Street robber/mugger blinding torch needed.

[jorn]

The sun has 100000 lux. A edc flashlight has lets say 3000-10000 lux. Do you get "stunned" looking at the sun? . With any ambient light a flashlight would be rubbish for self defense, except a 6d mag lite. No mugger would respect your "blinding" edc light. If you flash him, he would prob steal your flashlight too.The mugger would be better armed and more prepared than you (only the mugger knows that you're going to be robbed before it happens). If not better armed, he will be way bigger than his victims. You dont see a tiny dude try to go up agains a big dude unarmed.

Buy her some nice running shoes. (women love shoes so its a win-win situation) I have mentioned it before here on cpf in a similar tread, and still think it's the best advice i can give.

 

[pilote]

...pointing a light at some perp at a distance ain't gonna do much, but 100+ lumens in the eyes at close range will blind someone well more than a few seconds, and that victim will be seeing blue spots for at least a good 7-10 mins..."blue spots" are extremely troublesome to walk around on...

...distracting enough to get away? i don't know...

 

[hyperloop]

The OP has been a member here for a while, but with a low post count he is probably not a frequent visitor and has obviously posted this question for perfectly reasonable motives.

As other members have pointed out, he is based in the UK, where carrying any type of offensive weapon (gun, gas spray, club, knife, tazer etc) is strictly prohibited.

The problem with threads like this is twofold: first, they rapidly head off-topic and into discussion of violence (guns, knives, how best to cause gruesome injuries etc); and second, because there is a tendency to foster the ill-advised notion that by carrying a "blinding" flashlight, a person will be able to defend him/herself from an attacker.

Fumbling in a bag for a flashlight and then (in highly stressful circumstances) trying to remember how to operate it, is to say the least most unlikely to be the best course of action. Far better would be to run and/or scream as loud as possible. As a last-ditch resort, a flashlight might give you a second or two of delay or serve as a blunt (or sharp) object in an unavoidable fight, but that is about it.

As mentioned, there has been the usual straying away into off-topic discussion, but there have been some very sensible posts here also. Let's see if we can bring this thread around by putting an end to the off-topic element of this, and by suggesting other more sensible courses of action for the OP's wife, such as ensuring she does not walk home from the rail station at night by herself, or perhaps that she enrols in a course of self-defense lessons. Most of the good courses will stress the importance of not putting oneself in harm's way in the first place.

lol +1 man, which is why i suggested that the light be in her hand as soon as she exits the train station.

where i live, singapore, when any of my women friends head home, they usually call home so that someone is waiting for them when they get there. This may NOT be possible for OP's wife but it can be considered, perhaps calling a taxi to pick her up and drive her home to the doorstep may be a solution, it may cost more but what is cost compared to the safety of a loved one???

I do not drive, neither does my missus, but i tell her, get a taxi to send u home, ask him to walk you to the elevatorm, give him a tip to do so.

still, back to topic, a light isnt going to do very much but i tried to stick to the topic and am still standin by an L2M with MC-E, small, packs a reasonable punch (runtime as i said, doesnt matter cos it will ONLY be used in emergencies) and get one of the personal alarms.

 

[john10001]

hmmm, desperate, jumped up, experienced street robber (or two....) versus untrained woman with supposedly blinding torch buried at bottom of handbag, how do you reckon the score in that match will end up............

I still can't fathom the idea that people think a torch can protect them, I really can't. Either you can fight or you can't, I don't see how a torch changes things (unless of course it's to see where you aim your Glock).

That's a good point. Usually you won't knwo you're going to be attacked and robbed until its too late anyway. The only way you might have a chance would be if you had the torch immediately to hand at all times in your hand or close by such as on a belt thing with a retractable cord. Even then at close quarters you have got to grab it and turn it on and point it in the attackers face.

Wish we had the option of looking to see where to aim our Glocks here in Britain

I think the Romisen probably sounds best for this, but in the bottom of a handbag I don't think it will be useful. The attacked might end up with a nice flashlight as well as your money.

John

 

[Gary123]

Can't read this whole thread, but a couple points:

1 - obviously get a click, not a twisty
2 - she will need a lanyard on the light that is attached to her purse strap or something so she can easily find the lanyard and pull the light out.

 

[TooManyGizmos]

I hope the street robbers and muggers don't catch on to the usefulness of a blinding torch !

If they do ... they will shine one into the eyes of the victim to blind and intimidate THEM ... and also prevent themselves from being identified later in a lineup . ( she can't identify me Judge , I was blinding her with a powerful flashlight )

The robber would also use the blinding torch to disorient the police and prevent his capture .

Judge : ... Officer , did you pursue and apprehend the suspect ?

Officer : ... No Sir , I was blinded by the torch , tripped on my shoelaces, and poo'd myself.

Judge : ... This is a case of "blinded justice" ... case dismissed .


I want to know ... does rob3rto(the OP) really think his "now wife" can be protected from an attack by a flashlight ? He should go to his lawmakers and the local authorities and ask them ... How do they advise their wives and mothers to protect themselves if attacked ? A flashlight Forum can't provide the answers !

If she's at the train station , she should look for an officer to stand beside.
.

 

[Launch Mini]

Don't take this as advice, but just my opinion.
I would think a woman walking down the street, parking lot etc, with a bright flashlight ON, would be very visible.
I am guessing, a potential mugger, does not want to be seen. So by making oneself, very visible, you would be reducing your odds of confrontation.
AND, if such a perpetrator did approach, and make you uncomfortable, a bright light to the face, a scream or loud "WHAT DO YOU WANT", would draw attention, again something the perp. does not want.
May not be the best defence, but it is something.
Just like a burglar might break into a house without an alarm or dog, they want the path of least resistance.
just my 2 cents here.

 

[Hitthespot]

Hi. As per title. What small handbag friendly torch would you suggest? Got to be able to blind them for 30 seconds, easy to use, maybe strobe effect? Want to buy one for my now wife for when I can't pick her up from the train station.

There are very few lights (if any) that will fit into a "small handbag" that will blind a person for "30 seconds". However if your looking for a small bright light that is easy to operate with very few modes, I would suggest a Surefire LX2 or a E2Dl. Both are bright, dependable and will give you the highest setting with just a push of the switch. While I like the Olights, Fenix's, Nitecores and so on, most of them have more complicated interfaces compared to the Surefires.

and remember......there is no substitute for the brain when it comes to self preservation. If your wife is going into possible dangerous areas, just plain don't let her. Find another way. It's always too late to say, " I knew I shouldn't of let you go down there".

Good Luck


Bill

 

[rob3rto]

WOW. Been out all day. Lots of replies. Not read them yet but thanks to anyone who replied.

 

[Mdinana]

If we MUST stay on the topic of flashlights...
A big 4 D-cell maglite. Cuz, you know, it's really bright. And blunt. So it can't be used to stab someone.

Or maybe TigerLight. Google them, or check out this review (it's old, sorry) I bet it's so bright that it might burn their eyes.
http://www.flashlightreviews.com/reviews/tigerlight_gold.htm

There. I've stayed on topic with several light suggestions.

 

[TooManyGizmos]

rob3rto ,

You are not going to learn anything constructive from the replies.

You should re-think your wife's security , and not rely on a flashlight beam to repel an attacker - it just won't happen.

You also didn't mention in your OP what weapons the attacker might have that you have to defend against ?

If there is a weapon - she should THROW what ever they want ~ one direction ~ while she RUNS the other direction for help .
.

 

[ducat]

rob3rto You have a PM.

 

[Search]

I'm not going to continue my first post. However, there is no argument and I can prove it, but in a PM if you would like.

Get a 200 ish lumen light with a strike bezel. To remain "legal", I'm not going to say what to do with it again.

However, with 200 lumens, you aren't going to deter an attacker. What you will do is take away their ability to see you. If they can't see you then they don't know what you are fixing to do.

So, if they can't see you, and you have a strike bezel, you do the math.

However, unless she wants to keep it in a pocket, don't expect her to be able to get to it in the few seconds she will need it.


The best thing you can do is ask a cop who has been around for a while. His job is to respond to incidents you are trying to stay out of. He knows what has worked and what hasn't.

You also didn't mention in your OP what weapons the attacker might have that you have to defend against ?

The end to all discussions, when you bring an X to a Y fight. Most of the time the best thing to do is what they say. It's either going to end bad or it isn't. If you **** them off, then you just cut your chances for the most part.

Makes you sick to your stomach doesn't it.

 

[yalskey]

Hmmm, I didn't see this thread until just now, so sorry I haven't chimed in here. These are the kinds of questions that I feel I can be of some use on... being that I specialize-in / study / teach interpersonal violence survival / counter-street-crime.

Obviously this topic has been brought up dozen of times per year here on CPF, and I'm not about to go into all the detail it deserves in this post. I did an episode on my Self-Defense Show podcast about this topic as well, if anyone is interested. (See the link below)

#1) Don't totally rely on anyone or any thing for your protection. Self-defense is about layers, and especially preventative / risk-reducing / awareness / avoidance / pre-conflict efforts. All of which you spearhead yourself, pro-actively.

#2) Be realistic about what a good, high-powered flashlight can do for you in the context of self-defense... and what it CANNOT do for you. It's not a magical solve all per se, but it can be a decent aid (especially to your observational awareness) in your self-defense portfolio.

#3) Before you go around cracking skulls with a "strike bezel", know the laws of self-defense in your area. Do you know what justifies using that "weapon" (as the opposing attorney is sure to frame it). When should you use it, and when will it ultimately get you into more trouble than if you didn't use it. (BTW, I never call it a "strike bezel"... I always say it's for "breaking glass in a overturned car" or to let the light peak out when I put the light bezel down on a surface... strategic wording that may or may not help)

#4) Do you have a backup plan if your light is malfunctioning? What if you don't have it with you, or it is inaccessible? What if it gets taken away from you and used against you? What if it doesn't have the desired result (maybe the guy is hyped up on PCP, other drugs, or just plain adrenaline)?

SIDE NOTE: All of this also applies to all devices intended for self-defense... pepper spray, stun guns, even firearms.

I could go on and on here , but I'll stop it at that, because I think you can get the drift. Carrying / using a device / weapon for self-defense is a messy topic with many considerations that each person must consider for themselves. There are pros and cons that need to be weighed by each beforehand. But the big problem (other than the criminals) is people want magical solve-all solutions that give them a sense of security that really doesn't exist.

Do I believe carrying a good high-powered flashlight will make you safer? For myself personally, yes... I've considered all the factors and I believe it's the best choice for me because of my background of understanding violence and my other training and many other things I won't go into. I carry a Dereelight CL1H v4 with an MC-E emitter driven at 2.8v off 2 x RCR123's with a driver that has only max and strobe modes. I keep it on me except when I'm bathing and I practice deploying it over and over. I use it as a part of my self-defense habits on a day to day basis. That's a lot to take on (some of which I'm not mentioning) but I'm doing it for that one day I may need it to be a part of why I was able to go home to my family alive.

P.s. My website has more about this kind of stuff under the VITAL Tour section... http://www.VitalSelfDefense.com

Hope this helps... I realize I left some parts out and skipped over some things I could have gone into... I'm just to lazy to keep typing all this out every time we have one of these threads.

 

[Linger]

Night clubs have strobe lights x times more powerful then any little hand light. flashing little light does not debilitate,...people dance to strobe lights, lazers, fog machines...

 

[yalskey]

Good point, however that only address the aspect of the light itself "blinding" the assailant. There are other ways a flashlight could be used in a self-defense context. The way I mainly use it is for observational awareness when I'm walking along, especially at night. It can light up potential threats in your surrounding area and take the criminal's advantage of limited visibility (nighttime) away.

Also, it's an obvious signal you are being aware of your surroundings, and thus it may decrease your victim selection attractiveness. Many impulsive-type criminals will just pick a better victim.

The other way I use it (less frequently) is to deter a less committed criminal that is "interviewing me". Often a street mugging will be proceeded with an approach with a question. "Hey buddy, do you have the time?" (or any variation of questions) as they walk into your protective proximity. Once they are up on you, they brandish a weapon and mugg you.

I've halted and thwarted away 3 people in the last 2 years. As they approached me with the question I command them to "Whoa, stop right there"... if they stop, I'll say "Now, what do you want?" If they don't stop on my command, I just called their bluff and I know they aren't interested in a "civil" communication exchange and they have more sinister intent. That's when I go to the next level in my self-defense toolbox. Sometimes it is deploying my flashlight and shinning it in their eyes while blowing my Storm Whistle (which is an aid-alert more than a sonic repulsion). If this doesn't work, I have other options... but you see the key is having options available to you, and doing everything you can beforehand to minimize your risks and tip every little thing in your favor that you can.

With all that said, as most self-defense devices are used today (including flashlights), people might as well just squeeze a crystal talisman... no wait, that might not get you in as much trouble with the law as unwittingly wielding a "Tactical Strike-Bezel Crime Stopper Light Canon".

 

[Search]

Go ask a cop, you need to look into some self defense for your wife that doesn't come from the internet.

 

[TooManyGizmos]

First Opening Post ..... seeking HELP ,

Hi. As per title. What small handbag friendly torch would you suggest? Got to be able to blind them for 30 seconds, easy to use, maybe strobe effect? Want to buy one for my now wife for when I can't pick her up from the train station.

Yalskey ... with your experience and knowledge ......

Can you simply tell rob3rto (the OP) ... if giving his wife a flashlight will protect her from harm ?

His thread title suggests he thinks a blinding torch is needed and will solve the problem.

As you can see ..... many think they are dangerous with a flashlight ... and not to be messed with.

(rob3rto and his wife are in the UK where the criminals seem to have all the protections)
.

 

[Search]

Close it here. Said better than I could. A bright light is a step, not an answer.

Intelligent Optical Systems in California has what they call their "puke" flashlight. It does work in controlled testing, but I don't think reactions are instantaneous (other than a possible surprise flinch response).

The fallacy of the dance floor strobe argument is that you are prepared for the light show and you also don't need a rapid OODA loop response to an opponent. In fighting, even a time lag of a fraction of a second can be enough to either get hit or avoid getting hit. Fractions of a second human response delays on the dance floor are completely irrelevant.

My friends have used SureFire 6Ps multiple times on people who accost them (mostly panhandlers -- both aggressive and not so aggressive). The sudden bright light in the face invariably stops them in their tracks. The followup loud verbal commands keeps them anchored. The bright light delays their ability to see (the first O -- Observe -- in OODA). If you can't see, you can't Orient quickly, and you also can't Decide or Act quickly. It's quite easy to move, fight, and otherwise beat the other guy to the punch.

If someone is already determined to attack you and to carry out the attack regardless of what you present, then it won't matter if you deploy a flashlight or a cannon. You had better be ready to go hands-on or have some other Plan B. The point in self-defense it to have the awareness to identify inappropriate behavior before it reaches the point where the attacker has marked you as a patsy.

There are lots of good seminar-style courses (unfortunately, I'm familiar mostly with US-based training, and so I can't advise on UK instruction) in managing unknown contacts and simple combatives that use gross motor movements. Some information is also online. Search 'southnarc" and "marc macyoung" for example.

As others have stated, and you are probably aware of, self-defense and the use of "offensive weapons" in the UK appears to be forbidden. Thus, the flashlight is always carried for use as a flashlight -- to illuminate the dark. I use mine primarily to find kids toys that have been dropped behind some piece of furniture. It's use in self-defense would be a total expedient, analogous to picking up a stick on the grass. I would not get any light with a strike bezel. You'll look like some wannabe just looking for trouble.

 

[TooManyGizmos]

Best answer ...... avoid areas that cause the hairs on the back of your neck to stand up !