Nitecore D11 Parasitic Drain

Ray_of_Light · Oct 20, 2010

Two weeks ago I acquired a new Nitecore D11. I had read about the lack of "shortcuts" to low and high levels, which have been replaced with strobe and SOS modes.
I didn't like the modification to the UI Nitecore made respect to the D10, but I bought it nonetheless. What I deemed of utmost importance is the doubled runtime compared to the D10, due (I believe) to the higher efficiency of the R5 emitter.
I picked up my D11 few minutes ago from the shelves. Turned on, it is very dim. I had placed a Lithium Ultimate AA in it, last week. I measure the battery, it was 0.9 V open circuit.
I placed a freshly recharged white top Duraloop in it, the D11 turns on fine.
At this point, I measured the current through the battery when the light is off. It is a bit difficult, since the D11 uses the piston drive, but I managed to setup the measurement correctly.
Well. I measured 2.4 mA of standby (or parasitic, which is very appropriate in this case) current.
It means that a freshly charged Duraloop lasts around 90 hours, or less than four days, with the light off.
At this point, I sincerely hope that my D11 is defective...

Could any of owners of a Nitecore D11 conduct a measurement of the standby current? So I can realize if my D11 is a single defective light, or all D11 have 2.4 mA of parasitic current draw.

If all D11 draws 2.4 mA from the battery when off, I'll return mine. There is no need whatsoever for a modern circuit to consume so much power on standby. Such behavior makes the light pratically useless; I can't remove the battery everytime I don't use the light.

Thanks

Anthony

Lynx_Arc · Oct 20, 2010

Ray_of_Light said:
Two weeks ago I acquired a new Nitecore D11. I had read about the lack of "shortcuts" to low and high levels, which have been replaced with strobe and SOS modes.
I didn't like the modification to the UI Nitecore made respect to the D10, but I bought it nonetheless. What I deemed of utmost importance is the doubled runtime compared to the D10, due (I believe) to the higher efficiency of the R5 emitter.
I picked up my D11 few minutes ago from the shelves. Turned on, it is very dim. I had placed a Lithium Ultimate AA in it, last week. I measure the battery, it was 0.9 V open circuit.
I placed a freshly recharged white top Duraloop in it, the D11 turns on fine.
At this point, I measured the current through the battery when the light is off. It is a bit difficult, since the D11 uses the piston drive, but I managed to setup the measurement correctly.
Well. I measured 2.4 mA of standby (or parasitic, which is very appropriate in this case) current.
It means that a freshly charged Duraloop lasts around 90 hours, or less than four days, with the light off.
At this point, I sincerely hope that my D11 is defective...

Could any of owners of a Nitecore D11 conduct a measurement of the standby current? So I can realize if my D11 is a single defective light, or all D11 have 2.4 mA of parasitic current draw.

If all D11 draws 2.4 mA from the battery when off, I'll return mine. There is no need whatsoever for a modern circuit to consume so much power on standby. Such behavior makes the light pratically useless; I can't remove the battery everytime I don't use the light.

Thanks

Anthony

2.4ma sounds way too high.
http:
//www.lygte-info.dk/info/standbyCurrent%20UK.html
this page says a D10 is about 190 microamps or 0.2ma approx.

Matt7337 · Oct 20, 2010

I'm with Lynx on this, no flashlight circuit should draw that much in standby. I don't own a D11 to test, but I do own a D20, SR3 and NEX... because you've brougnt this up, I will test them as well just to be sure.

I was just pondering getting a D11 or Infilux IFE1 this evening too, as I love the Nitecore lights and have been hard pushed to find such consistent quality and design from another manufacturer. I eagerly await the outcome of this. Hopefully (and probably) your light is defective, making it an isolated occurrence.

Other than the parasitic drain, how do you find the light compared to the D10?

Ray_of_Light · Oct 20, 2010

Matt7337 said:
I'm with Lynx on this, no flashlight circuit should draw that much in standby. I don't own a D11 to test, but I do own a D20, SR3 and NEX... because you've brougnt this up, I will test them as well just to be sure.

I was just pondering getting a D11 or Infilux IFE1 this evening too, as I love the Nitecore lights and have been hard pushed to find such consistent quality and design from another manufacturer. I eagerly await the outcome of this. Hopefully (and probably) your light is defective, making it an isolated occurrence.

Other than the parasitic drain, how do you find the light compared to the D10?

I like the beam spread of the D11 compared to the D10. It is a directional floody light, and you can adjust the brightness easily. The D11 UI reminds me of the Photon Proton. The anodise, fit and finish of the D11 are excellent. Also, it has almost double of the runtime of the D10 and runs cooler.
Since I can't believe that Nitecore put on the market a light with 2.4 mA of standby drain, I'm oriented to believe mine is defective. I will be able to measure another D11 this weekend. If there is any other D11 owner, please post here...

Anthony

Matt7337 · Oct 20, 2010

Ray_of_Light said:
I like the beam spread of the D11 compared to the D10. It is a directional floody light, and you can adjust the brightness easily. The D11 UI reminds me of the Photon Proton. The anodise, fit and finish of the D11 are excellent. Also, it has almost double of the runtime of the D10 and runs cooler.

Awesome - great description! It sounds perfect, although I'm a bit conflicted as to how I would carry it with there being no pocket clip on it. For this reason and a couple of others, I am slightly more inclined to go for the IFE1.

compasillo · Oct 20, 2010

I didn't measure the parasitic current in my D11 but could check its efects.
In a week or so it has drained off a fresh energizer L91. The light hasn't be used but
the cell is empty.
Now I'm checking the issue with a NiMH duracell.
Anyway, too bad Nitecore designers... :fail:

Lynx_Arc · Oct 20, 2010

most likely parasitic drain will be more on higher voltage batteries than lower voltage ones. I had a tap light that automatically shuts off after 15 minutes and I kept having dead batteries in it and didn't leave it on that much. I finally figured out it had a 4ma drain on it so 100mah/day was vanishing in 2 weeks the 1500mah nimh AAs were dead.

njet212 · Oct 21, 2010

Anthony,

I have D11 and DMM as well. Care to show me how do you measure standby current? i'll do the measurement for you.

Lynx_Arc · Oct 21, 2010

njet212 said:
Anthony,

I have D11 and DMM as well. Care to show me how do you measure standby current? i'll do the measurement for you.

use a low amps scale (one that can measure ~10ma or less) and if it has a tailcap unscrew the tailcap and use the meter leads to connect the circuit between the body of the light and the battery end (-). If the reading is not registering remove the leads and try the next lower scale (probably nano amps).

Kilovolt · Oct 21, 2010

My D11 has been sitting on a shelf for the last two weeks with a NiMH in it. After reading the above I put the cell in my MAHA and it appears that the same is still nearly fully charged. Maybe there's a batch of lights that have an unusually high parasitic current. :thinking:

Lynx_Arc · Oct 21, 2010

Kilovolt said:
My D11 has been sitting on a shelf for the last two weeks with a NiMH in it. After reading the above I put the cell in my MAHA and it appears that the same is still nearly fully charged. Maybe there's a batch of lights that have an unusually high parasitic current. :thinking:

could also be a "hair" of wire or metal chip across a circuit path.

Ray_of_Light · Oct 21, 2010

First of all, set the minimum brightness on the D11. Set the DMM on 200 mA scale.

To measure the standby current, place the aa cell positive on the central post. Place the negative lead of the DMM on the negative of the aa cell. Use the positive lead of the DMM on the gold-colored ring in the D11 head.

Consider the light, as soon you touch the negative ring with the lead of the DMM, will come on. Since we set the brightness to minimum, it will draw 35-40 mA. Use the DMM lead to push the ring inward, simulating the action of the piston, and the light will turn off. At that point, you will able to read the standby (parasitic) drain.

If you don't set the D11 to minimum brightness, the light will draw initially 1.4 Amps from the battery. Being the DMM set to 200 mA, it will blow the fuse of meter.
Therefore, it is very important to set the brightness to minimum before conducting the measure of the standby current.

Today I measured another D11, which I bought together with mine for a relative. This D11 is even worst, reading 2.9 mA of parasitic drain.

From what Kilovolt has posted, where his D11 is not draining the battery when off, we can reasonably suppose that the excessive standby current of the D11 may be related to a defect of some components, and not a problem of the design.

The two D11 are going back.

Thanks for all the answers.

Anthony

njet212 · Oct 21, 2010

This is what i got from my DMM. Let te picture speak themselves.

Ray_of_Light · Oct 21, 2010

I conducted a voltage scan of the standby drain on the two D11 I have now.

At 1.2 volt, it draws 2.4 mA.
At 1.5 volt, it draws 2.0 mA.
At 3.0 volt, it draws 0.6 mA.

Yes, the standby current decreases as the voltage increases. It will kill a drained battery at faster pace.
This means that, possibly, the standby drain is not due to a failed component but is provided from an ad-hoc power supply.
Subsequently, if there are D11 with no (or much lower) standby drain, they must be of a different design.
Odd.

Regards

Anthony

krevo · Oct 27, 2010

Has anyone addressed this matter with the vendor who supplied your D11? I just got one and haven't noticed any sort of unnecessary drain or depletion of the battery in mine.

BillMPL · Oct 30, 2010

Has anyone tested if this is happening with the new batch of black D11's?

okwchin · Oct 30, 2010

I can confirm that my D10s are around 0.7-0.4ma

2 of my middle generation (D10 XR-E Q5/R2 green board) are 0.4-0.5ma each

my D10 tribute (D10 XP-E red circuit board) is 0.6-0.7ma

My friends D11 will be tested monday if he remembers to bring it back from work, after leaving it there for this weekend. Wonder if the batt is flat by then??

(and i had fun with my NDI measurements) connected up the circuit the same way, measured 55ma... wait.. I cant turn it off...keeps ramping instead... DUHHHH its switched, so 0ma... :ohgeez:

:sigh:

Ti²C · Oct 31, 2010

Ray_of_Light said:
[...] I can't remove the battery everytime I don't use the light.

Thanks

Anthony

hi,

if you untighten the head enough for lockout, then there is no more drain but you still have the instant forward-on ability isn't it ? :thinking:

Ray_of_Light · Oct 31, 2010

Ti²C said:
hi,

if you untighten the head enough for lockout, then there is no more drain but you still have the instant forward-on ability isn't it ? :thinking:

Yes, you're right on this.

Also, the manual is very specific about unscrewing the head one quarter of turn, to avoid the parasitic drain if the D11 go unused for more than a week.

The manual explains that the parasitic drain is necessary for the MCU to mantain the state memory of last used brightness. I wonder why the D11 keeps this memory even with the power disconnected by unscrewing the head.

Regards

Anthony

Marbouk · Oct 31, 2010

Newbie here. I've had my grey d11 about 2 weeks now. Had the same battery in it from the start and still just as bright as a fresh one. Used it regularly every day but I always leave it on high in stand by. For the next week I'm going to leave it on low in stand by with a fresh AA to see if the battery drains.
Must say this is a great torch and wouldn't be without it now, even with the slightly off centre emitter.

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