USL Field Test Thread, Pt 2

[Codeman]

This is a continuation of USL Field test thread.

Thanks to darkgear.com for hosting the Marshmallow Movie.

 

[Codeman]

[ QUOTE ]
js said:
Ray,

The light meter thing could be responsible, or your pack could have lost some capacity. Be careful not to overdischarge.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks, Jim. I was concerned I had done just that when I did my bacon test last week.

[ QUOTE ]
bwaites said:
Ray,

Noticeable dimming to the eye requires a loss of about 30-50% of the light output, I suspect you simply are being very cautious using the light meter.

If your eye hadn't detected anything, then you still had a ways to go.

Just don't let the pack go flat! Even if you do, the cells seem to handle it reasonably well, at least for a few times.

One of the nice things about these bulbs is that it takes a real voltage level to drive them. The bulbs will generally go dead, even when there is a significant charge on the cells. I have a couple 9 cell, 1185 packs and have deliberately killed them to see how the cells recover. So far I haven't damaged either the run time or voltage capacity. I DO NOT recommend doing this, I have done so for research purposes only.

Bill

[/ QUOTE ]

Would you have to run it until the bulb no longer lit to let the pack go flat?

That reminds me, I had someone at work hold their arm about 3" away, wanting to know how hot it was. I moved back to about 15" or so. Good thing, too! She all of a sudden went "OWW"! She, too, was glad I'd backed up!

She now refers to as a weapon. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/evilgrin07.gif

The USL could have been a $$ saving driving light last night. I hit an Ultimate Pothole on the way home. I could easily see where I'd knocked a balance weight off of the wheel. This morning, I found out that it had also knocked the alignment out and broke the strut.

I'm now thinking we need a headlight bracket for the USL. I thought my 2000 Monte Carlo's headlights were pretty decent until Bill sent me the USL. Now I have an urge to strap it on my hood and going drivin'!

 

[bwaites]

My kids think it is hilarious when I hold it out the moonroof and it overpowers both headlights!

Technically, when the light is noticeably dim it is possible to reverse one of the cells if it is quite a bit weaker than the others. In practice, I haven't been able to do it with my 9 cell packs, but all of these packs (USL and Mag85) are reasonably new and less likely to have that happen.

As the cells age, it might become more likely. I am going to do a little experimenting and see how many cells, and thus voltage and current, it takes to drive the 62138 to noticeable levels.

On a more useful note, the USL serves as the perfect nighttime anti-tailgating light for those people who think that they have to have an intimate personal relationship with you to follow you!

Bill

 

[naromtap]

[ QUOTE ]
bwaites said:
My kids think it is hilarious when I hold it out the moonroof and it overpowers both headlights!


Bill

[/ QUOTE ]

I have Zenon Gas Headlights on my car & it will be interesting to see if the USL puts out similar light to those, I suspect my headlights will probably put out more light.

 

[bwaites]

Luminous output on headlights is limited in the US, I don't know the exact numbers, but it doesn't matter what the light source is, they can only put out that amount.

Most beams here are 55 watt bulbs in the diffusing lens typical of car lights. Thus the beam is diffused a lot and not well focused, but does have fairly wide spread. (See the USL's over high beam pics in the USL thread in B/S/T).

Bill

 

[Paul_DW]

[ QUOTE ]
naromtap said:
I have Zenon Gas Headlights on my car & it will be interesting to see if the USL puts out similar light to those, I suspect my headlights will probably put out more light.

[/ QUOTE ]

My TL85 puts out more than my headlights, albeit standard 55W Halogens.

 

[tvodrd]

I think I have the ability to lock exposure on my cam now, and set everything up for a major comparison of lamps/heads/competitors on the "indoor range." The previous owner of my house extended his 2-car garage twice, so my playground is right at 80 feet between sectional rollups. ( /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif )

I can't turn the cam off or I loose exposure lock, so things have to be organized in advance. I had six shots planned, to include a turbo head (the one Charlie posted) and a couple alternate lamps ( /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif ) Bill sent me. I set the cam (Canon S500) at 3X optical zoom. Of course, feces occurred. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mecry.gif

First, the stock USL (All at ~75 feet):

The SF M6/ MN-21 HOLA with fairly (couple minutes runtime)fresh cells:

The stock lamp with the turbohead:

Beastie: (Used to lock exposure per Ray's recommendation.)

The next shot was to be the turbohead with the HLX 64625 transverse filament lamp. I burned my fingers through two layers of paper pulling the stock lamp prior to attempting installation of the 64625. On attempting to push it into the socket, the socket assembly moved rearwards in the lights body. I thought I had it in, but after screwing the turbohead on, no joy/light. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mecry.gif The lamp is (visually) ok. I will need placement dimentions to reposition the socket from the front so I can retighten the setscrew. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif

With out having to edit, I just noticed that the 64625 lamp broke a pin loose during my instillation attempt! It unplugged just fine but now, looking at it in its bag, one pin is detached. Kind of bizarre- at least the pin ain't still in the socket!

All of the set-up and manipulations for this post were performed under the illumination of a little CR2 LED light set on "Low Beam." /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Larry

 

[bwaites]

UHOH!

That was my last 64625, but I think Ray may have a few.

The Beast looks cool, that sucker is BRIGHT!

I think the 64625 with the Big Head will be close, when I compare the stock with the Big Head to the Beast.

I come to admire Surefire more everytime I see on of these demos! The truth is that the Beast must be underated.

Here is my reasoning. The Bulb output of the Osram is more than double the output of WA's 1185, which is 1100 plus lumens at 10.8 volts. That puts the torch lumens at around 2000, which is what the Beast is rated at. The Beast is significantly brighter than the stock USL, thus it is putting out a lot more than the 2000 Lumens it is rated at,

But, I am very happy with the USL's performance, about 80-90% of the output for a little more than 10% of the price!

Bill

 

[KevinL]

Didn't I hint at the headlight replacement/taillight enhancement applications of the USL in the last thread.... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Anyway back to the point, those beamshots are amazing. The USL provides an amazing wash of light but the Beast has this incredibly bright center spot as shown by the chair.

As car headlamps go, my favorite 55/60W H4 Osram Silverstars (64193-SVS) are rated for 1600 bulb lumens on high beam, 1000 bulb lumens otherwise. That's 960 output lumens (high) and 600 after applying the derating formula of 60%. Even doubling up thsoe numbers, ahh.. the USL takes them and smacks them around a little /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[ QUOTE ]
Codeman said:
I'm now thinking we need a headlight bracket for the USL. I thought my 2000 Monte Carlo's headlights were pretty decent until Bill sent me the USL. Now I have an urge to strap it on my hood and going drivin'!

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey, Surefire built a special edition of the Beast for vehicle mounting. How about a Special Edition USL designed for long runtime, vehicle mounted, water-cooled, 12V powered not by a NiMH pack but a LVR regulation circuit and tied into the vehicle's electrical system..... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif

Next thing we know...

[email protected]

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/huh.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif




Oh yeah and yet another edit, I just purchased Jim's awesome 12V cig-lighter-socket cable for my Hitec CG340. Note to all USL buyers - the CG340 comes with large clamp clips, which doesn't lend itself easily to being plugged into a car power socket. You'll need his cable to plug it in. If you're interested please find his B/S/T thread for the M6-R signup and register your interest, the cable can be purchased by itself ($12) and is a worthwhile investment. It can be shipped together with the USL.

Codeman, I might need to trouble you again.. my USL shipment will include the cable, if you need to keep track of Yet Another Option. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

I'm plugging the Hitec into my computer. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[Codeman]

Larry,

Great job on the photos! I've got to run out, but I'm going to really look these over when I get back. Getting the exposure locked gives these shots some real meaning. Thank you for taking the time to work things out!

I'll put a couple of 64625's in the mail, Priority, this morning. Hopefully you'll get them on Monday, or Tuesday at the latest!

Kevin, which cable are you referring to? You'll definitely get the USL to charger cable. Since you requested no Power Supply, I don't know whether Bill's providing a cable for the charger to power supply or not. Is that the one you mean?

BTW - I had planned on some testing last night. Between thunderstorms and getting a set of 5 2D and 2C old Chromies in the mail, I got sidetracked last night. Yeah, the old style Ray-O-Vacs. I was in Saudi Arabia when my grandfather died in '96. Although I did get several things to remember him with, I didn't get the one thing I wanted most: one of his Ray-O-Vac 2D Sportsman. I now have a surrogate, though! I just had to spend some time with it and my memories last night. I was shocked, though to remember the wonderful lock-off, momentary on, constant on switch of these lights. I and was totally caught off guard by the orange peel reflector! No wonder he only sold that particular light, and the green plastic Ray-O-Vac 6V in his store. He would have loved CPF and the tools/toys we have today!

 

[KevinL]

[ QUOTE ]
Codeman said:
Kevin, which cable are you referring to? You'll definitely get the USL to charger cable. Since you requested no Power Supply, I don't know whether Bill's providing a cable for the charger to power supply or not. Is that the one you mean?

BTW - I had planned on some testing last night. Between thunderstorms and getting a set of 5 2D and 2C old Chromies in the mail, I got sidetracked last night. Yeah, the old style Ray-O-Vacs. I was in Saudi Arabia when my grandfather died in '96. Although I did get several things to remember him with, I didn't get the one thing I wanted most: one of his Ray-O-Vac 2D Sportsman. I now have a surrogate, though! I just had to spend some time with it and my memories last night. I was shocked, though to remember the wonderful lock-off, momentary on, constant on switch of these lights. I and was totally caught off guard by the orange peel reflector! No wonder he only sold that particular light, and the green plastic Ray-O-Vac 6V in his store. He would have loved CPF and the tools/toys we have today!

[/ QUOTE ]

Correct, I'll get the USL to charger cable, but I need charger-to-automotive-12V-socket cable and Jim did a really nice one for plugging into cig lighters. This is why I need it.

20 years ago, I remember my granddad showing me his chrome Eveready lights.. he left us a few months before I became a CPF member, but one thing is for sure - I carried the Surefire E1e+MN01 when responding to the call from the hospital that came at 1:30AM and I am proud of that.. who knows, perhaps he did start something after all... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

No one knows what became of those lights. Nobody even remembers them except me /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thinking.gif

Oh, and here's a thought for my updated signature (when the USL arrives) since there have been a few calls for me to change it.

"BREAKFAST BEGINS AT 2000 LUMENS" /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crackup.gif

 

[bwaites]

Codeman,

Now you've got me looking for those old lights!

Hmmmm....orange peeled reflectors, huh!

Bill

 

[js]

Ray,

Kevin is talking about a power cable which I am making up for the M6-R or USL charging systems. It plugs into the cigarette lighter socket, or whatever it is called these days, and you plug your charger power cord into the other end. Bill and I will be using the same connection scheme for the main build run USL's and my M6-R's. For the field testers, he put banana plugs on the battery charger power cord, and they just plug into the pyramid power supply. (Radio Shack sells a 12V auto plug to dual banana jack adaptor, BTW, in case you want to power your Triton from the car.) But for the main run, the power supplies will have a short length of cable with ring lugs which get screwed down to the screw terminals, and on the other end is a male molex connector. This looks like a Tamiya plug, if you've ever seen one of those. Anyway, the Triton or Hitec will have the female molex on the end of it's power cord. So you can plug into the power supply, or move your charger to your car and plug into the auto adaptor cable, which plugs into the cigarette lighter socket.

Clear?

Anyway, for all USL buyers, I am offering this cable for $12 with free shipping, as I will include the cables in the same flat-rate boxes i will use to send Bill the battery packs. Then Bill will include the auto adaptor cables with the USL orders. Whoever is interested may sign up in the M6-R signup thread in the modders B/S/T forum. Please note that the free shipping only applies to USL people. I don't know who else besides the M6-R or USL people would be interested in any case, but you never know.

The cable is made from a good quality 12V plug, which actually works well (i.e. stays securely) in even the shorter 12V power sockets of the newer cars, and the connections are direct solder connections to 16 gauge, heavy silicone rubber jacketed fine strand count wire, which then goes to the molex connector. The metal contacts are both crimped and soldered to the ends of the wire, and include a strain relief crimp. The nice thing about the molex connector system is that both the male and female connector contacts are fully insulated and covered, and they will handle 12 amps.

My apologies for hijacking this thread a bit, but Kevin brought it up so I thought I would provide detailed information.

Larry,

Nice shots! Seems like you're doing just fine with that camera of yours! I really appreciate those beautiful pics. Thanks so much.

 

[Codeman]

Thanks, Jim.

I wonder if we need to post a simple diagram showing how everything hooks up? It might be helpful to those folks who already own a charger and/or power supply.

Bill, I assume that the two Ray-O-Vac chromies were some of the last ones made, since they both have orange peel. I just noticed something bizarre with one of the Everready's, the 2C. It's got a black switch body that has a yellow rubber button cap. Outwardly, it looks brand new. I suspect the reason why is because someone left batteries in until they'd leaked everywhere. The switch, however, still seems to work - at least it's not corroded to the point it doesn't freely click. What's bizarre, though, is it's plastic reflector. It is clear! With the light off, you can look through the lens AND reflector and you see the inner surface of the chromed body. I've got to get it cleaned up and somehow working, just to see how a clear reflector actually works. This one may, if I can find a replacement reflector and lens and get the interior and switch cleaned up, play host to my first attempt at building a light.

With shipping, I got all five for less than $11! For a working Ray-O-Vac 2D Sportman (far left), I would have paid twice that. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Oh, the USL will have some competition tonight. I picked up a couple of new lights this morning, so stay tuned!

 

[Paul_DW]

Ok, I just need to get this right. Removing the sidespill of the Stock USL & the M6 HOLA, you get this for the Stock USL :

and for the M6 HOLA, this :

I'm sure camera's play tricks and all, but I AM confused /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

 

[tvodrd]

Good call, Paul! I noticed it too. I had the cam on top of a 5' step ladder and the lights on the ladder's "paint can" shelf one step below. The lights won't lay flat so I had to hold them during the shots. I believe the M6 was pointed downwards somewhat in comparison to the other shots. Too much fumbling on my part as I was aiming by eyeball. The rear door is ~75 feet from the camera! I will stand by my statement that the stock USL absolutely eats the M6/HOLA for breakfast, lunch and dinner! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Larry

 

[bwaites]

One of the problems with beam shots IS this kind of a disparity.

Both Jim Sexton and Larry, the only 2 to chime in so far who have both lights, say that in real usage, the M6 isn't in the same class as the USL. Since I haven't seen an M6 yet, I have to withhold judgement and go on their word.

The other point I would make is that those people with Mag85's who have seen both are blown away by the USL.

Both the Tiger85 and Mag85 put out more light than the M6, especially if the M6 is being run on 123's and has been on for more than a few minutes.

I think that the focal point of the M6 is somewhat deceptive in how bright it is. Many talk about the wall of light effect vs. the throw of the M6, but it is pretty obvious that the M6 has a substantial hotspot, and that the USL has a serious wall of light effect if you talk about all the spill. I am a little surprised that the BigHead doesn't show a little hotter spot, but that is consistent with axial bulbs.

Bill

 

[bwaites]

Paul, also, I think, as Larry mentioned, that we might not have a targeted a spot with the USL vs. M6.

Check out the glare off the metal strip on the edge of the table to the left of the chair, where the M6 seems to be spot on the chair, (check the edges of the table on both sides).

Bill

 

[Codeman]

What about the overall illumination? The USL's spill makes the M6/HOLA seem whimpy. If I was looking for bad guys and had both, the M6 would definitely be backup!

Look at the stock USL and the Beast shots. In particular,

<ul type="square">[*]The machette on the far right (thx Bill!)
[*]the checkered flag in the upper right (not the one closer to center, the one on the far right that you can BARELY see with the Beast)
[*]the shiny disks on the upper left (are those old hard disk platters, Larry?)
[*]The white beam at the very top[/list]
These all seem to show the USL throwing a stronger spill than the Beast. The Beast's spot may be brighter, but I don't think it warrants the loss of all that spill. Well, I guess that depends on the intended use.

Sure, the Beast may throw farther, but does that really outweigh the USL Wall O' Light?

For my money, the stock USL is a very clear winner! Add on a 3" reflector, and I'll definitely take the USL, be able to buy everyone on the USL list a steak dinner and I'd still have some money left over!

Too bad we don't have an integrating sphere handy! Or a USL reflector of the same diameter as the Beast's! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I also think an argument can be made that the stock USL betters both the M6/HOLA and the Beast for the very reason that you don't have to have it's beam perfectly centered on a target. If you set aside the Beast's greater weight, think about actual field use of these 3. If you are physically tired, mentally tired, distracted, under stress, have an injury, or are simply not good at pointing, which of the 3 is most likely to illuminate a target for you? Especially if it's a target that you need to see but that you may not know is there. What about multiple targets that are apart? The USL gives you a better chance at seeing them all and seeing them all at the same time.

The Beast is obviously a great light, with a specific purpose. The USL does well for itself in a direct comparison for that specific purpose, but it excels from a more utilitarian view. Well, for 5-10 minutes it does. But then, how many USL's could I carry for the cost a Beast? 8 probably. Now my runtime is probably better than the Beast, though I do have a bit more to carry...

Okay...I'm bored. It is now dark here, but all the neighbors are up, so I'm killing time with useless banter.

 

[tvodrd]

Calm down guys. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif The USL speaks for itself! There will be more beam shots with hopefully better content quality. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif Paul just pointed out some obvious issues with the shots which I didn't notice until after I posted them. My target was the back garage door at 75 feet, and "eyeball aiming" with as large a hot spot as they have at that distance didn't work out right. I wish I had a white wall, 100' wide and 100' away with no clutter in between. Then I wouldn't need to lock exposure! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif

Larry