HDS Systems EDC # 19

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emarkd

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Clickies should always be shipping with the clip, but again, Rotaries outsell Clickies by 10 to 1.
But you can order a clicky without a clip, using the custom order page. So my question is what percentage of custom-order clickies are spec'ed without a clip? That seems to me to be a better metric for predicting demand for a Rotary clip, than looking at what percentage of Rotary buyers currently choose not to add on the very expensive and ugly (your word, not mine :) ) universal.
 

nbp

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My Clickies sport Prometheus and Moddoo clips (yes I have an elusive Ti Moddoo clip from many years ago hehe).

My awesome cerakote Rotary sits on the shelf a lot cuz it's hard to carry. :(

I personally was one who never understood why the old screw holes were abandoned. THEY WORKED. If it was just that the MOLLE clips were ugly then a new clip could have been designed. Guys like wvaltakis made awesome aftermarket clips so it was possibly. And for people who didn't want clips they were easy to take off. Removing the screw holes seemed to me to be an overreaction and we have now spent years trying to come up with solutions for a problem we already had a solution for.

I've had at least 10 HDS so clearly I'll keep buying them either way. Haha
 

emarkd

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My Clickies sport Prometheus and Moddoo clips (yes I have an elusive Ti Moddoo clip from many years ago hehe).

I've had at least 10 HDS so clearly I'll keep buying them either way. Haha

Actually this is me too. I have 9 of the lights currently and none of them have stock HDS clips on them. The Moddoo/Oveready clips are just better, even on Clickies. And I don't hate bezel-up carry on my Rotaries. Its not ideal, I'd appreciate another solution, but I won't stop buying or carrying them if it never happens.

Regardless, I'm not sure it changes my test much. Checking the ratio of custom-built clickes sold with/without clips has gotta be at least as indicative as checking the ratio of rotaries/universal clips sold.

My awesome cerakote Rotary sits on the shelf a lot cuz it's hard to carry. :(

Well if that happens to be the NRA Blue light then let me give it some attention! :grin2:
 
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nbp

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Actually this is me too. I have 9 of the lights currently and none of them have stock HDS clips on them. The Moddoo/Oveready clips are just better, even on Clickies. And I don't hate bezel-up carry on my Rotaries. Its not ideal, I'd appreciate another solution, but I won't stop buying or carrying them if it never happens.

Regardless, I'm not sure it changes my test much. Checking the ratio of custom-built clickes sold with/without clips has gotta be at least as indicative as checking the ratio of rotaries/universal clips sold.



Well if that happens to be the NRA Blue light then let me give it some attention! :grin2:

No sorry it's an orange kote Rotary neutral 200. Awesome light! But it is funny to carry with no clip.

The NRA Blue is a Clicky 325. One of my most prized as I think there are only about 10 in existence!
 

emarkd

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The NRA Blue is a Clicky 325. One of my most prized as I think there are only about 10 in existence!

I know there are very few of them, and I was 99% sure you had one, so I had to take a shot. :)

If you change your mind, you know... :)
 

Hogokansatsukan

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But you can order a clicky without a clip, using the custom order page. So my question is what percentage of custom-order clickies are spec'ed without a clip? That seems to me to be a better metric for predicting demand for a Rotary clip, than looking at what percentage of Rotary buyers currently choose not to add on the very expensive and ugly (your word, not mine :) ) universal.

Ah! OK. Now I understand. And the answer is.... I have no clue. I'll check with Henry on Tuesday when I see him. Either way, he is working on a solution and I will give my input. If I won't dance with her... I will open my big mouth and tell Henry. A few years ago at SHOT I made him put something under the table and not show people. While function is definitely priority... darn it, it should look nice too! I have seen the sketches, and so far they have Hogo's nod of approval... but I'll keep watching. I would probably use a clip on the light even though I holster carry because I like versatility... but my goodness that girl is ugly! It's like a 3 foot wide buttocks in Spandex ugly. I just can't do it no matter how much rum I've had. Now, if I were younger and still herding bad guys, I may not care as much because of how strong that Universal Clip is, but as it stands, if I woke up one morning after drinking a lot rum and my Rotary was on my arm with the Universal clip on it, I might gnaw my own arm off and slip out the window so I didn't wake it up.
The two holes will NOT come back. There was constant complaining from the non-clip folks with that design.
 

Hogokansatsukan

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Tough for clickies to compete with Zebralights with new programmable interface.

Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. I would still like to take a shotgun to it! he he he. I would also like to verify their "levels" on the integrating sphere. There are particular problems with ultra low levels that cause them to flicker or end up not a constant level from light to light in production unless each is calibrated. I've had a couple Zebras, and they do seem like nice lights (though the one I have left has all kinds of switch problems, but it's an older head lamp). Has anyone run an actual run time test and verified their claims... not that a flashlight company would ever be dishonest...
 

recDNA

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Not I but since my 62w is about the same size as my HDS rotary I'm sure its 18650 lasts as long as the primary in my HDS! LOL
 

scout24

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Tough for clickies to compete with Zebralights with new programmable interface.

Not tough at all in my pocket, depending on the intended use... Apples and oranges. :) Hogo- the standard black basic HDS clip does the job. Fancy is nice, but doesn't make a better anti-roll device than the plain black. And the black is nice and stealth.
 

Hogokansatsukan

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Not I but since my 62w is about the same size as my HDS rotary I'm sure its 18650 lasts as long as the primary in my HDS! LOL

I do have to admit, I am rather jaded as far as the flashlight industry goes. Sometimes too much knowledge is a bad thing. A company I fell in love with back in 1995 turned out to be a sociopathic serial killer who molests children... well, no, just extremely deceptive, disruptive, and a thief. We all have been lied to so many times the community had to step in with the FL1 standard, that now becomes manipulated by some of the same companies that helped to ensure it was made. One company that I trust and respect, the owner is stepping down... I'll miss David. Just a truly down to earth and HONEST guy. It is just so many have the business model of copy and lie. I mean, my business model for Thor's Hammer may be a bit chunky and not look so good in a bikini, but she's honest and fun to party with.

The funny thing is, I never set out to learn any of industries dirty little secrets, but the industry, if compared to Weinstein, well, I would sooner trust my 16 year old daughter with Weinstein... If I had a daughter, that is It's probably because of my previous profession where I can't stop digging if I see something amiss.. The problem is, you can't do it with a shovel, you need a backhoe. I have to keep myself confined to this particular forum or my head explodes (that and other moderators don't get my particular sense of humor... maybe if I gave them an hour with my business model...) It's just when I see "blank light is the best" and you know "blank" light was someone else's design that was supposed to made for X by Y, but Y took it and produced it under Y brand. Or "Made in USA" this and that and if they really checked, all the parts of from China and it's screwed together here. There is just so much BS in the industry. It's why I respect Henry. He isn't playing games. He states what he is doing with the light. He tells you what the light is ACTUALLY doing. There is nothing remotely deceptive in his claims or anything that is misleading.
The other thing I respect is that the Clicky was the culmination of decades of work going back to the Action Light. While he is an engineer, he's a caver which is what brought about his interest in flashlights. He's not just some guy who wanted to get into the flashlight business. He got into out of a desire to make the best light so HE could use it for caving. I respect that so much more than a person or company who just wants to get into the business to make money. It's how I got into leather work. It was purely for me and my desire to have better duty gear. I never dreamed it would end up a business. Oh, and there is a lot of dirty pool in the leather business as well, but my chunky party girl business model doesn't care. She may like to party, but she's no dirty girl.
 

F89

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Tough for clickies to compete with Zebralights with new programmable interface.

Regardless that I think the clicky interface and usage is better than the rotary, for me and anyone else who prefers them anyway, to compare a zebra light to a clicky is way out there in my opinion.
What kind of lab did you say you worked in again?
 

emarkd

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I just looked back - only 7 were built! Whoa!

7?! That's great and all but I only want to buy one! :grin2:

Ah! OK. Now I understand. And the answer is.... I have no clue. I'll check with Henry on Tuesday when I see him. Either way, he is working on a solution and I will give my input.

Thanks I appreciate it but if he's already working on something its kind of a moot point. I may have misunderstood your earlier comment but I kinda got the impression that since only 15% of current Rotary buyers order a clip then Henry may not see it as much of a demand. And I'd wager that many more folks than that would order if the clip were cheaper and prettier. Glad to hear its being pursued already.

Tough for clickies to compete with Zebralights with new programmable interface.

That's just, like, your opinion man...

To be honest I like Zebralights too. I own a lot of those, including some new ones with the new UI. They're great lights, but they're not HDS-great. But then that's just, like, my opinion.

Has anyone run an actual run time test and verified their claims... not that a flashlight company would ever be dishonest...

Only one comes to mind, and that's just because I saw it recently. A guy on the reddit flashlight sub tested his. Full details at that link but here's the spoiler: Zebra claims 5.5 months, he says he got 319 days.
 

recDNA

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Still love David's Titanium Quarks. That XP-G was horrible but gorgeous lights and the tactical interface was really cool. At the time I thought $89 was outrageously expensive so I only bought one and felt guilty about it. Really wish I had purchased one in every size. Just needed to have them modded to a Nichia 219b and you really had a spectacular little clicky. Nice clips too LOL.
 

ironhorse

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I'm in the no clip camp. I don't like them and I don't use them. I do happen to have a couple of holsters from Hogo that at least one is on my belt every single day.
 

Hogokansatsukan

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Still love David's Titanium Quarks. That XP-G was horrible but gorgeous lights and the tactical interface was really cool. At the time I thought $89 was outrageously expensive so I only bought one and felt guilty about it. Really wish I had purchased one in every size. Just needed to have them modded to a Nichia 219b and you really had a spectacular little clicky. Nice clips too LOL.

I still have a bunch of his lights, though I don't have any more of his titanium ones. I try very hard not to collect lights, knives, guns, etc anymore. It's a hard thing for me not to do. I still carry his Atom on my keychain and his stainless Preon Revo (there is dirt there as well that was done to David regarding that light). I got to see him at SHOT and wish him well.
 

Hogokansatsukan

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7?!

Thanks I appreciate it but if he's already working on something its kind of a moot point. I may have misunderstood your earlier comment but I kinda got the impression that since only 15% of current Rotary buyers order a clip then Henry may not see it as much of a demand. And I'd wager that many more folks than that would order if the clip were cheaper and prettier. Glad to hear its being pursued already.

Yep. It's being worked on. I mean the reality is, whether Henry or I use a clip doesn't make a difference. The light needs one, and needs a good one... that isn't fugly or horrendously expensive (for a clip). I don't know that I would be a holster guy if I hadn't spent a good deal of my life carrying 25 pounds of crap around on my belt daily in a past life... well, maybe I still would be.
 

flatline

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I'm in the no clip camp. I don't like them and I don't use them. I do happen to have a couple of holsters from Hogo that at least one is on my belt every single day.

Whenever I put my HDS back in the holster I got from Hogo, I carefully slide the clip over the holster's edge. Before I used the clip, the light once tried to work its way past the spare the battery and slip out the bottom of the holster. Luckily, I noticed before the light made it all the way out, but from that point on, the clip is part of the system.

--flatline
 

nbp

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7?! That's great and all but I only want to buy one! :grin2:

My currrent HDS lineup. Have had two Twisties including the very cool 85Tr and and bunch of other Clickies including a Ti Clicky come through my hands but these are what I have now.

Clicky N170 w/ Prometheus clip I torch flamed

Clicky 325 NRA Blue Cerakote w/ Ti Moddoo clip

Rotary N200 Orange Cerakote


IMG_4811_zps4vwgrf56.jpg

 
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