Warms and Neutrals

[kito109654]

Quick(ish) background:
I became aware of CPF when searching for a weaponlight a while ago, something I found quite easily and I'm happy with in it's role (Fenix TK11 R2). I've been turned off by LED lights for a while because of the color temperature but I remembered visiting this site and noticing an "incandescent" subforum so I thought I'd take a look and see if technology has come along from the Maglites I used when I was younger.

Fast forward to now:
I found some nice incan stuff but what really sparked my attention was something I'd never seen before, neutral white and warm tint LEDs. Durability and longevity of LED without the nasty green/blue, ice cold, stark white color! I have no experience with these but looking at beamshots and comparisons I think that the warm tints appeal to me the most and will be most enjoyable for me as every day task lights, but neutral ain't bad either. I've found small lights, I have a Quark Mini 123 in WW on the way and plan to buy a Quark Mini CR2 in NW or WW as well. I also plan on getting my hands on a Lummi or two in their warm tint offerings. Where you come in is with "larger" lights. I'm having a hard time finding some bigger lights in warm or even neutral tints. I'm looking for an outdoor-use light with some "throw" capability similar to my TK11 and at least the 200ish lumen mark. Hopefully the light will be in the 2xCR123 / 18650 size. I'm aware of the Quark Turbo 123*2 in WW but I was looking to try out some other brands as well. Thanks.

 

[csshih]

there have been very few warm lights on the market.. I believe Jetbeam made a neutral jet III M. (not warm)

 

[kito109654]

Okay, I'm seeing that some Jeatbeam models are available with the "Q3" emitter but it's referred to as Neutral in some places and Warm in others.
The question would then be is Q3 warm or neutral, or does it depend on something else?

 

[duboost]

a few off the top of my head

Fenix TK20
Jetbeam offers most of their models in a neutral tint (I believe even the latest version of the M1X?)
Eagletac also offers just about all their lights in a neutral version as well
I believe Dereelight has some also
And of course you can look into P60 hosts, as there are a variety of warm/neutral P60 options (Malkoff & Nailbender drop ins to name a few quality ones)

 

[kito109654]

Okay, TK20..looks like a nice color but man is that light ugly. LOL, call me superficial.
Check this link out. Is it errantly being referred to as "warm?" (XR-E Q3-5A) whatever that means.
http://goinggear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=1061

P60 huh? Seems like a good excuse to buy a Surefire.

 

[kaichu dento]

The question would then be is Q3 warm or neutral, or does it depend on something else?

Q3 would indicate relative brightness and a number like 5A, 3C or 7B would indicate tint. The new warm run of Quarks will be 7A or 7B. You might want to keep in mind that if you find that you like a particular light and tint, you can always have a light modded to the emitter you prefer.

 

[kito109654]

Q3 would indicate relative brightness and a number like 5A, 3C or 7B would indicate tint. The new warm run of Quarks will be 7A or 7B. You might want to keep in mind that if you find that you like a particular light and tint, you can always have a light modded to the emitter you prefer.

THANK YOU! That helps very much.

 

[Henk_Lu]

Okay, TK20..looks like a nice color but man is that light ugly. LOL, call me superficial.
Check this link out. Is it errantly being referred to as "warm?" (XR-E Q3-5A) whatever that means.
http://goinggear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=1061

P60 huh? Seems like a good excuse to buy a Surefire.

I bought bored Surefire hosts from Overready. Not quite cheap, but the best you can find for 18650, McClicky and UCL available as well as different bezels. If you don't plan to go 18650, a simple host may also do it.

If you go 18650, Nailbender has anything you want in his offers, I'm not sure what works with 2 x CR123A and what doesn't. I got an SST90/3000K high CRI, that's really warm and powerfull, well floddy beam. I also got an XP-G R3 5000K, that's just on the border from cool white to neutral white, perhaps not what you are after, but the loveliest cool tint I ever saw! There are 4000K as well, he even can put 2 XP-G in a module. You should also try the P4 high CRI, that's around 3700K IIRC, warm and special!

Dereelight offers the CL1H V4 in neutral white, but no warmies, they are kinda rare. Bare in mind that most neutral and warm lights on the market still use XR-E or XP-E emitters (Q2 - Q5), the XP-G are just about to come.

 

[jblackwood]

I know the OP is aware of the Quark Turbo WW. Just keep in mind, if you ever change your mind about not getting one, you won't be able to get them once they're gone. I have a non turbo, regular interface NEUTRAL Quark 2xAA that I used to absolutely love. I now absolutely love my Turbo WW, especially since I got a tailcap that lets it tailstand! :devil:

I'm not sure if Lummi sells warm tints, I have a Wee Ti that's neutral. It's nice, don't get me wrong, but after seeing 4sevens warm tint, there's nothing else like it! It's going to be hard buying any other lights that aren't WARM (not neutral) after having these lights. Neutral looks sickly in comparison. Strangely enough, I don't mind a good, pure white light or even blue hues while using warm tints. Funny, huh? It really is a matter of preference. One thing I still can't stand is GREEN! Ugh. I keep one light to remind me of what I do and don't like in a light: my Nitecore D10. Everything about the light is excellent except its green tint. Not too distracting by itself but it is evident whenever you turn on ANY other light.

 

[kito109654]

I know the OP is aware of the Quark Turbo WW. Just keep in mind, if you ever change your mind about not getting one, you won't be able to get them once they're gone. I have a non turbo, regular interface NEUTRAL Quark 2xAA that I used to absolutely love. I now absolutely love my Turbo WW, especially since I got a tailcap that lets it tailstand! :devil:

I'm not sure if Lummi sells warm tints, I have a Wee Ti that's neutral. It's nice, don't get me wrong, but after seeing 4sevens warm tint, there's nothing else like it! It's going to be hard buying any other lights that aren't WARM (not neutral) after having these lights. Neutral looks sickly in comparison. Strangely enough, I don't mind a good, pure white light or even blue hues while using warm tints. Funny, huh? It really is a matter of preference. One thing I still can't stand is GREEN! Ugh. I keep one light to remind me of what I do and don't like in a light: my Nitecore D10. Everything about the light is excellent except its green tint. Not too distracting by itself but it is evident whenever you turn on ANY other light.

My Qmini 123 WW just showed up today and I have changed my mind about the Turbo 123*2. :twothumbs I'll be picking one up, and probably some others from 4sevens until they are out of stock or until my wallet can't cope. This is exactly what I want in a light. Once the warms are gone I'll try some neutrals out so that I can get some stuff from other manufacturers. Until then, 4sevens has my wallet on lockdown. I abso-freakin-lutely love this LED color. The build quality isn't bad either. I wonder how their clickies feel.

 

[Swedpat]

Until now I have not seen any true neutral white LEDs, as well my Fenix TK20 and Quark neutral 123/AA2 are warm and not neutral. But these expressions are mixed quite much and it's not easy to know what is intended. Most neutral/warm LEDs still are farer from neutral than cool whites are.

 

[hatman]

What is it you like about the warms?

I have a new AA(2) turbo head on an AA body and, so far, I'm less than impressed with the tint (really YELLOW!), the brightness (not great compared to my Quark Ti) or throw (not so much.)

About all I can say is that, compared to my other Quarks, it is easier to read with while typing on my laptop in a dark room.

As soon as the sun sets, I'll give it a try in the park.

 

[kito109654]

What is it you like about the warms?

I have a new AA(2) turbo head on an AA body and, so far, I'm less than impressed with the tint (really YELLOW!), the brightness (not great compared to my Quark Ti) or throw (not so much.)

About all I can say is that, compared to my other Quarks, it is easier to read with while typing on my laptop in a dark room.

As soon as the sun sets, I'll give it a try in the park.

It's nothing more than personal preference of the color and how it makes things look in every day tasks. I know I don't like the nasty "cool white" temps but I didn't realize how much I'd love the "warm" color.
Trying to tack down the color (ie, "yellow" as you say) is going to be subjective so I won't try. Of course you will lose some overall output, that is to be expected and it doesn't bother me one bit. I like power but that extra bit of lumens doesn't really mean anything to me in every day use. Throw is also going to be lost...I'm not really sure why but the warm LED offerings from 4sevens seem to be more floody in general. For small EDC lights that is a good thing, IMO.

For throw I'm going to try the quark turbo, and if that's not enough then I'll compromise and try some "neutral" lights, like the ones Jetbeam offers.

 

[HDS_Systems]

Kito109654,

"Neutral" and "warm" are more general marketing terms than accurate descriptions of the actual output. For instance, our high CRI (color rendering index) LED lights happen to fall around 3700°K. Some call this warm white while others would call it neutral white.

Battery compartments can be configured for small size or long runtimes with rechargeability. You can take a look at the web site in the signature line below for full details.

Henry.

 

[kito109654]

Thanks for the clarification, and I'm slowly becoming aware of what you're saying when I look at the bin info and color temperatures associated with the bins. Better CRI is my practical reason for searching out "warm" lights, the other part of it is that I just plain like the incandescent look.

 

[jblackwood]

Until now I have not seen any true neutral white LEDs, as well my Fenix TK20 and Quark neutral 123/AA2 are warm and not neutral. But these expressions are mixed quite much and it's not easy to know what is intended. Most neutral/warm LEDs still are farer from neutral than cool whites are.

You might want to pick yourself a warm 4sevens light to compare to your neutral. Once you see the warms, you'll never mistake neutral for warm again!

 

[Jeff S.]

Kito, take a look at this...

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=3196208&postcount=1


The link shows a comparison beam-shot between HDS System's regular LED and their high CRI LED. I think you'll like their high CRI if you want the benefits of an LED with a more traditional incandescent color.

 

[Swedpat]

You might want to pick yourself a warm 4sevens light to compare to your neutral. Once you see the warms, you'll never mistake neutral for warm again!

I have a Quark 123 and AA both in neutral, also a Fenix TK20. There are a slight difference between the tints of the Quarks and the Fenix, but none of them I perceive as neutral, but more to brown-beige. Not bad tints at all very comfortable.
Also my thought about the neutral/warms to be farer from true neutral than cool white is based on that they often (if I am correct) has a index of around 4000K when cool white often is 6000K. Compared to the sun with 5500K, which is considered as the true neutral white, the cool white are closer. Anyway if one look at the numbers.
I tried to put together the beams of a warm/neutral light and a cool white. The result really seemed to be very nice neutral!

Regards, Patric

 

[kito109654]

Kito, take a look at this...

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=3196208&postcount=1


The link shows a comparison beam-shot between HDS System's regular LED and their high CRI LED. I think you'll like their high CRI if you want the benefits of an LED with a more traditional incandescent color.

Thanks for the link, you're right, I do like that color a lot. Now I have to convince myself that light is worth getting after a good value like the WW Mini 123, when it doesn't put out any more lumens and is much bigger, although I can appreciate the very nice looking build quality, I've heard many good reviews of the Ra. I'm really looking for something with some more power (2xCR123 / 2xRCR123 / 18650) to go along with the increase in size.

 

[Jeff S.]

Thanks for the link, you're right, I do like that color a lot. Now I have to convince myself that light is worth getting after a good value like the WW Mini 123, when it doesn't put out any more lumens and is much bigger, although I can appreciate the very nice looking build quality, I've heard many good reviews of the Ra. I'm really looking for something with some more power (2xCR123 / 2xRCR123 / 18650) to go along with the increase in size.

You're welcome. I have a Ra Clicky 170, and will be getting a custom warm emitter Ra Clicky soon. (I also cannot wait for an HDS System headlamp).

As for power, I think you'll find that Ra Clicky's are plenty bright. Though I've never owned a warm emitter, I've read several opinions that claim they actually seem brighter because they make colors "pop" more. Further, HDS System markets out-the-front lumens and each flashlight is calibrated. They have a focus on efficiency and utility. Lastly, as far as durability, in my opinion Ra Clicky's can't be beat. To illustrate, I just used mine to search the bottom of a thirteen foot pool for ten minutes. I wouldn't do that with many high-brand American flashlights, much less a Chinese manufactured light. This is why they cost a little more: http://www.hdssystems.com/?id=ClickyDetails&model=Custom

It all depends on what you want. Good luck searching, and have fun :thumbsup: