges, but I'm not convinced there's any benefit for D cells, since even the MH-C808M only charges them at .2C or less.

#4 What can go wrong with a cheapie charger? Should I just pony up and buy one of the pretty MH-C808M or something like that?

The big advantage of the MH-C808M over the other off-the-shelf chargers is the charging rate. The other common D cell chargers (as far as I can tell, the AccuPower, Vanson, Titanium, etc-branded chargers are pretty much the same) have a maximum charging rate of 700mA, versus 2A for the MH-C808M. Makes a big difference for D cells.

 

[Nubo]

Anybody?

Seems you understand the trade-offs.

AAs give you a lighter flashlight, shorter runtime, initial investment.

Ds give you a heavier flashlight, lots of runtime, costly.

Whether or not you need LSD batteries depends on how you intend to use the light -- how long will it sit, and how often do you want to deal with charging.

If you want real-world example, I gave my wife a 4-D maglite, with a Malkoff drop-in. I went with the Accupower LSD - D cells. The use is as an in-vehicle light. So it needed gobs of runtime, ability to sit for months and still provide good service, and far-spaced charging schedule. Anything more demanding and she probably wouldn't want to deal with it. Gave it to her Christmas 2008, so far so good. I charge it every 3 or 4 months just to be sure. She loves it and it gets good use.

 

[Radiophile]

I'm a cheap ******* so I've thought about this before. If levels aren't necessary, and you won't be using the flashlights a lot, you can direct drive the LED with alkalines. The output won't be as high as NiMH batteries, but it'll still be pretty bright and you won't have to worry about recharging.

If you really want rechargeables then there are some cheaper options than the Accupower D cells, but I decided to go with them. This site has a good deal on them right now:

http://www.bearwobble.com/Size-D-2p...scharge-NiMH-Rechargeable-Batteries_p_11.html

Cheaper non-LSD D NiMH batteries:

http://www.batteryspace.com/nimhrechargeablecelldsize12v10000mahrechargeablebattery8pcs.aspx

To charge either at C/10 you could use a simple 1 AH 6V wall wart adapter and this battery holder:

http://www.batteryspace.com/batteryholder3xdcellwith624awgwireleadsendtoend-rohscompliant.aspx

 

[csa]

Interesting set of tradeoffs. I was always under the impression that the stacks of AA sized batteries in adaptors were primarily to get the voltage up. At least, it's been that way in all my builds.

 

[hk dave]

Has anyone know of a review or have experience with the Titanium 12000 mAH cells sold at batteryjunction? Few bucks cheaper then the Accupowers... seems like they'd be a good compromise but I've no experience with them.

 

[Databyter]

For flashlights especially I like the LSD.

Five Mega also sells Batt. holders specifically for Maglites here http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=244640
and here http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=198633

They can be series and parallel holders or combinations of the two for just about any combination/voltage and don't forget you can use copper rod for blanks as well.

This is a one time investment and the quality I have found pays for itself over time.

Additionally with these packs you don't need to unload to charge, just throw your smart charger on the male Jack included with these holders and plug them in. The time savings alone makes these much more worthwhile. I load my holders and then, in my mind they are packs and I charge them that way, which is also less of a hassle and worry for applications where you need balanced cells within a pack.

Ideally for anything under 4-5 Amps, Eneloops beat non LSD D's in my opinion, becase you aren't gaining much when your not using the light. and in an emergency you have a bright emergency light for days, weeks with rationed use, without charging.

 

[hk dave]

Woah those are awesome! I wonder if it would increase voltage too much to work with my SSC P7 I though... I will be using a shiningbeam driver. Anyone know if its safe to use the fivemega setup with my SSC P7 DSXOI with shiningbeam 3 mode 2.5amp driver?

 

[Databyter]

Now that I look at it closer, it would be hard to get the right voltage range in a 3D configuration. For 2 D bored out you could use 8X eneloops 4serial 2 Parrelell or something like that.

I haven't done any P7 Mods yet and don't know the specs on the driver, but I think most drivers can handle an input within 3-4 Nimh's wired in series, or about 3.6-4.8 V. Some can go much higher on input, check the specs.

I had thought there were more options for an unbored 3D light, but it makes sense that for a serial/Parallel pack you need to have an even number of columns. Three wide fits in the tube without boring, but is an odd number. 4 wide packs are made in serial/parallel modes but do not fit in your host unless it was quad bored or honed out.

You can always use blanks to take voltage down, but in this case you would have to take so many cells out for a 3 D unbored host, that it would lose all advantages in capacity.

 

[hk dave]

Guess I'll just make it easy on myself and do D NIMHs

 

[McAllan]

To charge either at C/10 you could use a simple 1 AH 6V wall wart adapter and this battery holder:

http://www.batteryspace.com/batteryholder3xdcellwith624awgwireleadsendtoend-rohscompliant.aspx

It's not that easy. The power supply needs to be current regulated. That is with current draw at 1 amp the voltage sags. A lot of power supplies capable of withstanding 1 amp continuous draw will be destroyed if used that simple. Because they can deliver more than 1 amp for short periods of time and they don't sag before considerably much over 1 amp.

For that use you either need a current limiter in between such as a simple LM117 (from my memory) construction with a resistor and a heat sink. But then you need a 9 volt power supply.
Or you could use a hobby charger such as one used for RC cars etc. That would be fine and if your battery holder can take it you can get cheap and easy chargers that charges with 3-4-5 amp and auto senses cell count etc. If charged that fast the cells must however be at same state - not using one cell in a thing and then charge it together with the other almost full cells etc.