Throw frustration!!!!

MrNaz

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Some of you may recall my search for a good thrower to replace my bunch of $15 Skyray 1jc8 XR-E lights. Trying to find something reasonably priced, I was unable to find anything in the $30-$40 range.

So I bit the bullet and bought an Armytek Predator Pro 2.5 XPG2 in warm.

To my horror, I found that my 4 year old, $15 Q5 based lights out-throws this current model $120 light. From my balcony, I shine it about 300m across the marina, and the $15 light has a brighter hotspot on the side of the warehouse.

So really. Is there a light with a 40mm bezel that can out throw my 2010 era $15 cheap light? There must be! And I'm not talking about $300 custom lights. I want something that I can take hunting and not have to worry about scratching the finish on it or even breaking it.
 

LowFlux

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XR-E has a smaller die compared to the XPG2. Maybe a de-dome from Vinh is in order to tighten things up further.
 

NutSAK

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lux @ 1 meter for the Predator Pro is 34,000. You should be able to find plenty of lights that have better lux than that for well under the price of the Predator Pro.
 

thedoc007

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XR-E has a smaller die compared to the XPG2. Maybe a de-dome from Vinh is in order to tighten things up further.

I have a Predator, and I asked Vinh about it. He said it is 50/50 whether or not he can even get it open. If he can get it open, he can definitely de-dome...but he warned me that the beam might be ugly as a result. Just something to consider. I do suggest that the OP e-mail Vinh...he is an expert throw guy, and he will probably have something that will work without breaking the bank.
 

Rod911

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Do you have any soldering skills? How about around a 45mm sized head? If so...

Get yourself a C8 host (XinTD C8 or Convoy C8), if it didn't already have an SMO reflector, find one. Then get a driver that's at least 2.8A. Pair it up with a de-domed XP-G2 of your choice on a copper MCPCB (sinkpad or Noctigon).

Add all of the above, and you get a very decent thrower in a compact size. Feel free to put more amps through the XP-G2 and you get a throwier and brighter light in the process. If you don't destroy any drivers or LEDs, you could get away spending up to $30 with this setup.
 

bondr006

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I really like my Sunwayman T40CS. Got the latest version with an XM-L2 and boy does it throw. It can easily do a soccer field and a half, and it was only about $85.00 at Going Gear with the CPF discount. One of the best throwers I've ever had, which surprised me. I been around for awhile and have had lots of lights.

SAM_0604_zpsc530c1e3.jpg
 

MrNaz

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So there is nothing that can match a $15 light from 2010 other than custom jobs?

Wow.

I really like my Sunwayman T40CS. Got the latest version with an XM-L2 and boy does it throw. It can easily do a soccer field and a half, and it was only about $85.00 at Going Gear with the CPF discount. One of the best throwers I've ever had, which surprised me. I been around for awhile and have had lots of lights.

I need a 40mm bezel or smaller, so I can mount it on my hunting rifle.
 

MrNaz

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Can you post a pic/pics of that $15 2010 light?

http://budgetlightforum.com/node/1547
http://www.dx.com/p/skyray-1jc8-cre...t-with-strap-black-1-18650-44487#.U5wDrLGM7fA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MGL_cyQypk

That's a review, where I bought it from, and a YouTube vid with some beamshots.
At the moment, this $15 piece of made in China trash is the best weapon light I've seen, at any price (aside from the fact that it's so fragile that a 0.5m drop onto the bezel has broken 3 of them).

- Naz.
 

kj2

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http://budgetlightforum.com/node/1547
http://www.dx.com/p/skyray-1jc8-cre...t-with-strap-black-1-18650-44487#.U5wDrLGM7fA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MGL_cyQypk

That's a review, where I bought it from, and a YouTube vid with some beamshots.
At the moment, this $15 piece of made in China trash is the best weapon light I've seen, at any price (aside from the fact that it's so fragile that a 0.5m drop onto the bezel has broken 3 of them).

- Naz.
Seeing the video, it has indeed quite some throw. But can't notice any spill with it.
So for throw it's a nice light and cheap, but don't look for quality and, probably, specially not for runtime. I still think the Predator Pro V2.5 Cool White is one of the best throwers in the 40mm class.
 

FPSRelic

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Hello fellow Aussie and throw lover :wave:

I share your frustration. From the years of hunting (for throwy lights) I've done, XR-E seems to be the throwiest LED you can get for lights with smaller sized bezels. The reason for this is LED die size - the smaller the die size, the more concentrated the light beam is naturally, and as far as I'm aware, XR-E has the smallest die in the CREE stable. The newer emitters have bigger die sizes that produce more light, but are naturally more floody, and need bigger reflectors or optics to concentrate the beam.

You could try something that uses XP-E2 or the OSRAM OSLON Square LED, which I believe Surefire uses in their current Scoutlight weapon lights (I'm guessing since you like DX lights then you're probably not interested in paying for those, although IMO they're worth it). Alternatively you could try to find another XR-E light that uses an aspheric lens, although this will probably remove any flood from the beam.

EDIT: Surefire may use XP-E in their scout lights, not XP-E2
 
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Tmack

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With throwers, the size of the reflector plays a huge part.
The Fenix tk61vn is currently the furthest throwing reflector light I know of, but it's larger than what you're looking for.


Of you need big throw in a small package, you should consider a modified light.
The eagtac s200cvn is modified by vinhnguyen54 and throws much further than stock lights in its size class.

Your size restrictions are limiting your throw capabilities.

Looks like "poppy" and I are thinking the same thing :)
I have the s200cvn and it's a little beast. Throws better than stock lights twice it's size.
Priced well too.
 

degarb

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This is why lights need to be rated in candela, as well as lumens. The candela (and current) is far more important than lumens. (Dead batteries, mean no light; too dim candela, means you cannot do the task. While lack of flood means you just have to do more light sweeping, which you anyway with eyes as you look around.)

All Lights need to be rated: Each settings' initial current>lumen, lux at 1 meter, hot-spot arc angle, corona angle (medium candela) Plus, kelvin, cri, bin of led, flashlight dimensions/weight and type of controller (with characteristics, including efficiency).

Would that be so hard? I think Fenix comes the closest to an ideal of specification disclosure. And so, I am more willing to splurge on their stuff.

My basement is littered with unused lights that I wanted to like, however, there was that one tiny spec that was not meeting my needs. Then there are the few lights I love, use daily, and meet every spec. Unfortunately, these favored lights of mine are the home builds of mine, or the modded lights. Probably, the only ready made light that really meets every spec. is the the Fenix HP25 headlamp. And while the 2011 Fenix hp25 xpg (basically, a 4 AA p60 smo with fenix buck controller, with well chosen runtime settings) is slightly outdated (not anymore my brightest/longest running headlamp), it still is hardly out modded; preferred, still, by my workers, over other headlamp choices; all, because it met the spec, perfectly, off the shelf. (This rule of specs/needs also goes for my fixed/corded work lighting. Where I am just getting rid of hundreds of wasted dollars on inadequate/inefficient Sears and Depot lights. )

Of my lights (where I draw the line at 2x18650), the Fenix TK 35 is my best thrower (at useful current/runtime). My $10 rayovac 2 AA xp-c is probably the throw king 9k candela at half an amp (2 AA gets fairly regulated flat output for 4 hours). The xr-c and xp-c's always stomped the butt of the xr-e (and xp-e) in color and throw. My first xr-c from walmart in 2008 made me wonder if the Rebel 100's and xr-e lights were even turned on. Though, the xr-c doesn't cover enough of the eye's cone vision unless pushed to the current limit to get some spill that is marginally acceptably wide enough. The real trick is to never buy a light without at least a 26 mm smooth reflector. ... I don't see how you can go wrong with an xpg2, good smo, and 18650 setup, for throw/output/runtime balance. The xm-l2, only does it for me in the 2x18650 (power of 8AA, weight of three AA), and all flashlights of this genre are really too heavy for my tastes, including my tk35 (which I never use the high, anyway, as my soul can hear the batteries being sucked down too fast).
 
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