800 + Lumen Quark???

I have been hearing about the maelstorm and read a few reviews. It seesm like an amazing light. I want one really bad. What I would like even more is a quark light that can compete with the tk40 but maybe a little bit better throw. Seeing the $145.00 price tag for 360 lumens from the Maelstorm scares me, if they do come out with a 800 + lumen light looks like that would cost around $375 or more. Do you think Quark can design a light that will out do the tk 40 in performance and be comparable in cost give or take $50...????? Would this be a light that anyond would be interested in owning?

RoBeacon said:

I have been hearing about the maelstorm and read a few reviews. It seesm like an amazing light. I want one really bad. What I would like even more is a quark light that can compete with the tk40 but maybe a little bit better throw. Seeing the $145.00 price tag for 360 lumens from the Maelstorm scares me, if they do come out with a 800 + lumen light looks like that would cost around $375 or more. Do you think Quark can design a light that will out do the tk 40 in performance and be comparable in cost give or take $50...?????

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Why don't you ask them? Could send an email to any manufacturer you want and you'd get a clearer answer.

Good Point... I'll have to email them tomorrow sometime and when I hear back I'll be sure to update the thread. =D

RoBeacon said:

I have been hearing about the maelstorm and read a few reviews. It seesm like an amazing light. I want one really bad. What I would like even more is a quark light that can compete with the tk40 but maybe a little bit better throw. Seeing the $145.00 price tag for 360 lumens from the Maelstorm scares me, if they do come out with a 800 + lumen light looks like that would cost around $375 or more. Do you think Quark can design a light that will out do the tk 40 in performance and be comparable in cost give or take $50...????? Would this be a light that anyond would be interested in owning?

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It's not just that the Maelstrom (G5) is 360 lumens. That's not really an impressive number, any idiot can get twice that with a 3D P7. The special thing here is the throw it provides, along with the tactical interface. I've never combined flashlights with guns, but the information from David indicates that they've worked with police forces to deliver what those people want. That seems to be throw, simple controls, and rifle mounting size.

Getting the Maelstrom's 360 lumens OTF requires about twice the current of the Quark line, which run the XP-G at a sedate 700 mA. Doubling this apparently took a major change to the electronics and so on - part of the price increase. The programming seems more complex, and the whole package is meant to withstand recoil. The regular Quark line might not survive recoil because of the lack of a front battery spring. I don't know if any of the Maelstrom line will be designed for us civilians - they're gun lights. Maybe that's why they're called Maelstrom - because it's meant to be attached to something far more persuasive than a lot of light.

I think David could deliver a 'sequel' to the Quark - similar output and size, with a refigured emitter and drive system, for not much more money than the Quark line. But that's up to them, and where they see the money. The Maelstrom line is an expansion into a new market.

:thinking: I do not believe that 4sevens is currently interested in releasing a competitor to the TK45 in output or form factor. The current focus is on pushing out the S12 and S18. Of course there are plenty of other things in the (long term) pipeline, but no details.

The upcoming Maelstrom S12 and S18 will absolutely blow away the TK45, but not match its price or form factor. The S18 will be bigger and the S12 will be much, much smaller.

I see. I was unaware that it was specifically designed as a gun light. That makes a lot more sense to me now. I guess if it can survive recoil it would be quite durable then. Thank you for the information.

carrot said:

:thinking: I do not believe that 4sevens is currently interested in releasing a competitor to the TK45 in output or form factor. The current focus is on pushing out the S12 and S18.

The upcoming Maelstrom S12 and S18 will absolutely blow away the TK45, but not match its price or form factor. The S18 will be bigger and the S12 will be much, much smaller.

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Do you have any other information on the two lights? I am quite interested even if they are out of the budget.

AnAppleSnail said:

Getting the Maelstrom's 360 lumens OTF requires about twice the current of the Quark line, which run the XP-G at a sedate 700 mA. Doubling this apparently took a major change to the electronics and so on - part of the price increase. The programming seems more complex, and the whole package is meant to withstand recoil. The regular Quark line might not survive recoil because of the lack of a front battery spring. I don't know if any of the Maelstrom line will be designed for us civilians - they're gun lights. Maybe that's why they're called Maelstrom - because it's meant to be attached to something far more persuasive than a lot of light.

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Don't take this as an admission I watch his videos but I was browsing youtube today, and ended up on his channel aaaaand turns out Nutnfancy tested the Quark Turbo for tactical purposes (I think he tested it on a shotgun). He said it took the recoil just fine.


On another note: about that 350 OTF lumens. Although I think the OTF rating thing is great manufacturers should stick the emitter lumens number alongside that.
Not everyone knows, and not every flashlight company popular with LEO's and the like uses OTF #s, so why not be clearer about it?

Aren't the 4sevens S1200 and S1800 supposed to be up and over that level of output??? I heard they had demo models at shot and were scheduled for production sometime later this year.

Who voted no in this poll? I understand an 800 lumen Quark isn't something everyone would want to own, but why wouldn't you like to see one or be glad that they produced a light like this? I would encourage any manufacturer to push the envelope though I have no desire to own a light like that.

"I would never never support an 800hp Porsche. Why would I, I would never buy one"

Because it's fun to read about and hear others happiness of owning such a thing.

I think it will be good for the industry. To be honest when the first Quarks came out I saw it as an improvement on the Fenix line of lights. That's not to say that the Quark XP-G's arent really impressive. But the new Maelstrom looks very impressive, especially the 4 stage switch. I'm sure the higher output models will be even more so. Even if it's something I'll never personally use, I think it's good to keep other manufacturers on their toes. Plus there will be more options for everyone else.

I have an Elektrolmens EDC P7 (1*18650). It gets too hot to hold in 5 minutes.
I have a 3C Mag P7. It gets warm, just warm at the end of an hour.

Quarks are relatively small lights. They can not handle the heat for extended periods at 800 lumens. It is not getting the heat from the LED to the body. It is getting the heat off the body to the surrounding air.

A 3D Mag P7 is big. Not exactly EDCable.
The TK40(/45) has the same size head as the 3D Mag. The body is shorter but fatter. Not exactly EDCable.
The Maelstrom S1800 and any production light that can deliver 800+ lumens for extended periods are also big enough to make EDCing a problem.

So until LEDs make another major jump in efficiency similar to the 42 lumens @ 350 mA of the Luxeon to the 80 lumens of the Cree XRE P4 all 800+ lumen PRODUCTION lights will be big. Much bigger than the current Quarks.
P7/MCE/SST50/SST90 require 3A or 10 watts to produce 700+ lumens. By the time you go through optical losses, you are below 600 OTF.
The new Cree XL-M is supposed to give 750 lumens at 2A or 7 watts.
We need 750 lumens at 1A for 800+ lumens in a Quark sized light.

Note also the 3D Mag P7s and TK40/45 do not work well with alkaline batteries.
And multiple lithium setups add an explosion risk especially to people not familiar with their safe handling procedures.

For a low cost 800+ lumen LED light we need 4D size. Common batteries so can be sold to the general public. Buck regulators like to see at least 4V. 4sevens may eventually build one but it won't be part of the Quark line.

Well, I voted no. Do you know how much 800 lumens is? It's a LOT and to be honest, I hardly ever use my Quark on max, and that's only 200ish lumens.

Quarks are small, EDC lights from 4sevens. They are not intended to be competitors to much larger lights.

While I have no doubt that in time developments in led techonology will deliver 800 lumens from a small 2 cell light, there's not a lot of use for that much output in day to day EDC use. I have a TK40 and really only ever use turbo when showing off. It's a lot of light.

I would be far more interested in getting runtime improvements over output improvments in EDC sized lights. 200 lumens is a good amount of light from an EDC. Imagine having a Quark that could run for 10 hours at 200 lumens on two eneloops. That is the Quark I want.

I guess I could have mentioned the EDC option to me on such a powerfull light isn't really important. I would be perfectly fine with a large quark. So far I really like the design and can't seem to find a light for the price that beats it. So if they came out with a 3 d m@g. Sized light I would be completley okay with it. Maybe 4Sevens could start up a new line of light Designed just for high output.

Yes I'd like a 800+ Lumens 4SEVENS LIGHT but I wouldn't want my 2xAA QUARK to be in an 800+ Lumens format. Terminology.

jcw122 said:

Yes I'd like a 800+ Lumens 4SEVENS LIGHT but I wouldn't want my 2xAA QUARK to be in an 800+ Lumens format. Terminology.

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LOL The new Quark overdrive 2AA with 800 lumen max output, runtime: 38.275 seconds

I'd like a Maelstrom with 1000 lumens and good throw (800 won't move me) but not unless the UI allows accessing Turbo and moonlight in the same sequence without looking at strobe.

I don't own any of the big three fenix lights, the TK30, TK40 or TK45 for the sole reason of the bezel width.
I'd love an 800 + lumen flashlight for $200 or less. Please emitter gods hear my wish

RoBeacon said:

Do you have any other information on the two lights? I am quite interested even if they are out of the budget.

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The S12 and S18 are based on the Luminous SST-90 LED for 1200 and 1800 emitter lumens. The S12 uses a rechargeable battery system and will come with a charger, and the S18 will use 6x123.

The S12 is thin enough and almost short enough to fit in a can of soda.

recDNA said:

I'd like a Maelstrom with 1000 lumens and good throw (800 won't move me) but not unless the UI allows accessing Turbo and moonlight in the same sequence without looking at strobe.

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Do you mind if I ask why you would want a light like what the S12 or S18 form factor to have a moonlight mode? I figure there are better lights that would have that brightness level with a much easier form factor.

Also, given with the minimized run time with the G5 on moonlight compared to the regular quark line, there are severe limitations and compromises to try to get such a low amount of light from a light designed to push out so much more. I just feel it wouldn't satisfy anyone.