Gen4 KL1 - anyone modded one?

Was wondering if anyone has tried to replace the circuit with something more efficient like a MM+ or NexGen BB? It would lose the ability to run 2x123 or 3x123 but would turn it into a real 1x123 flame thrower. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Jon

I don't think you're gonna get much response to this. So far, opening one up means destroying it.

Besides, there are already 1X123 flame thrower that are more efficient.

hmm, I was afraid of that. The optics in the new KL1 are very nice, it's a shame the converter isn't that efficient and the emitter isn't being driven that hard. Oh well.

Jon

Well, if you're looking for a light that you can run for a long time, you probably wouldn't want to drive it much harder. Besides, going over 500mA with a reflector/optic that small probably won't get you much more light.

You're probably right. I had a Q3J 1w driven at 700ma using a Fraen LP. It was visibly brighter than a 1w HD @ 500ma driven through a Fraen LP, but that could have been a difference in bins and may not apply to the fancy optics in the KL1. Switching the KL1 to a boost-only circuit would make it more efficient almost immediately (I believe the circuit is similar to the original Wizard?). But this is all moot if the new style KL1s can't be taken apart.

Jon

I destroyed a gen4 KL1 head! I destroyed one! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/party.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinser2.gif

Oops. Strike that. I meant OPENED one. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Nothing to report thus far, except to agree with Chop that you've probably got other options to build what you want. To name some: Aleph 1/2/3 head, PR-T head, Brinkmann Legend LX fitted with a better 27mm reflector and regulation circuit, and many more.

Heck, even the gen3 (and earlier) KL1 head modded with Luxeon III, reflector, and possibly a drive current upgrade would give you what you want.

The one thing I will say, though, is that the gen4 KL1 head even at the full retail price of $56 compares favorably with the price of the stuff I mentioned above. Not to criticize any of that, though... ALL the above that I've seen have been topnotch, super high quality stuff, and well worth the money! Still, it does take a bigger bite out of the pocketbook.

Scott is right about the new KL1. There was time when people were paying me good money to turn their older KL1's into what the new KL1 is now. They actually WANTED that narrow beam and no side spill. Personally, I'd get my hands on an older KL1, put a high dome and reflector in it, and forget it. If you are half way mechanically inclined, you could do these things yourself. Things just get to be a bit dicey when you start messing with the circuit.

All of the alternatives are excellent indeed, but they all use smallish reflectors to direct a portion of the light into a spot-like beam while the rest is a flood of direct light straight from the emitter. I admit to being wrong-in-the-head /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif but I prefer the narrow beams w/ little spill that optics provide because they seem to waste a little less of the photons.

For example, I have a PR-T/Lux3/DB1000 combo and while it will throw a wicked spot I still can't get over the photons that are wasted to direct "spill". I have expiremented by removing the PR and placing a Fraen LP over the emitter. The result was a spot that was a wider than the original and to my eyes at least as bright.

That line of thinking lead me to wonder how the new KL1 would perform if the emitter was driven a bit harder (maybe 700ma?) which then raised efficiency concerns related to the higher bias.

But, the advantages that I see in modifying the new KL1 include pushing the optic to its limit (see if it can beat the Inova T3!), making it more efficient in the process and, well, it just looks so dern cool. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Maybe I should stop day dreaming and just enjoy my lights. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Jon

I seen the beam of the new gen KL1 and it is great. I would like to get ahold of one of those optics, and try it out in my VIP and mini-pro III. What optic is SureFire using?

Well, if that is what you are interested in, you could try a Fraen LP optic.

Bullzeyebill,
SureFire is using a SureFire optic in the new KL1. Aside from using the NX05's initially with the Luxeon's SF has always designed and developed their own optic solutions (reflectors obviously included in the term optic)

Jon,
From what you have described, I think you would like the KL1 boosted to a higher output as it is amazing what it puts out with 420 mA to the LED. If you get a chance, check out one of the McR-20 reflectors sometime. The added depth of it takes a fair amount of that spill and re directs it into the spot. Still ther is spill but useful. IMHO.

Scott,
Were you successful in opening the KL1 without damage to the parts?

Don,
I opened the lower portion of the head with no damage to the exterior, but in the process accidentally ripped a couple components off the circuit board. I think it could easily be repaired once I identify the missing parts. I've got one component sitting on my desk, and the other got lost somewhere in my carpet. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif

The odd thing was, the head still worked even with the missing components! Except that it was drawing LESS current from the 123 cell. It may or may not have been dimmer on the output side, but since I hadn't taken lux measurements yet, I couldn't be sure.

Next, I tried to open the top portion of the housing, which appears to be like an outer aluminum hood threaded onto a frame inside the light. When I attempted this, I stripped the threads on the inside lower portion of the light! So it would no longer close. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

The good news is that earlier today I was able to hand rethread the head using a diamond cutting wheel on my Dremel. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif The bad news is that I never did get that top chamber opened, so I've seen neither the optic nor the emitter.

I did install a different board in the gen4 KL1, just for giggles! I connected the boost circuit board from a Nuwai Quantum-III... and it works great! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Bottom line (for now at least), it looks like the gen4 KL1 circuit section can relatively easily be opened and the circuit can be removed completely in favor of something else. It also looks like an ecan could be mounted nicely... but the stock emitter will stay, at least until someone figures out how to open that top chamber!

Here are a couple quick photos of the gen4 KL1 circuit board, but remember that a couple components (transistors?) are missing... you'll see two locations around the edge of the board where three empty solder pads are sitting there, but once had components connected...

Well,

Looking at that board, and not being an electronics guy, it looks very similar to the older KL1 circuit. I can see that they went with the .68 ohm current sense resistor, rather than the standard 1 ohm resistor (I think). This would account for the increase in current from 350mA to 550mA.

It also looks, and correct me if I am wrong, like they went with a .075 ohm inductor sense resistor, rather than the previous .1 ohm resistor.

Both resistors LOOK like they have 1/3 less resistance than the older KL1 boards. This accounts for the increase in current.

Maybe I should get one of these and soak it in acetone for a day or two and see what else comes apart.

Chop, Don, and anyone else, I'll be posting a new thread to show some details of my KL1 gen4 board transplant, hopefully in the next day or two. When I do so, I'll post a link here to let everyone know.

[ QUOTE ]
McGizmo said:

Jon,
From what you have described, I think you would like the KL1 boosted to a higher output as it is amazing what it puts out with 420 mA to the LED. If you get a chance, check out one of the McR-20 reflectors sometime. The added depth of it takes a fair amount of that spill and re directs it into the spot. Still ther is spill but useful. IMHO.



[/ QUOTE ]

Don, the McR-20 is the reflector found in the Aleph2, right? Someone (I forgot who) said that it gives more of a semi-flood beam with a Lux1 or Lux3. Are there screen shots? EDIT: Nevermind, I just found a ton of beamshots in the Reviews forum.

I may replace the circuit in my KL1 with a DB1000 or something similar, but I've never opened a SF head before so I run the risk of destroying or at least marring the unit.

Jon

StoneDog,

If you have an older KL1, I have run those up to 1A and they worked fine, although a bit inefficient.

I've often thought of modding a KL1 with a McR20 reflector. I haven't even taken measurements yet, though. My thoughts are that, if you use a thinner heatsink for the lux and make sure that there is a good thermal path between the sink and head, you should be OK on the heat issue. You could then use a mineral glass lens in place of the thick stock lens. Doing these two things, you may be able to get the McR20 in there without having to face too much material off of the reflector.

On the other hand, that's a lot of trouble to go through for what would essentially be an Aleph II. I might take a look at the project anyway, just for fun.

Chop, been there, done that! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yellowlaugh.gif I've got a KL1 head boosted to 700mA running an SO20XA reflector. (No lathe, so plastic works MUCH better for me. You're lucky!) /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif I did cut it down a bit, but IMHO it still pumps out a pretty nice beam. It's still using the stock Pyrex reflector, and the stock heatsink has been replaced with a Luxeon III star (with Arctic Silver 5 thermal compound between star and KL1 body), which actually DECREASES the vertical space a teensy bit... but it was an experimental light for me, and the results seem to have been pretty good. That was a relief, 'cause it could have been a total disaster! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Actually, I'm putting the KL1-20mm head (as I refer to it) up for sale. Got too many KL1 heads, and some have gotta go. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mecry.gif Here are a couple photos of it mounted on a VG 1x123 twisty tube, which is also up for sale...





Ironically, several months ago I mounted an ENTIRE SO20XA reflector in an L1 (not KL1) head! To do so, I used a MiniMag lens in place of the stock Pyrex, and made a spacer to cover a few exposed threads because the bezel didn't tighten all the way down. It worked well, but eventually I got tired of it and took it apart again. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif

PM sent for the VG-1

Cool, thanks for all of the ideas everyone. My new KL1 looks at me fearfully whenever I walk by it. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif Soon it may receive a circuit transplant or at least new resistors(??) to raise the output.

Now I need to figure out if I want to keep my KL4/BE1.5/McE2S or sell it off to fund an Aleph2 1x123... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jpshakehead.gif

Jon

how hard is it to change the optics to a reflector ?
am i going to kill my new KL1?, the Lux is nice and white
but that beam just has to go...i'm not a big fan of the fraen LP either.