What converter board should be made next?

[dat2zip]

I'm gathering feedback from you. If you had a choice what would you like next? You can vote, post or do both.

Anything goes in this thread. Let's hear the good, bad and the ugly. You can reference any other converter board and tack on "if it only did *this* " as an example.

I will mention that the Irakongi Boost and the Irakongi Buck are in process now as we speak for the Makita Dock configuration. As for a smaller version that would fit in a Mag would be a consideration.

Remember, there are laws of physics and currently in the 0.55" board we are at max Watts/in^2 which is in the 3-4W range. For the deluxe Irakongi Boost at full 50W of power would require something like 2" X 2" of real estate just for the converter board.

You might want to mention or consider the LED stack or configuration and what battery topology and voltage would be appropriate for that.

As an example. The Irakongi Boost at around 40W of power could be used on a 12V power pack and that means it could drive one Osram 6 die or two Osram 6 die LEDs in series. It could also drive 3-4 P7s in series at 2+ Amps to the LED. You could also run this board off the Dewalt 36V power pack and still be in boost mode for two Osram 6 die LEDs in series. Those are just a couple thoughts.

Be realistic here. As we go up in power thermal management becomes even more important than ever. For the Irakongi Boost I will the adding thermal detection which could be located on the PCB or remotely mounted on the LED heatsink.

So, let the fur fly.

Wayne

 

[TranquillityBase]

Re: What next converter board should be made?

1.5 volt 3 level, in .550"...Like the RV7 driver. That would be awesome.

 

[dat2zip]

Re: What next converter board should be made?

1.5 volt 3 level, in .550"...Like the RV7 driver. That would be awesome.

Was that a single board or multiple boards? Can you provide any additional information?

 

[TranquillityBase]

Re: What next converter board should be made?

Was that a single board or multiple boards? Can you provide any additional information?

The first version was two boards stacked, four level.....The second gen. was a single board, with a three level UI...

Here's a three level, second generation.

The board diameter is about .620", so it was a bit of work to squeeze err in the XR, and the Ecan...but it's possible.

 

[TranquillityBase]

Re: What next converter board should be made?

How about a stepless, variable brightness driver? Now that would be cool!!

I just bought a Black Diamond Apollo LED lantern, and it has a variable brightness driver...$50 for the lantern. Almost worth buying the lantern just for the driver

 

[greenLED]

Re: What next converter board should be made?

I'm completely out of touch with the latests and newest - could somebody point out where I can learn more about the specs of all those potential boards? Just reading the names doesn't help me much. Thanks.

 

[darkzero]

Even though high current boards are becoming a demand now I would love to see more uP boards from you rather than all the ones from China. I would pay more for quality converters over the cheap china ones anyday.

 

[Supernam]

I'm sorry for being so bias, but I love the P7. It has put the soldering iron back in my hand like it was when I was 13 year old and racing R/C cars!

I would LOVE to see higher current versions of the GD and SOB converters for P7 applications. It seems as though you have all your bases covered for lower output boards. I am quite fond of Mag builds since they are such versatile hosts, therefore bigger and more heavy duty boards are a possibility. Current options are to double up on boards. I don't mind the cost, but heat at 1.5A is kind of scary for those little boards not to mention the wiring nightmare.


Sorry, what's uP?

 

[iconoclast]

with emoli and a123 starting to make 18650 sizes, it would be interesting to have something like a higher current GD. I'm thinking simple one battery, one led formats. (P4, P7, XR-E, k2 ranges of Vf, not Ostar.)
Vin around 2-5V and as much (constant) current as you can squeeze out of something around ~ 18mm in size.
If that's still to small, ~26mm would be the next best.

Yes, heat will be an issue, but I'm sure we'll find creative ways to deal with it.

I don't know how feasible something like that is, but you said "anything goes". :tinfoil:

Extra bonus points if we can select the current by potentiometer, like the shark. :devil:

 

[jch79]

Something that has 3 programmable levels! Like the HDS/Novatac UI or even the FluPIC, except no weird SOS/strobe stuff - plain & simple: 3 regulated settable levels. :thumbsup:

john

 

[McGizmo]

Since you have allowed for good,bad and ugly I think I can keep in that framework.

Thermal seems to be a big issue with the high power drivers and if they aren't going to happen on the small diameter boards, anyway, would it make sense to consider putting the circuits on single sided MCPCB's for the same justification the LED's are mounted on MCPCB's? My brief experience with the P7 cries out for a full power Buck circuit with your 3 speed UI. Full power, 2800mA, will require serious attention to thermal management of not only the LED but the rest of the components in the circuit as well and I think this thermal management needs to be given priority in consideration. As an example although maybe not a great one is the linear drivers from LED-Tech.de which are high power and definitely require thermal relief and they are offered on MCPCB out of necessity, I would guess.

On the other hand, the obvious bookend to your GDuP would be the SOBuP. I do have some concerns or at least a couple comments though, with this one.
For one, will the development time and NRE be problematic for you as it was with the GDuP? The subject here is about converter boards but the SOBuP might well be a LE at least initially?
Secondly, if and when the SOBuP were available as a converter only, would it be possible if the UI were based on percentages of a "set" max current with the actual max current dictated by a user exchangeable sense resistor? I realize this might not be ideal but it could allow for more versatility without need of programing the chip at your end? Your stock converter may say have 700 or 1000 mA as max current but I need to max out at 350 mA with a particular LED for instance. If I could halve the 700 or go for 1/3 of the 1000 with a resistor change then I suspect the relative drive levels would still be viable and certainly better than a one speed. another way of considering this would be to suggest that the stock converter might be modifiable to either a turbo version or a mizer version with no need to change the programming of the chip itself.

 

[datiLED]

Re: What next converter board should be made?

1.5 volt 3 level, in .550"...Like the RV7 driver. That would be awesome.

+1 :thumbsup:

That would be a fun board to have access to.

 

[BigBoy]

I would like to see

1) 18650 input, 1000 ma output, with low voltage protection
You could run the newer safe type lithium batteries with this driver.

2) 2 x Nimh input, 1000 ma output
Nimh cells compete with safe type lithiums in energy density - and Nimh is just more widely accepted (outside of CPF)

3) 1 x Nimh input, 600 ma output (RV7 type)

Of these options I suspect that the 18650 based driver would be the most popular.

 

[jirik_cz]

I think that many people want a good buck driver for SSC P7. A "Super SOB" with 2,8A output and at least 17Vin. (for driving with 4 liions in series).

 

[dat2zip]

Since you have allowed for good,bad and ugly I think I can keep in that framework.

Thermal seems to be a big issue with the high power drivers and if they aren't going to happen on the small diameter boards, anyway, would it make sense to consider putting the circuits on single sided MCPCB's for the same justification the LED's are mounted on MCPCB's? My brief experience with the P7 cries out for a full power Buck circuit with your 3 speed UI. Full power, 2800mA, will require serious attention to thermal management of not only the LED but the rest of the components in the circuit as well and I think this thermal management needs to be given priority in consideration. As an example although maybe not a great one is the linear drivers from LED-Tech.de which are high power and definitely require thermal relief and they are offered on MCPCB out of necessity, I would guess.

On the other hand, the obvious bookend to your GDuP would be the SOBuP. I do have some concerns or at least a couple comments though, with this one.
For one, will the development time and NRE be problematic for you as it was with the GDuP? The subject here is about converter boards but the SOBuP might well be a LE at least initially?
Secondly, if and when the SOBuP were available as a converter only, would it be possible if the UI were based on percentages of a "set" max current with the actual max current dictated by a user exchangeable sense resistor? I realize this might not be ideal but it could allow for more versatility without need of programing the chip at your end? Your stock converter may say have 700 or 1000 mA as max current but I need to max out at 350 mA with a particular LED for instance. If I could halve the 700 or go for 1/3 of the 1000 with a resistor change then I suspect the relative drive levels would still be viable and certainly better than a one speed. another way of considering this would be to suggest that the stock converter might be modifiable to either a turbo version or a mizer version with no need to change the programming of the chip itself.

My guess is that MCPCBs is out of the question. I believe the price would be astronomical for boards that require "vias" on MCPCB. I can't imagine how they would put a conductive via in a conductive aluminum substrate. That process has gotta be expensive as all get out. On top of that the development would be astronomical as if you don't hit a home run the first time and have to redo the layout over the NRE setup costs for the new revision of the MCPCB would bite you big time. I believe that is why most MCPCBs are single sided.

As it turns out managing heat in FR4 is doable and if you look inside any major large power supply they still use plain ole FR4 for the PCB.

What you can do is go nostandard in the metalization. Standard is 1oz copper. That's about 1 thous thick. You can go all the way up to 4 oz copper of which I would not go beyond 2 oz as the process gets expensive exponentially with more copper.

I ordered protos of the Shark board with 2oz copper and the IC in the same configuration as the standard 1oz version stays very cool. The thermal transfer through the vias under the IC dramatically improved.

Regarding the SOBuP. There is good news for any new converter board that can leverage code or designs already completed (code reuse). I have the Shark UI and the GDuP UI. It's more than likely the SOBuP would use nearly identical code as the GDuP making the SOBuP less expensive to develop than it did for the GDuP.


Hmm, changing the sense resistor is doable as is on the GDuP. The processor servos a fixed voltage value on the sense resistor to regulate the LED current, so changing the sense resistor would scale the regulated values. Changing it from a 0.1 to a 0.2 would halve the regulation current.

Wayne

 

[dat2zip]

Re: What next converter board should be made?

The first version was two boards stacked, four level.....The second gen. was a single board, with a three level UI...

Here's a three level, second generation.

The board diameter is about .620", so it was a bit of work to squeeze err in the XR, and the Ecan...but it's possible.

Based on the picture if that's a hand wound inductor it would be too expensive to make here in the states. Getting it made offshore might be an option, but, I have yet to have any production done offshore. Another minor issue would be what LE could be made. The board looks like it fits in the XRCan, but, I am pretty certain that it won't fit in the ESCan which has less cavity space. That would limit usage to only Cree LEs unless a different can design was made or one designed around it and made a non E series compatible head and LE.

Wayne

 

[TranquillityBase]

Re: What next converter board should be made?

I made a couple Lux III UVOJ LE's, and a few Seoul LE's with the RV7 1AA driver.

Easier fit with the XRcan, but the Ecan is possible too. Here's a photo of a completed UVOJ 1AA three speed.

 

[mfrey]

I like the idea of a scalable SOBuP perhaps with the option upon ordering of different max currents via the sense resistor. My personal interest is in something with at least a 1 amp high.

 

[dat2zip]

I posted in the GDuP progress thread about information regarding the new SOBuP.

Just wanted to update this thread and note that I have a working proto of the SOBuP and that it will more than likely be one of several boards that will be in production soon.

Also, another board that is looks promising and has some progress on it is the Shark step down. All indications look like the same diameter of 0.75", trim pot location and Remora interface will remain the same. I have done simulations on the new design and it's looking promising on being able to do 3A. I have a working prototype, but, I've been bit again with 1 oz copper and heat issues and can't test it to the full capacity. A new board is on order and should be here next week to address this issue and when it arrives I'll be loading the components and testing it.

Wayne

 

[LED Zeppelin]

Great news Wayne. I like the idea of a Shark step-down. Finally a quality board that can drive the P7 at spec.