Why mod when you can do this...?????

I was playing around with my PT Surge yesterday, which hasn't been touched much since I discovered CPF..

I was fiddling around with its battery compartment when a thought struck me..

ROP use a variety of battery configurations, one of which utilises 8 AAs. Modders do a lot of things to get a mag to accept 8 AAs. AND here I was holding a ready made, cheap 8 AA battery holder and body.... and it comes with a bi-pin bulb which can be easily plucked out and changed...

Can't I just use this set-up, change bulbs to get it into a ROP and be done with it or has this already been discussed and is the No. 1 stoooopid suggestion???

I mean granted, the bezel isn't exactly the best, but let's put that aside for a moment and worry more about whether this can be done in terms of issues with battery configurations and handling the heat that might come with it..

So tell me... am I dreaming or can this really be done?? :naughty:

IIRC, the Surge has a series-parallel carrier. You'd need to find a bulb with good 6V performance. Then you'd have to find a way to manage heat. Early Surges had heat problems since there's so little metal to carry it away.

OK... mine is the later ones so they would have already managed the heat issue with the stock bulb.. of course with a more powerful bulb, it ight be a bit different. Although I have left my Surge on continuously for a good 15 minutes just to make sure that mine wasn't the one with a heat problem and it has passed that test with flying colours...

So I'm thinking that with a more powerful bulb, as long as I don't run it for more than say 5 mins at a go, it should not be any problem with heat????

The Surge also allows the use of 4 AAs only..........

That set me thinking.... instead of all 8 at once, use just 4 instead... I was thinking... 4 X 14500 would power up some nice bulbs really well....

Any suggestions??

I just dug up my Surge to have a look. The battery configuration is 4-series, 2-parallel. The bi-pin holder is smaller than the usual G4 size so I don't know if you will be able to fit a high-power 6V bulb like the WA1111 (which would be my first choice for an upgrade for this light). Also, the reflector opening may need to be opened up just a bit. The reflector seems to be made of metal but I can't be sure the lens is glass (seems like it).

My main reservation is whether the bulb holder will be able to take the greater heat from a high-power bulb notwithstanding that this is the "improved" version.

The other consideration is that, if you plan to use NiMhs, the nominal voltage will only be 4.8V so the WA1111 would be very yellow in which case the 1319 or 1160 might be a better choice.

Btw, the ROP is a PR bulb and will not fit in a bi-pin holder.

Actually I'm planning to use 4 X 14500..

Oh and sorry.. what's a PR bulb??



Dang... I just ordered a WA 1274!!! will it fit??

There are 2 things you have to match between the cells and the bulb - the voltage and the current/capacity.

4 X 14500 will give up a max of 16.8V fresh off the charger and will immediately blow your 1274 which is specced for 7.2V. Also, the capacity of 14500s will not be enough to drive the 1274 (which is rated at 2.77A) safely. You can try 4/8 X NiMh AAs but the light will prob be dim and disappointing since you will be underdriving the bulb.

PR bulbs are the typical Mag bulbs which have a round, tapering base. What you need is a bi-pin bulb which comes with 2 pins at the base. Your 1274 originally comes in bi-pin form unless you bought the potted (PR) version. I am not sure if the 1274 will fit - either at the base (because of the width of the pins) or the top (because of the size of the opening of the reflector). Let us know when yours arrives.

OK... I bought the unpotted version.. I just dismantled the bezel of the Surge.. the lens is unfortunately plastic... DAMN!!

mm. looks like I lose either way with the 1274...

4 X 14500 and it'll blow

4 or 8 AA NiMh and it'll be dim....

Any suggestions???

Is anyone able to make a new glass lens for me??

Is the reflector plastic or aluminum ? You could use 2 Li-ion 14500 cells and 2 dummy cells and run a StreamLight TL-3 bulb. I'm not sure how the serries paralel holder works on these lights but it sounds like you could also use 4 Li-ion 14500 cells and 4 dummy cells. If that is the way the battery holder works you could also use a Carley 1499 bulb.

Reflector is aluminium. You must run at least 4 cells to get the circuit complete. So its either 4 or 8 cells to complete the circuit..

If you want to use your 1274 bulb, you can use 4 X 14500s together with 4 dummy AA cells (I think Aw sells these). Insert 2 X 14500 and 2 dummies into each section of the holder so that the 14500s will be in series/parallel.

I think the best solution would be to use 8 X NiMh AAs together with a high current 4.8V bi-pin bulb (FiveMega had some of these when he was selling his 4AA 1D light).

This of course assumes that you can insert the G4 bi-pin bulb into the Surge's bulb holder.

Ok.. will see when the 1274 arrives.. not until at least another week or so...

was thinking out loud.. would a short circuited normal AA qualify as a dummy cell???

Tessaiga said:

Ok.. will see when the 1274 arrives.. not until at least another week or so...

was thinking out loud.. would a short circuited normal AA qualify as a dummy cell???

Click to expand...

No, bad idea.

Tessaiga said:

Is anyone able to make a new glass lens for me??

Click to expand...

Measure it, then Google "watchmaking supplies crystals", both in the forums and the web as a whole. I've seen several places mentioned, but haven't used any myself.

Thanks for the tip... i got a slight problem with heat if I were to use an overdriven bulb... I'm sure the polymer-like body can heck the heat

Its the bezel area that I'm concerned about. If anyone of you have a Surge, you will know what I mean.

The outer body is rubber... below that is the whole transparent plastic setup that is one piece and includes the plastic lens (this is the part I'm concerned about). This whole plastic structure fits snugly into the bezel and has screw threads in it which then attaches it to the body.

If I can get someone to build me a glass lens, I can cut out the lens portion and replace it with glass. It looks kinda messy and difficult but I'm sure it can be done. But what can I do with the rest of the plastic structure that fits into the rubber bezel??

Can anyone build me one made of metal or something??? In fact if that can be done, we can just throw away the rubber outer covering... and the metal structure would then act like a bezel in itself... anyone knows if any after market bezel head will fit onto the Surge?





Next question...

If I want to use the 1274 bulb, I can use 8 X 14500s without dummy cells right?? Because of the series parallel arrangement. One side of it would give 4 X 3.7 = 14.8 V.

2 of 14.8 V in parallel should give 7.4 V right.. which is just 0.2 V more than the 7.2 V of the 1274... Have I got it wrong??????

Tessaiga said:

Next question...

If I want to use the 1274 bulb, I can use 8 X 14500s without dummy cells right?? Because of the series parallel arrangement. One side of it would give 4 X 3.7 = 14.8 V.

2 of 14.8 V in parallel should give 7.4 V right.. which is just 0.2 V more than the 7.2 V of the 1274... Have I got it wrong??????

Click to expand...

Not correct! If you use 8 X 14500, you will have 2 sets of 4 X 14500. Looking at one set in isolation first, the 14500s will be in series hence the voltage of this set would be 14.8v and the capacity would be 900mAh (assuming this is the capacity of one 14500). When you then put 2 sets together in parallel, the voltage REMAINS at 14.8v but the capacity adds up and doubles to 1800mAh.

To arrive at 7.4v, you will need to either just use 1 set of 2 X 14500 and 2 X dummies; or use 2 sets of the same config (for double the capacity).

Hope the above is clear.

Oh.. thanks.. guess I don't remember my electronics as well as I thought I did.. my calculation would be correct if we are talking about resistance and not voltages...???

But V = IR right? which means V is proportional to R... so isn't calculating V the same as R?? isn't 1/V(total) = 1/V(1) + 1/V(2)???

Where did I go wrong?? the last time i did this type of calculations was more than 10 years ago...

actually, i haven't done those calculations for more than 20 years! but just recently, i borrowed a book from the library and it all came flooding back! yes, you did get voltage and resistance mixed up. if you have 2 similar resistors in parallel, the effective resistance is halved - if they are dissimilar, you need to use the reciprocal formula.