Survival Preparedness

[monanza]

Albany Tom:

In addition to canned foods and MREs I keep the following on hand as supplements:

1. Mainstay food rations (5 year shelf life - one person 30 day supply) - does not induce thirst.
2. Survival tabs (10 year shelf life)

For water I keep the following handy:
1. Mainstay drinking water (5 year shelf life - one person 30 day supply)
2. Water purifiers (iodine or chlorine based).

Also consider:
Smoked Salmon
Salted Beef or beef jerky
Meat tenderizer

I am saving up for a solar oven and a water filtration system (pricey buggers).

Speaking of food... Gotta go have a snack.

Cheers...

PS I found the Equipped to Survive site to have some very useful information.

 

[B@rt]

This might be a solution for the TP problem...

 

[Charles Bradshaw]

Bart, preparedness may be routine in the Netherlands. Sadly it is not the case in the USA.

MREs are fine if you can afford them and have room to store them.

Even instant rice is good, since it won't hog your fuel for cooking. Canned meats as Stingray mentioned.

Various cooking options. Even that old fashioned Sterno can be useful.

 

[Albany Tom]

I'll have to add that stove to my list...The optimus is nice, and burns methyl alcohol, but not isopro very well. (It does handle kerosene and gasoline, though.)

Several years ago, one of the outdoor magazines put up a priority list of things to worry about in a survival situation. One of the questions was, "first aid, bleeding or breathing first?". Obviously, stopping serious bleeding is more important, as a person can bleed out in less than 15 seconds, while loss of breathing for that period of time is not fatal.

Anyway, it goes something like this:

1. Central nervous system. Time - instant. Moral - avoid large falling objects, breaking your back, etc. Keep physically safe.

2. Bleeding. Very similar to #1, except having something to deal with serious injuries handy is a nice thing. Also, if you're going to be maybe in a high wind situation, figure out how to keep your windows from killing you.

3. Breathing. This one covers things like having a CO and smoke detector, and if you can't get out of your place quickly, maybe even a smoke hood.

4. Hypothermia. This one means shelter, mostly. In the winter, in cold places, keep DRY. Being wet, in the cold, and the wind, will take away your ability to do anything very quickly. See most Jack London stories...

From here down, we're going from seconds/minutes to days. Time to think, plan, etc.

5. Water. Pretty much speaks for itself

6. Food. Ditto, except consider that without water, food may not be such a great idea.

If you have a condition such as high blood pressure, or insulin dependent diabetes, you'd of course need to figure that into the chart. Likewise, this doesn't cover things like sanitation and communication. An interesting thought is that up until about WWI, disease killed more soldiers, in wartime, than the enemy did.

 

[B@rt]

Originally posted by Charles Bradshaw:
Bart, preparedness may be routine in the Netherlands. Sadly it is not the case in the USA.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Not arguing there,(I really wouldn't know...)
Just trying to see the humor in a serious topic.

 

[KC2IXE]

Originally posted by MicroE:
Water is probably the most important item on the list. No water = no life.

At 1 gallon per person per day a family of four will need to store 120 gallons for a 30 day supply. How do you store this much water? How do you keep it free of microbes?----Marc

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Don't store 30 days - 3 days + something to purify is about right

 

[Charles Bradshaw]

There are 2 kinds of insulin: injectable (which most know about and requires refrigeration) and pill form, of which Amyril and Glucophage are the most common ones (I take both of these).

Storing alot of water can be a problem, particularly for apartment dwellers.

I know some who buy food on a day to day basis and have no reserves, even for 1 day. These people are in denial.

For the majority of scenarios, 1 week of supplies is usually sufficient. The idea here, is to think outside the box. We already do that with flashlights, so let's extend that a bit.

 

[monanza]

I am no expert but I had looked up some of these issues some time back and here is what I came up with for water storage:

Drinking water requirements are more modest than a gallon per person per day. One quart (~ 1 liter) per person per day is usually enough to get by unless you are in the desert or are heavily active (translates to 8 Mainstay water pouches or 4 Aqua-Blox'). Hygienic requirements are a different matter. You can get by with a gallon a day as was suggested.

Store your drinking water separately. If you do not plan to rotate your supply be sure to have purifiers on hand (iodine solution or chlorine tablets). (Edit - neglected to suggest purified or spring water by the case or in 5 gallon containers; If I recall correctly sealed spring water containers can last 3-6 months if stored in cool area; rotate regularly - someone please confirm).

Edit - Oops forgot water for cooking! Allow an additional quart (minimum) for cooking purposes but this amount depends greatly on what types of food you have stored. If you have the right foods this water becomes backup drinking water!

For hygiene you may have to be creative. For example use that extra tub (cleaned thoroughly of course

) if you expect an incident. Ideally I would think one should build a lined cistern as a part of a home's water supply (making it an integral part of the plumbing ensures water is rotated and fresh). The problem is that these require regular cleaning/maintenance so can get costly. Again you would need to keep purifiers on hand. I have no idea if such a cistern is acceptable for potable water supplies (still researching it - anyone care to enlighten me?)

BTW Iodine and chlorine based purifiers are not effective against Cryptosporidium. If this rare protozoa is an issue then you need to boil your water or use a small aperture filtration system (paraphrased from Equipped to Survive).

 

[ledfoot]

Fill your bathtub up so that you can still flush the toilet when needed. It is possible to get water out of your hot water heater for consumption. Fill plastic milk jugs and 2 liter(or 3)liter pop bottles with water for emergencies. For storing regular tap water, use 4 drops of bleach per 1 quart, 16 drops per 1 gallon and 1 teaspoon per 5 gallons of water. Use unscented bleach with no other additives. Mix and shake well, let set for 30 minutes. Should have a slight bleach odor. If not repeat and wait 15 minutes-should store for at least 6 months, then rotate supply.

 

[monanza]

I have been looking at 'Stabilized (Aerobic) Oxygen' for water treatment. Comparative information is dearth. Anyone have experience with this and other methods of water treatment? Iodine and chlorine don't taste so good although 'Potable Aqua' makes a neutralizer to go with their purifier tablets.

Edit: ledfoot - excellent point about using bleach. Inexpensive and readily available. Keep a small bottle of it handy in case you have to move from your home for any reason.

 

[Albany Tom]

"equipped to survive" is a great site. As Charles pointed out, thinking outside the box is required, though. ETS is geared mostly toward aviation/marine survival situations, where conditions may be different.

Water storage life would seem to be determined by the amount of stuff living in it, and the amount of food available, assuming the water is potable to begin with. So my plan is to store regular water, and run it through my MSR filter. At the very worst case, again assuming the stored water was originally potable, you'd have to boil it.

This is another individual health issue, too. Lux, remember the Washington County Fair water problem? A couple of kids were killed by bad water, several people fell sick. One of the physicians that worked on the kids is a friend, he explained, as you've all heard, that water bad enough to just make a healthy adult sick can easily kill a child or an older adult.

Have enough water to wash your hands, too!

 

[monanza]

Good point Tom, Charles. No one can be 100% prepared. Thinking outside the box is a must.

For the most part I use ETS for their comparative reviews in the Food and Water group but it is only one source (and no substitute for creative thinking).

Cheers.

 

[iseethelight]

Originally posted by Charles Bradshaw:

Supplies include food and means to cook, light, heat (if needed), water. Defensive items are not included here, as most people have something to fill this function.

I am mostly prepared. Anyone care to comment??

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Surely you meant to list light as your first priority!

Would survival even be worth it without good lighting?

 

[Lux Luthor]

Originally posted by Albany Tom:
...Lux, remember the Washington County Fair water problem? A couple of kids were killed by bad water, several people fell sick. One of the physicians that worked on the kids is a friend, he explained, as you've all heard, that water bad enough to just make a healthy adult sick can easily kill a child or an older adult...

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Nope. That may have happened before I moved here, which was about 5 1/2 years ago. Sounds like a good lesson for proper water treatment, though.

BTW, if I remember correctly, plastic milk jugs are designed to biodegrade, so they have a limited life span for water storage.

 

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Great topic with lots of useful ideas. For food, have any of you tried Mountain House from Oregon Freeze-Dry? Can be expensive, but is tasty, and the large cans can store for 30+ years. I take the individual packages on biking and backpacking trips, and store the large cans at home. No worries of spoilage or contamination.

 

[Charles Bradshaw]

I haven't tried any yet, Virgo. Even if you have freeze dried, it is still a good idea to have other foods that don't need heating, cooking, or water before eating.

In survival, food and water take top priority. Heat depends on your local climate. You can survive at home with no light: you just limit your activities to daylight hours. What light sources you do have, you need to be as frugal as possible: runtime takes precedence over brightness. Better to use battery power lights and leave propane, butane, and other fuels for cooking and heat. The less CO in the house, the better.

Oh, the reason I do not want to discuss defensive items, is Security. Why let potential threats know what you have?? Who knows who is reading this, besides CPF members.

 

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Yeah, the water's the thing I can't get past. Storage and keeping it free from contaminants and microbes has been tough for me. I'd ask the best way, but I know it's been addressed, so I'll go back and reread the other posts in the thread.
I can see that there are better choices than freeze-dried for home survival, but I would recommend the Mountain House line of foods for anyone who does alot of camping, biking, or general trekking.

 

[Albany Tom]

Virgo - I moved near a lake! (no kidding...but more for the tranquility than anything else.)

Where are good places to order Mountain House? Anything more tastey than others? Freeze dried I've avoided, because my backpacking friends have way lower tolerance for bad food than I do. I should try this stuff out.

Remember desert storm? Remember 1-liter plastic water bottles? I don't believe they're designed to biodegrade, they're cheap, and I bet would last a year. A lot of food products from the US are exported via ship, the expire times are a lot longer than you might think.

But, if you open a can of food and it doesn't make that "sucking" sound, or worse, if it squirts back at you (!!!), THROW IT AWAY. Trust me on this one, bad canned food may not kill a healthy adult, but you'll go through a period of time where you probably wish it did. I personally wouldn't worry much about drinking stored water. I would have a much bigger concern of drinking from an unknown source without filtering. Any water source that may have farm runoff is bad, both from the animals and from chemicals, as is a lake with people living on it - lets not guess who has a good septic system. The chemical thing is the reason I have a filter w/ a carbon component. Maybe not perfect, but it helps.

Interesting that our country doesn't require production and expirey dates, where a lot of countries do. We have it on Pepsi and batteries, but not canned food!

 

[Albany Tom]

Great link, thanks. Not cheap, but few good things are. Plus they're in Albany, Oregon! Go figure. For those that haven't, take a look at the site. 30+ year shelf life?! Wow. I'm not sure if I like the idea of eating a sandwich older than I am, though.

 

[monanza]

Thanks Virgo. I have tried several Mountain House entrees but never realized they produced foods with such long shelf life.

Well I'm off to get me some.

Cheers.