Old MN20 vs. new MN20 ...

MikeF

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Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

I just got home from work, and there was a package on my front porch waiting for me from Surefire!! It contained a MN20, which means that they have them available again. One small issue, when I got my M6, there was a coupon for either a MN21 right away, or wait for the MN20 to begin shipping again. I opted for the MN21 and received the MN20.
:huh2:

I have a HD-M6-4800 on order, and Petrev's XTN is already at Andrew Wynn's, and so the normal 20 minute runtime of the M6 with the MN21 with primary CR123 will be a moot point. It seems like I might also get my USL and Triton soon so I will even have a charger for the two 4800 mAh packs!!
:) :naughty:
 

dizzy

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

Thats some great news Mike. I will have to redeem my coupon now. It was turning yellow from age.

Does it look like they re-designed it or can't you tell? I never saw the original so I wouldn't know either way. Thanks for the tip!:)
 

bwaites

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

That MAY have been a mistake.

There have always been some amount of MN20's reserved for warranty replacement and for the military.

MN20's are still showing as unavailable on the site, or they were last night anyway.

Bill
 

dizzy

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

I will have to call to confirm if they have them or not. I'll have to wait until after the holiday.
 

cue003

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

Interesting. I wonder if they started making these again.

Curtis
 

G35

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

The rumor "on the street" is that SF was redesigning the LOLA. So, for those that did recieve their LOLA, do you see any difference in the bulb (redesigned) ?
 

cue003

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

Maybe if someone can snap a couple detailed pics of the bulb that could be helpful.

Curtis
 

seery

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

Two of my M6 lights came with the coupon so I have was very excited to
hear the news MikeF. Thanks for passing it along.

Called SF customer service this morning and was told they have indeed been
shipping the MN20's. They also have more in stock than current back-orders,
so we will all be getting them soon. Mine two are still a few weeks out due to
where I fell on the b/o list.

Asked about them being redesigned and was told SF was trying to redesign
them for longer runtime and more durability. They were not able to extend the
runtime but were able to make them more durable.

Happy Torching!
 

cue003

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

Hot damn. I got 2 M6's myself. Good news indeed. I will have to give SF a call and figure out how to get in line.

Curtis
 

js

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

This is VERY good news. Excellent. I have one MN20 on the way myself.

When I get it, I will post a nice big detailed pic of the old MN20 and the new MN20, side-by-side.

I am willing to bet that the new MN20 will have a larger envelope than the old one. Maybe even as large as the MN21. We shall see.
 

dizzy

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

I just called Surefire and talked to Sandy in customer service about redeeming my certificate for an MN20 lamp assembly and she said they will "get that right out" to me. Thanks MikeF for starting this thread and getting the ball rolling. I have never seen one (MN20) in action before so I can't wait to get it.:)
 

scott.cr

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

Is there a large difference between the MN20 and the MN16? Both are 9-volt lamps in the 225 lumen range right?

I gather the MN20 has a larger lamp than the MN16; is there a functional difference between the two?
 

Bullzeyebill

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

From what I have head, the MN20 has a sturdier filament, and probably needs it as it is being hit pretty hard at startup, with 9 volts from the 2600mAh setup. Not a lot of voltage sagging there.

Bill
 

OutdoorIdiot

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

To whom it may concern:

Quick link to the page on SF web site for a picture of the old one (at time of writing):

http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main/co_disp/displ/prrfnbr/420/sesent/00

Here are some photos of the new MN20s that are being released (got mine a few days ago):

Rear:

rear9ys.jpg



Side:
side6kk.jpg


Filament:
filament4hr.jpg



Mine produces a very oval hotspot (moreso than the MN21) but if that means it is better focussed, then that's fine with me. My reason for getting this light was to illuminate things at a distance. I had it in the countryside this weekend and it certainly did a very good job at that!
 

schrenz

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

Don't understand why it's black like the MN60?
Did SF gave up their colour-code of the bulbs?
 

js

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

schrenz said:
Don't understand why it's black like the MN60?
Did SF gave up their colour-code of the bulbs?

They used to color code, but for a while now, they have been printing the designation on the collar, as can be seen in one of the photos above ("MN20" in this case, but only the 20 is clearly visible.)

In any case, this lamp doesn't look that much larger than the old MN20. That's a good thing! I can't wait to check mine out when it gets here.
 

Hoghead

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

I got a new MN20 in the mail and for the few who might be interested a SW01 that was back ordered came in the mail a few days ago.
 

js

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Re: Surefire MN20 arrived!!!

Ray of Light,

The MN20 should work fine on two Li-ion cells, provided they can deliver the current.

OK.

Got my new MN20 today, and I see immediately what they did to create the new design. It looks very much as if they simply added two extra turns to the coil, going from 12 turns to 14.

If the CCT (and thus average filament temp) remains the same, and you increase the length, then you increase the voltage. But if the voltage remains more or less the same (which is the case here), then increasing the length, and keeping everything else the same, decreases the CCT.

If we estimate that the new filament is 14/12 as long as the old one, and that the old filament had a CCT of 3400 K when driven on 2p3s 123's, then if the new filament is driven 7/6th times the voltage of the old one, it will have the same CCT. Which means that the new CCT will be the old CCT times (6/7)^.42, which will equal 3187 K instead of 3400 K.

This equates to an efficiency loss of about 6 lumens/watt. The MN20 is about an 18.6 watt lamp, which will mean (assuming the power of the new MN20 is the same as the power of the old one--which is by no means certain) a loss of 112 bulb-lumens = 72 or so torch-lumens. However, given that the old MN20 was about a 400 lumen lamp on fresh batteries, this still means that the MN20 is above its rated lumens output value.

But these are just preliminary guesses on the subject. I will need to measure current and voltage of old and new MN20's to say something definite.

Well, I can definitely say that the new MN20 filament is longer by just about a 1/6th. And it looks to be the same thickness, and the coil winding diameter looks to be almost exactly the same.

All of this makes sense, in that if you keep everything else the same and make a filament longer, you lower the CCT.

However, I really was hoping that they would have kept the filament exactly the same and just put it in a larger envelope. After all, the problem with the MN20 wasn't that it was driven too hard and had a short life span, or that it was instaflashing at turn on.

No. The problem was that they were exploding. This has to do with the power density within the envelope, and envelope temperature, and the type of glass, and whether there were any flaws during manufacture, and so on. Lowering the CCT will certainly help mitigate these factors, but making the envelope larger would seem to me to be a more direct way to solve these problems.

And then the efficiency loss wouldn't have been nearly as great. Ah well. Figures I guess. The MN20 was such an overdriven lamp that it's miraculous it was ever designed and sold that way. I'm sure glad I have an old one installed in MY M6. It's going to stay there for the forseable future, I can tell you. I just love that lamp.

I'll report more when I try out the new MN20 to see how white it is and how it compares to the old one.
 
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