Super Beam P7 at KD

http://www.kaidomain.com/WEBUI/ProductDetail.aspx?TranID=4377

More P7's coming

KD is overpricing the flashlights

http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.12060

As much as I probably think your right knowing KD, you have absolutely no evidence to base that on.

This light could have markedly better quality than the MTE, and if my MTE lights are anything to go by it probably does.

It's probably best to leave the overpricing talk until someone actually has this light in their hand!

Smooth reflector, wish the MTE came with that!

All kind of mistakes/misrepresentations in the description:

"1000 Lumens+ output" How can it possibly be 1000+ lumens when a P7 tops out at 900 lumens?
"1.5W step-up super boost circuit" Obviously this is copied from some other flashlight since 1.5W is no where near the power required.
"Glow-in-dark silicone Tailcap switch" Not from the picture, I see a regular black button.

I'm done buying from KD because I've seen enough of this with previous products and they don't seem to take any responsibility for these errors. DX is getting all my future business.

It's possible it's over driven, I mean its not going to be, and would be complete madness if it was.....but still it's possible.

I do agree though KD's general shoddyness is starting to get to me, had my fingers burned by them recently over some 1.2a drivers misadvertised.

I can understand a 1.5V step up circuit, but is it really possible to have a 1.5W step up circuit? Isn't the output in watts determined by the capacity of the 18650 cell?

http://www.kaidomain.com/WEBUI/ProductDetail.aspx?TranID=4357
"- Features a Cree 7090 XR-E P4 emitter" lol

look the photo, it is not a cree

Bigsy said:

As much as I probably think your right knowing KD, you have absolutely no evidence to base that on.

This light could have markedly better quality than the MTE, and if my MTE lights are anything to go by it probably does.

It's probably best to leave the overpricing talk until someone actually has this light in their hand!

Click to expand...

linterno said:

I was thinking about buying the Eastward YJ-XAQ5 flashlight but now I won't. I guess Jerry from KD read the good comment and immediately raised the price. This is not a good practice.

This forums are to share experiences not to take commercial advantage of comments.

I invite everybody to do the same I am doing until KD updates the price to the previous one.

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pvalopes said:

http://www.kaidomain.com/WEBUI/ProductDetail.aspx?TranID=4357
"- Features a Cree 7090 XR-E P4 emitter" lol

look the photo, it is not a cree

Click to expand...

Yeah, just another example of KD not getting their facts straight... always seems to be to the benefit of overselling features.

Just because DX and KD are the first to market with these P7 based lights doesn't mean that either are built with any thought going into the area of quality.
They seem to want to be the brightest 900 vs 1000 lumen lights out there.
IMHO mounting the P7 in a Mag body with the MAG reflector is a great way to go and will not cost much more. I have not had good experience with either company. I must admit to having been drawn into making a purcahse from both companies.
Both companies screwed up the order. both charged me when infact the item was NOT instock. even though the web site said it was. Both orders took months to complete. the quality of the goods received was marginal at best. finger prints on reflectors on both of the drop in's I orderd...
I for one will not be buying anything from them.
I sort of wish there was a Company say like MagLight which choode to implement the P7 into their range or even pelican. I hate the idea of being forced to buy a chinese light.
I have an order in for a P7 Mounted on an O-sink and ready for mounting into a 3 cell D Mag light. I feel that this will produce a boat load of light. Making my old space needle truly obsolete.

I also find it strange that KD rates this light at 1000 lumen. This is all a bit of sillyness in a rush to market.
I hope that those of you who do get these are satisified and feel like you are getting a good value.
I am very sure I will be happy with my P7Needle.
Yaesumofo
Yaesumofo

^agreed. These lights look to be rushed out. I'm gonna wait a for a review or perhaps a better quality light becomes available.

I'm hoping the DX version puts out at least 500 lumens, but we'll see. As long as it puts out a decent amount of light I'm going to try and mount it as a headlight on my kid's double jogging stroller.

bspofford said:

I can understand a 1.5V step up circuit, but is it really possible to have a 1.5W step up circuit? Isn't the output in watts determined by the capacity of the 18650 cell?

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I think this part is a simple mistake where it should say 1.5V not W for watts. As you already know power can't be stepped up, Whatever total power you have from the source is all you can deliver minus that lost in the circuitry to get it there. The step up voltage converter most take some power across itself to run, nothing is 100% efficient so if the batteries could deliver lets say 10 watts of power continuous steady state (this is just an example, don't crucify me for the actual numbers) and the power conversion circuit took 0.5 watts of power to run, the most that could ever be delivered to the load (in this case the LED head) would only be 9.5 watts. You could never take a 10 watt source and step up the power to make it an 11.5 watts at the output. Not unless you had those good dilithium crystals from the Federation and not those cheap Klingon Crystals.

So I am sure that they meant 1.5V step up, but once again it proves the point, the guy making up the ad just uses the buzz words without understanding them. So you don't know what he is really advertising versus hype.

MrGman said:

I think this part is a simple mistake where it should say 1.5V not W for watts. As you already know power can't be stepped up, Whatever total power you have from the source is all you can deliver minus that lost in the circuitry to get it there. The step up voltage converter most take some power across itself to run, nothing is 100% efficient so if the batteries could deliver lets say 10 watts of power continuous steady state (this is just an example, don't crucify me for the actual numbers) and the power conversion circuit took 0.5 watts of power to run, the most that could ever be delivered to the load (in this case the LED head) would only be 9.5 watts. You could never take a 10 watt source and step up the power to make it an 11.5 watts at the output. Not unless you had those good dilithium crystals from the Federation and not those cheap Klingon Crystals.

So I am sure that they meant 1.5V step up, but once again it proves the point, the guy making up the ad just uses the buzz words without understanding them. So you don't know what he is really advertising versus hype.

Click to expand...

But why would a 18650 light have a 1.5V step up boost circuit?!

well the KD does seems to have a bigger head than the DX one and between the beamshot pics the KD looks to have a throwier beam than DX but that could all be to do with the exposure of the camera(ie KD might be underexposed to show beam pattern whereas DX could be over exposed to show more light)

Personally my experience with either company has been overall good. There have been mistakes made by both over the time that I've ordered stuff from them, but nothing that didn't get resolved for me. I agree that KD needs alot of work with their descriptions, but from my discussions with their flashlight guy Jerry, I get the impression that he and Kai are really trying to cater to us flashaholics. So I give them an A for effort, but I will also agree that their overall presentation needs work. So with that said, I really appreciate their efforts and I hope the rest will eventually fall into place.

So nobody has one yet? 900-1000 lumens seems hard to believe. I want to see beamshots.

mighty82 said:

But why would a 18650 light have a 1.5V step up boost circuit?!

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To give it longer run time range as the battery runs down. It doesn't stay at peak voltage forever, especially under heavy load. The 18650 battery may be better than others but that doesn't mean it doesn't have any voltage fall off curve. The vendor wants to be able to give you the most useful run time for your money so the voltage is stepped up just enough to give the regulation circuit "headroom" to keep it constant across the LED head when the voltage finally does start to sag at the battery. The higher the current load the more the battery voltage will sag, even with the best of the best, its just a matter of how much. If these flashlights are really drawing up to 2.8 amps on high mode that battery isn't going to be holding a rock steady voltage until its ampere hour charge is 95% used up, its going to sag somewhat over time. With just the right amount of voltage step up and a good regulation scheme, you will never notice it at the light output end, and get the most optimum run time besides (without wasting a lot of power across the regulation circuit itself) which is after all what you want right?

Since they know that this thing won't have a really long run time at full power or near full power, they are trying to get you the most out of the battery so you won't complain that it runs for 15 minutes before you start to see the brightness drop.

Not to mention that even though the battery with a fresh charge may have high enough voltage, at the higher current levels there is some resistance in the connections to get that to the LED, that resistance will have some voltage drop to over come as well (I times R = V), so better to have ample Voltage headroom and not need it than to be on the verge where the light just goes dim at full power setting.

The resistance for instance through copper goes up when it gets hot not down. That means it becomes slightly more resistive. A 50 milliohm total shall we say wiring path resistance (this is just an example for the math illustration) or 0.050 ohms times 2.8 amps is a 0.14V drop right there. May not seem like much, but as contacts get old and cruddy things change. Make the electronics give you a voltage range up to possibly 5.5V peak and no less than 4.5V and then its not a concern any more, for most of the life of the unit under "normal" conditions.

MrGman said:

To give it longer run time range as the battery runs down. It doesn't stay at peak voltage forever, especially under heavy load. The 18650 battery may be better than others but that doesn't mean it doesn't have any voltage fall off curve. The vendor wants to be able to give you the most useful run time for your money so the voltage is stepped up just enough to give the regulation circuit "headroom" to keep it constant across the LED head when the voltage finally does start to sag at the battery. The higher the current load the more the battery voltage will sag, even with the best of the best, its just a matter of how much. If these flashlights are really drawing up to 2.8 amps on high mode that battery isn't going to be holding a rock steady voltage until its ampere hour charge is 95% used up, its going to sag somewhat over time. With just the right amount of voltage step up and a good regulation scheme, you will never notice it at the light output end, and get the most optimum run time besides (without wasting a lot of power across the regulation circuit itself) which is after all what you want right?

Since they know that this thing won't have a really long run time at full power or near full power, they are trying to get you the most out of the battery so you won't complain that it runs for 15 minutes before you start to see the brightness drop.

Not to mention that even though the battery with a fresh charge may have high enough voltage, at the higher current levels there is some resistance in the connections to get that to the LED, that resistance will have some voltage drop to over come as well (I times R = V), so better to have ample Voltage headroom and not need it than to be on the verge where the light just goes dim at full power setting.

The resistance for instance through copper goes up when it gets hot not down. That means it becomes slightly more resistive. A 50 milliohm total shall we say wiring path resistance (this is just an example for the math illustration) or 0.050 ohms times 2.8 amps is a 0.14V drop right there. May not seem like much, but as contacts get old and cruddy things change. Make the electronics give you a voltage range up to possibly 5.5V peak and no less than 4.5V and then its not a concern any more, for most of the life of the unit under "normal" conditions.

Click to expand...

Yes, I know how things works (battery/regulation freak), but I kind of doubt that this light has a buck/boost circuit, very few of the cheap 18650 lights does (and it bugs me). Anyway, a lithium can't go much lower than 3 volts without taking damage, so a boost circuit that works down to 1,5 volts would be kind of wierd. But if it has a buck/boost circuit, it's a big plus.
IMO this is a must for a flashlight designet to run on a single 3.7v lithium cell. I hate those lights that only run in regulation down to about 3.8v. Wast of money. :sick2:

"Yes, I know how things works (battery/regulation freak), but I kind of doubt that this light has a buck/boost circuit, very few of the cheap 18650 lights does (and it bugs me). Anyway, a lithium can't go much lower than 3 volts without taking damage, so a boost circuit that works down to 1,5 volts would be kind of wierd. But if it has a buck/boost circuit, it's a big plus.
IMO this is a must for a flashlight designet to run on a single 3.7v lithium cell. I hate those lights that only run in regulation down to about 3.8v. Wast of money"

Got that a little backwards. The Lithium battery wouldn't go down to 1.5V and then the output to the LED would be 3V. The Output to the LED would still be capable of going as high as 4.5V to keep the LED at full power while the Lithum battery dropped down to that 3.0V (I want to call it "shelf") voltage. Because once it drops below that it really isn't going to be able to source any considerable current. So the light would probably flicker if attempts were made to drive it any any considerable power levels at all. Just because the output has the capability to go to 4.5V doesn't mean it has to. I don't believe that this 18650 would be sourcing current at 1.6V let's say and the output of the LED could go to full power.