Cavers - The StenLight, Ultimate 2x3W LED Headlamp

[jtice]

Re: Cavers - The StenLight, Ultimate 2x3W LED Head

additional cover?
no, just looks like a couple layers of thick heat shrink.

Should hold up to most situations though,
but if you are wanting inpact resistance, there isnt any.

I would like to find some nice 4AA or 6AA holders to use with it.

~John

 

[cue003]

Re: Cavers - The StenLight, Ultimate 2x3W LED Head

It says above that this production light will use a 5 degree and a 15 degree optic. On the website fact sheet it lists something different....

"Smooth 20 degree beam pattern with other user-swappable lens options"

Are we still going to be able to change optics to match our desired function?

Pelu, thanks for the suggestion. I will see if I can track one down. I am concerned about mounting the battery pack to the headband etc. I will have to find the right parts and try to put something together before buying this light.

I have been on a big headlamp kick lately.

................ I just checked the Speleo website and did not see anything about the headbands being available for a "blade mount" separately..... hmm They are in the UK....I may have to call them.. Next I will check out Petzl.

Can anyone point me to the right parts to buy?

Curtis

 

[jtice]

Re: Cavers - The StenLight, Ultimate 2x3W LED Head

I think they say a 20 degree beam on that one page cuz 5 + 15 is 20 ??? :shrug:
Even though thats not how that works hehe

Yes, you can change the optics.
I am trying to find some optics for it, but not having much luck.
I can find tight beam optics easy, but cant seem to find any wide beam ones.
I place to do alot of experimenting with different optics, and maybe even a reflector.

I also plan to make a ton of attachments for it,
headlamp, bike, gun, camera, tripod, etc.

~John

 

[PeLu]

Re: Cavers - The StenLight, Ultimate 2x3W LED Head

additional cover?
no, just looks like a couple layers of thick heat shrink.

We used plastic house tubing (for plumbing), I don't know if it is still PVC, it is grey here and thermoplastic.
That means you look for an approbriate size of this tubing (inside diameter 33mm should fit) make it hot (glycerine, oil) and make it oval.
If you do more than one, a wooden template (exp?) will help.

This is what we did for other cells (SubC).

Headband:
Look at the NOVA's headband on
http://www.speleo.co.uk/

If we can find out here what the StenLight's blade's inside width is...

They also have (had?) a headband which accepts a blade mount, I've seen it in (British) caving shops.

 

[jtice]

Re: Cavers - The StenLight, Ultimate 2x3W LED Head

PeLu,

Hmmm good idea, that would make it more impact/crush proof.
though I dont see why you really need that.
But it would protect from deep gouges though.

 

[cue003]

Re: Cavers - The StenLight, Ultimate 2x3W LED Head

Maybe Dar (I think that is who has one....) or Jtice when he gets his can provide us with the information on the inside diameter of the blade to help facilitate the search for an appropriate headband.

Pelu,
will we also have to figure out how to mount the battery pack correct?

Thanks.

 

[dar]

Sorry for not posting photos yet, I've been extremely busy this week. I'll give CPF some love early next week, after another serious caving trip this weekend. I've modified my helmet again with a strong strap that holds the battery in place on top the super-velcro so there's no chance of it falling. It's still not protected from being scrapped against a low ceiling though!

Someone asked about optics, from a quick visual inspection, the optics below appear to be the correct ones for the StenLight (two big ears, four internal "nubs" visible):

http://www.ledsupply.com/led-optics.html

ps. the new forums (hardware?) are so much more pleasant to use!

 

[Ocelot]

Re: Cavers - The StenLight, Ultimate 2x3W LED Head

I would like to have a pack with 4 cells.

Not gonna happen unless the voltage adds up to around 7V.

They went with two 3W Luxeons in series, and make use of a step-down regulator. The documentation mentions they did this for greater efficiency, and they quote numbers in the 85% range for step-up regulators. Of course, that is at full output. At lower output, which is where the light will be running 95% of the time, the step-up regulator will be much more efficient, and the difference won't be so much.

This is one reason I still make my own lights: I don't always agree with the design decisions made by others. By requiring a high voltage, you cannot use 4AA alkaline cells in a pinch. Well, perhaps at quite low output levels. But when caving in a 3rd world country, it's nice to know that you could buy backup batteries for your light if you run out of others or someone at the airport confiscates them (it has happened).

Scott

 

[niemidc]

A few notes from one of the StenLight designers:

The battery pack does have a layer of heat shrink on the outside. This is mostly for abrasion resistance. It's true that it does not have a hard plastic case (we may do that in the future when we get larger quantities going) but it DOES have pretty good protection for the batteries.

Outside the steel cases of the Li Ion cells, there are 3 thin layers of hard heat shrink, then 3 layers of rubber dip for waterproofing, THEN finally the outer heat shrink you observed. They have held up in caves well so far (including some prototypes without the outer heat shrink). We experimented with a variety of coverings, and believe we have a good tradeoff of bulk/weight vs. durability. In theory you could crush or dent them between two large rocks, but your helmet would be having discomfort by that point. I don't think scraping or gouging is a big issue; I've disassembled some of them and it takes significant effort to cut through all the layers of protection even with a sharp knife.

The blade on the StenLight is 0.75", and the inside bend is roughly 0.1". It fits every blade mount bracket we could find.

A fresh 4-cell alkaline pack or a 6V lead acid pack will work with the StenLight, but won't have enough voltage for full Turbo. Once they drop below 5V you won't get anything out any more. A 9V alkaline makes a good, compact backup battery for the StenLight (we're going to offer an adapter for this purpose). Of course, the ideal backup battery is a second Li Ion battery ;^)

 

[PeLu]

Re: Cavers - The StenLight, Ultimate 2x3W LED Head

4 cell pack

Not gonna happen unless the voltage adds up to around 7V.

I was thinking about a 2p2s config, of course. Changing battery in cave is something I avoid.

As it looks, the original pack is sturdy enough for most caving uses. I did the plastic tube trick for rotary hammer power packs, as these are sometimes treated not very carefully while transporting them.
This might also happen with spare batteries for the light, of couse it could be avoided with putting it into something else.
In practical live it will just not always happen....

They went with two 3W Luxeons in series, and make use of a step-down regulator....
This is one reason I still make my own lights: I don't always agree with the design decisions made by others. By requiring a high voltage, you cannot use 4AA alkaline cells in a pinch. Well, perhaps at quite low output levels. But when caving in a 3rd world country, it's nice to know that you could buy backup batteries for your light if you run out of others or someone at the airport confiscates them (it has happened).

I would also prefer a lower input voltage, additionally there are no balancing problems with LiIon cells when you just use the usual 3.6V input.....

And use one of my numerous Li D cells I have at home and at one of these countries you mentioned above .-)

 

[niemidc]

The cells in the production StenLight batteries are EXTREMELY well-matched at the factory, and this is verified during QA testing. So I don't think balancing is much of an issue. If we were designing a low-power light, one Li Ion cell is hard to beat, but as power goes up it is advantageous to increase the input voltage.

One StenLight battery lasts through 2-3 long days of typical caving usage on a charge (mostly a mix of Low and Medium, with shorter periods of High and Turbo). Even if you use a lot of High you are unlikely to have to change batteries during a day of caving.

I do know someone who does a lot of video in caves on Turbo, and he uses large 7.2 NiMH packs instead; and some people use them off 12V; but for most people the standard batteries have plenty of capacity.

 

[cave dave]

I got to play with one at the IMO tent last weekend. Very, very nice. I like the switch a lot. Easy to tell what level its set at and change to another level with gloved hands, without turning the light off and then back on etc like some other designs. I can't imagine that velcro will hold the battery in place in a tight passage though.

Would like to be able to charge from my car. Caving usually involves camping somewhere without AC.

If they had the bike mount, and a car charger available I probably would have bought the whole package on the spot. Instead I bought a custom cave suit (thanks Cecil)

As an aside its sort of hard to compare the light with the ActionLight 3, since that light is vaporware so far. It was supposed to show up at NSS Convention but did not. Nobody has seen one but Henry at this point and he's not sharing details.

 

[jtice]

Got my Stenlight today !!!!! :rock:

I had the pleasure of checking out Dar's before I made the purchase.
But now that I have been able to handle this one all afternoon, I LOVE it.

- I also like the switch, long travel makes it easy to tell what level you are on.
- The size is great, aLOT of light for a light this size.
- Hinge is nice and tight, there are some "plastic" washers that make it not slip.
- Slightly concerned about the switches slot, getting filled with mud.
But you can just wash it out with water anyway, the switch doesnt penitrate the casing. (hall effect)

I decided to make my own battery pack.
I am very firmilar with the 18650 lithium cells used in the Stenlights factory pack.
I used LG 2400 mAh cells, with a 7.2V protection circuit from batteryspace.com
The Triton charger will be taking care of the cells, though I would also like a car adaptor. I may at least get one of the 120V wall wart types from batteryspace.com and plug it into my 12V power inverter.

The protection circuit was shrink wrapped, then the open ends were sealed with epoxy. The cells were also shrink wrapped, but I forgot to take a pic of that :geez:

The clamp shell case is metal, so should provide alot of impact/crush resistance.
It was then epoxy sealed, except for VERY small places by the hinge.
This is was to let gas buildup excape.

I bought a few different metal and plastic blade attachments for the helmet.
But went with the metal one due to its low profile.
I wrapped some electrical tape around the middle of it to make the Stenlights blade fit real tight. Not that it would have fell of if I hadnt.

Please excuse the long bolts sticking out.
Those will be replaced later, I just used them to make sure this is how and where I wanted the bracket.

I will be spending the next few days doing ALOT of testing.
I have a variety of optics and reflectors I want to try in the Stenlight, to get that perfert beam
I might take beamshots using different types also.

I will have a full review of the Stenlight on my site, with better pics,
after a few weeks of hard testing :devil:

First Impression Conclusion? :goodjob: niemidc :rock:

~John

 

[dar]

Here's a minus for the StenLight's battery charger:

If the charger is not plugged into an AC outlet, and a battery is plugged in to it, the charger's level indicator lights up green.

I plugged a battery pack in, thinking my charger was plugged into the power strip below, saw green, put the battery in my cave pack. The battery was almost completely discharged. This could cause *serious* problems for someone. Luckily I brought a second battery with me. I wound up purchasing a cheap 12V inverter from Wal-Mart so I could charge the other battery in my car for the second half of the caving trip. Luckily the full battery easily lasted a 10 hour cave.

* I believe this charger should not light up at all if no AC power is applied! * I would almost understand if it served as a battery level indicator when not charging, but that's not the way it works. This should be changed for the second revision!

I wound up using the 'turbo' setting for in-cave photos, setting the exposure time long and "painting" with my light (a trick shown to me by CPF member jtice). This light had no problem lighting up the huge, 180 foot tall waterfall room in WV's Cass Cave.

Also, the super-velcro was not strong enough for my tastes, and I do not prefer to have the battery pack sitting unprotected on my helmet where I *will* scrape against low ceilings during crawls. I drilled a slot in my helmet and threaded a wide strap with clip around the battery to hold it very firmly in place on top of the super-velcro. Additionally, I fashioned a protective polycarbonate bumper plate to keep any corners or edges from rubbing rock.

In spite of my small criticisms, this light is awesome! It has impressed every caver that's seen it so far... bikers too!

 

[jtice]

Hi Dar,

I saw some of the photos you guys took, nice work,
that drop into Cass looked sweeeeet.
Bet that wasnt fun going back UP though :green:

Well, I have been playing,,,, er ah, testing my Stenlight all night.
I replaced the stock topics with 2 25 degree optics.
But they are slightly different heights, so I have to put a couple layers of electrical tape one one side of the optic holder, and trim it to its shape.
That shimmed them up, nd made them fit tight against the lens.
Now its a much more flood beam.

oh BTW, Dar, you have mail !

~John

 

[dar]

Very interesting, check out these products from batteryspace.com:


http://www.batteryspace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1199

7.2V 2400mah Li-Ion 18650 battery pack module with PCB (Protection IC)

This looks like the factory StenLight battery pack, minus thick heat-shrink and the connector. $22.95 from batteryspace.com, $50 from StenLight!


http://www.batteryspace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1121

Universal Smart Charger For any 7.2V Li-ion Rechargeable Battery Pack

This looks identical down to the letter as my CL84-1 1.2V Li-ion Smart Charger, minus the connector. $18.99 from batteryspace.com, $30 from StenLight.


Both these products are cheaper in bulk. Who can find me a cheap supplier of the connector used on the StenLight?

 

[jtice]

Dar,

Those are the ones I used for my pack. except I used the 2400 mAh cells.
Same protection circuit though.

The charger is the same charger, but Stenlight put their connector on it.
Which can be bought from digikey.com page 120 of their catalog.

CAUTION !!!
Rechargable Lithium cell scen be VERY dangerous is not assembled and charged properly.
Make sure to contact me of someone else that have delt with them before,
before you try making your own packs.

~John

 

[PeLu]

If the charger is not plugged into an AC outlet, and a battery is plugged in to it, the charger's level indicator lights up green.

That also means that the battery is discharged in this case. Not good. As I wrote several times, I charge my caving batteries with a generator which is switched off sometimes in the night (usually later that I go to bed).

On the other hand, nothing is easier changed as the charger and I would just stick with my chargers anyway (they are 12V powered and use a wall wart for 230V).
Lupine has some very nice and good chargers for 7.2V packs which are universal for 12V and 100-250V. And they tell you the charged capacity. But they are, of course, Lupine priced.

I want to change my Melzer Radon lights to this plugs, so I'm looking for a source of them, too.
Also I will make several emergency packs with primary lithium cells.

 

[jtice]

Well, I gave the Stenlight a pretty good test over the weekend doing some caving.

I am very pleased.
The 2 25 degree optics made a really nice flood, that was almost completely artifact free.
I used the medium and high settings the most, and use low if we were taking a break to eat etc.

The switch is great, the large "handle" and long travel, makes it really easy to operate, and real easy to tell what level you are in by simply feeling where the switch is positioned.

After we got out of the cave, we walked down to the river to take a quick swim and clean up a bit.
I noticed that there was some dirt in the switch, and it was quite gritty to move it.
Being a bit concerned, I submerged the entire Stenlight in the river, and rotated the switch back adn forth about 10 times.
This flushed out all the dirt, and the switch was working smoothly again.

I hope to do a runtime test on my battery pack tonight,
which should be close to the ratings stated on Stenlights site, seeing how I used the same cells in mine.
Though, I am charging mine with the Triton charger.

The Stenlight can get pretty warm after about 15 to 20 minutes on high.
But it seemed to stabalize at a reasonable temperature. And it has thermal protection builtin to the circuit anyway.
I dont think there would be a problem leaving it on any setting you wanted.

~John

 

[cue003]

Can the LED's be upgraded in the Stenlight? I would like to use the more efficient K2 emitters when they become available to reduce the heat output etc of the light. I am a little more concerned about heat than most since I am going to use this light as a headlamp 99.9% of the time. I just need to piece everything together with appropriate head strap/battery holder and then buy this baby.

JTICE, looking forward to hearing more about the optic choices and possibly some beamshots of the different optics etc.