Is there anything wrong with FENIX ?

Having been a die-hard Surefire fan for long...with a brief affair with Night-Ops Gladius and Falcata... I thought I'd never stray into another's bed..:naughty:

However, having now bought a Fenix P1D-CE, L2D and C3D-CE, I'm feeling the stirring of a love interest elsewhere...:kiss:

I know the threads on the Fenix aren't as good as Surefires...... but what else can be possibly wrong with Fenix..

I mean, they are much much cheaper than Surefires and many have better output and options....

Your views, fellow CPFers are most welcome...

Thanks,

Gary

The Fenix offerings quite often win opinion polls on this forum. There is nothing wrong with them at all. They are the kick in the butt the entire industry has been waiting for in terms of innovation, and, it looks like they listen to customers, and deliver the right goods promptly. Just look at the P2D and P3D, which were a response to users wanting clickies.

We've been wanting Cree-powered SureFires for nearly 6 months now, still no solid response.

What makes me turn away from them recently is the user interface. For a relatively cheap, simple, one-stage light I accept nearly anything. But when they ventured into multi-mode lights, and became more expensive, I stopped getting them.

Basically, the user interface gets you to all the modes, but it's not elegantly designed for real-world applications, as are Surefires. The Fenix user interface is what an engineer would come up with during prototyping. The fine-tuning and actual designing with respect to the intended application is missing. Which is why Fenix are cheap(er) and can come up with new models faster, but they are not cheap enough for me to not care.

I have always like Surefire and own many lights. I have to admit, however, that fenix has really taken the bulls by the horns in terms of design, manufacture, and ultimate marketing of new lights in the last few years. sometimes it has been as little as a few weeks between customer suggestions and a product available for purchase. That's pretty amazing. It is also natural for many to think in a positive way about companies who allow the customer needs and ideas drive their product line. I still will buy future Surefire lights in addition, but it's sure great that companies like Fenix are pushing ahead with new ideas too. Some of the fenix lights have been part of the R&D process with some issues, but they still are great to see come to market.

Fenix quality is not up to Surefire standards, but they don't cost near as much either.

I like the automobile comparison:

Surefire is like Cadillac. American made, iconic, a symbol of quality and high-end and high-priced offerings in that market.

Fenix is like Toyota, or maybe even Honda. Foreign, something of a new-comer, smaller and cheaper, but gets the job done at least as well if not better than than the domestic.

Fenixes finish might not be quite as tough as Surefires, and they have some occasional emitter-centering issues, but if you don't place a high priority on "status" and want smaller, faster, cheaper, Fenix is definitely something to consider.

:rock:

What makes me turn away from them recently is the user interface.

Click to expand...

:thinking:
turn in head to body --> turbo mode
light is ON/OFF with max output,

(just as any other light, but with better output and more runtime compared to similar sized incans)

I have a Fenix L1, P2D CE, P3D CE and think they're great. I like the user interface of the P2D/P3D. Instant on to either full or low depending on head twist is a good idea. They can lose the SOS and strobe modes though.

elgarak said:

Basically, the user interface gets you to all the modes, but it's not elegantly designed for real-world applications, as are Surefires.

Click to expand...

Applying this to the LxD and PxD series, I totally disagree.

I've got an L1D and more recently a P2D, which use the same interface, and I think that for real-world applications, it's excellent. It allows you to easily and without turning the light on select low or turbo; it allows you to instantly switch from low to turbo or vice versa; it allows you to start out in low and then bump it up gradually as needed; getting to other modes is easy; and the more gimmicky/less used modes like strobe and s.o.s. aren't in the way of the more frequently used modes.

Using my Fenix lights in real-world applications, I find the U.I. to be very elegant, and can't concieve of how it could be improved.

yellow said:

:thinking:
turn in head to body --> turbo mode
light is ON/OFF with max output,

(just as any other light, but with better output and more runtime compared to similar sized incans)

Click to expand...

Maybe I made myself not quite clear. The UI is not really bad, but not good enough for the price I have to pay for it. It's UI and end price. Fenix right now are a tad too expensive for me considering that they have a UI I'm not too happy with (Reverse clicky, foremost. If they would a release a forward clicky, with everything else the same, I would get them for the current price tag).

Besides the reverse clicky, there are tons of minor things that I would like improved, but I realize that it would drive up the price tag even more. Things like better grip for twisting, better threading (considering the thread is important to select modes on the head), selection of brightness levels (the two levels on my L2D are simply too close), removal of unusable show-off modes (like strobe, which was my main gripe for the real-life comment. There are real-life applications for strobe, but not as employed in the Fenix lights).

Maybe I'm spoiled; the epitome of UI's for me are Surefire's L1, L2, A2, Kroma. They're the best there are. And no other manufacturer has anything coming close, yet.

"Surefire is like Cadillac" - not sure about that. Ironically, Cadillac assemble cars in China. And their running gear is generally based on last-generation Mercedes platforms.

Though if you mean outdated and underpowered and a triumph of style over substance, you could be right

:lolsign:

I might buy another Fenix if they were to:

• Have a shock absorbing piston between the batteries and the circuit board in the head
• Use a heavy robust forward clicky switch
• Use thicker aluminum with deeply machined knurling
• Get rid of that slick smooth surface texture
• Have good thread machining and clean off the residual aluminum particles

But then it would be a totally different light in a whole different price category. :shrug:

My L2D CE was my first Fenix… it felt so fragile and dainty I had to sell it within days of getting it. That tail clicky felt so… so… wrong. Bright, sure, but all those little problems kept nagging me and drove me nuts…I was convinced the first time I dropped the thing it would fail. The included spare replacement rubber tail cap switch cover was as though they were saying "so, when it punctures or tears, here is the spare part…"

And the way the batteries were right up against the green circuit board in the head… man that's going to take a lot of G force and shock when it's dropped and the batteries slam down onto it… and the aluminum particles remaining in the threads were a head shaker.

Yes it was bright, the brightest light I've owned... but after that thrill wore off in about an hour I was left with the list of faults and a sinking feeling that I couldn't trust this light. Sorry for the negative report but it's just the facts as I saw them. Apology sent out in advance etc.,:duck:

have not tried latest fenix lights, but I've got a slew of early fenix L1-P.

I've had clickie/contact failures on too many to recommend fenix to friends.

sure hope quality control has gotten better on current model fenix's.

Dodge said:

"Surefire is like Cadillac" - not sure about that. Ironically, Cadillac assemble cars in China. And their running gear is generally based on last-generation Mercedes platforms.

Though if you mean outdated and underpowered and a triumph of style over substance, you could be right

:lolsign:

Click to expand...

WTH are you talking about? Where are you pulling this from?

Dodge said:

"Surefire is like Cadillac" - not sure about that. Ironically, Cadillac assemble cars in China. And their running gear is generally based on last-generation Mercedes platforms.

Though if you mean outdated and underpowered and a triumph of style over substance, you could be right

:lolsign:

Click to expand...

Cadillac's underpowered? Not the models I'm familiar with, check out the HP ratings.

Come to think of it, this is probably getting off-topic... sorry.

Take care... Quinn

I've found my Fenixes to be excellent. They cost more than their Chinese clone copies, but their build quality and, especially, circuit design (output, efficiency) beat every production light out there (manufactured anywhere), making them worth their price.

Tastes differ, but I've found the "quality" of mine to have been great.

When I get my SFs I doubt that I'll use them for real world applications. The expensive batteries are my main complaint. They sure are nice looking and will probably be the pretty girls in my growing flashlight collection. The Fenix L2D CE is my main workhorse flashlight. I use it everyday at work and so far so good. The different output modes are a big plus, a feature that I looked for long and hard before I found CPF.

Cadillac have a plant in Shanghai. I'm wrong about the last-generation Mercedes, that's Chrysler.

And I confess I slipped in the "underpowered" because that fits in with how
Surefire are looking compared to the latest Chinese offerings.

I've found my Fenix Civictor (twist switch not clicky) to be quite reliable over that last year.

Fenix makes excellent lights. Seriously, I don't know where you guys are coming up with some of these complaints. The UI is outstanding. They are well made. They are very efficient. There simply is no better all around light for the price than a Fenix.

I don't find anything really wrong with fenix, they just don't have the "gotta work when I turn it on" feel and construction. I use two LxD CE series for bike lights and they work fine and I have not had a problem.

For harsh EDC use, I prefer potted electronics and stout construction. It might be just me though, I beat the hell out of my EDC lights and they just keep working.