9P latest and greatest lamps and improvment ideas?

[sawlight]

I came across a clearance on BLACK 9P's at Gander Mountain. I did some research and found some interesting things, to me at least.
I have been craving an M series light, but the options or this, and price, I make a lego prety easy. I hope.
So being a sucker for wanting a BLACK (can you tell I like that?) Surefires, and $75 each, I got one.
If I can ever find one in stock, I want the LF EO-9 bulbs, claimed 380 lumens.
How far off is that from reality? I want a flamethrower!! Just WOW and little useage.
Am I correct that the M series heads will also fit this light? If so, what are the odds of finding a BLACK M series head? How about an A19, or Detonator, in black?
Yeah, the gears are turning right now!!!!!!
17500's are in the future, I think I'll need two sets
So what am I missing or haven't I thought of?
Not really interested in an LED, I want this as an incan only light. Lots of power, lots of heat, lots of color, and just raw battery drainage!!!!

 

[mdocod]

to get an idea of how the SF lamps compare to the LF lamps, you might have a gander at the li-ion-incan guide linked in my signature. It has estimated torch lumens on various li-ion configurations. The EO-9 is around 380 bulb lumens on fresh li-ion cells, but that's bulb lumens, not surefire lumens. A Surefire lumen is a torch lumen rating "average" of sorts. So not only is it properly de-rated for losses through the reflector and lens, it is also de-rated to take into account the fact that cells will drop off in performance through the run.

So basically, don't get too hung up on lumen ratings. Pick the beam pattern that best suits your needs and don't worry as much about the lumens. The lower powered lamps like the P90 and SR-9 will have tighter beams, the higher powered lamps like the P91 and EO-9 have wider beams, the P91 is a VERY wide beam in fact.

17500s can be used to drive any lamp up to the EO-9, but not the P91, the P91 is a total power hog at around 20 watts and will push the little 17500s a little too hard for ideal safety concerns.

Here are some thoughts...

I don't think you will find a Millennium Turbo Head in black, but even if you did, you would need a C to M thread adapter as the M series and "C" series lights have different threads on the head.

What you probably want is a KT2. It's designed for the 9P and is available in black and allows you to run M3T style lamps.
http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main/co_disp/displ/carfnbr/250/prrfnbr/246/9V-TurboHead-Conversion

 

[sawlight]

Thanks, didn't know about the wider beam patern with the P91!!!
I understood that I couldn't use the 17500's with ANY stock SF bulb? That was the reasoning with the LF bulbs. And yes, I have been told they are over rated, but nobody really knows how much? Why I was asking how realistic the number was to start with!!
I totally boned the head adapter, nice catch!!!!
I have thought of the KT2 (watching BST for one as we speak) But I can't, right now, justify paying more for that head, than I did for the whole light!!
I really think I want a throw monster from this. I have 80 acres that are heavily wooded, to wide open areas, and I am curious how much I can see with this next time I go deer hunting!

 

[mdocod]

If you want that throw you're going to want the KT2 eventually, I believe it comes with an MN15, which is similar in output to a P90, but will have a more concentrated beam.

I think what you want in the end, is to run an HO-M3T in the turbo-head included in the KT2 on a pair of 17500s. Or throw on an extender and run it on a pair of 17670s

 

[generic808]

Yes, the KT2 is for you if you want to convert your 9P into a "throw monster". I personally use the KT2 w/MN16 in a C3 which puts out 225 Surefire lumens of strictly throw :naughty:

 

[nzgunnie]

I understood that I couldn't use the 17500's with ANY stock SF bulb? That was the reasoning with the LF bulbs.

You need to do a bit more reading!

This is a good place to start:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=161536

The P90 runs just fine on AW protected 17500s, as does the MN15.

If you want to run the P91 or MN16 (in the KT2 you will buy), then you'll need an A19 and get some 17670s.

 

[streetkid]

Hey I hope you dont mind me piggybacking on your thread, but I have a 9P i've been wanting to upgrade since the current p90 burned out.

I've been reading a ton, and just finally is all the vocab starting to come together and make sense.

I think i've already figured out what I want to do, but I'd like your guys' opinions if you have 'em.

I want to get a battery extender, and run 2x 17670's and then run the LF HO-9, but when this lamp burns out, I'd really like to drop in an LED, that I hope would still function well with the extender and 2x17670s.


HO-9: http://www.lighthound.com/Lumens-Fa...embly-for-SureFire-C-P-Z-Series_p_6-1018.html

TnC Extender, is this the only place to get an extender??, will this accept the 17mm batteries? http://tncproducts.com/hp_zencart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=11&products_id=71

WE LED, are these like _the_ LEDs? are there other cheaper options? http://www.pts-flashlights.com/products/product.aspx?pid=1-25-114-125-6437

I don't have any specific need for this flashlight, shock factor to friends and family is great, I go camping a lot at el mirage dry lake here in southern cali, so being able to light up a dark desert would be cool. Also go camping in the mountains in the winter.


Anyways, thats what I've got in mind, let me know what you think!


edit: Also wanted to know whats involved to bore the 9P to accept 18670's..

 

[sawlight]

Piggyback away!!!

I am here to learn!! I did get the HO-9, I am impressed!!!
The more I think about the A19, the less I like the added bulk of it.
Any other options?
For what I want, 17500's should work fine.

 

[pete7226]

The brightest lamp hands down in your setup is one of Fivemegas FM1794 drop-ins. This blows away any Lumens factory bulbs and even the mighty overdriven P91. you will need 2x18500's or better yet 2x18650's to run it. Its over 600 lumens at the bulb. Brightest D26 drop-in to date.

 

[TDKKP]

The brightest lamp hands down in your setup is one of Fivemegas FM1794 drop-ins. This blows away any Lumens factory bulbs and even the mighty overdriven P91. you will need 2x18500's or better yet 2x18650's to run it. Its over 600 lumens at the bulb. Brightest D26 drop-in to date.

Well, I think you know this thread and the Axial bulb is brighter than 1794 when running with 3 x 18500 body.

 

[pete7226]

I'm not familiar with the output of the axial bulb, fill me in. I'm also not aware of any existing or after market body or extender that will fit an existing body to enable you to use 3x18500, if you know of some in D26 size let me know.

 

[openbolt1]

I came across a clearance on BLACK 9P's at Gander Mountain. I want this as an incan only light. Lots of power, lots of heat, lots of color, and just raw battery drainage!!!!

Ok try this, it's what I have done and could not be happier. Take your 9P place a x1 cell extension on it (making it a "12P"). Buy the FIVEMEGA D-26 set-up. FM1794 bulb with in my case his (LS) light stipple reflector=gives intense solid flood that is useful out to 25 yards or so with (and this is important) two AW 17670 batteries. This set-up will use the Li-Ion fairly quick but as long as you do not require looong extended burn times it's GREAT! Intense bright SMOOOOOTH beam for 3-5 minute bursts (total rumtimes are about 30 minutes A.I.R.). Impress your friends...bigtime. I love mine. Somewhat of a special purpose light but like most of us if I want less or more I have other lights for those purposes. When you need a lot of light, this is it in a relatively small package (the small "C" head illuminates like the much larger M3 head) too.

openbolt

 

[mdocod]

I don't think that 1794 should be used on anything but a pair of 18650s, I think you'd have problems tripping the PCB on 17670s and 18500s personally.

runtime would not be 30 minutes, it's not even 30 minutes on a P91.

It's a similar load as the 1185 (amps wise) and there are plenty of reports of problems driving the 85 with 3x17670.

 

[sawlight]

I don't think that 1794 should be used on anything but a pair of 18650s, I think you'd have problems tripping the PCB on 17670s and 18500s personally.

runtime would not be 30 minutes, it's not even 30 minutes on a P91.

It's a similar load as the 1185 (amps wise) and there are plenty of reports of problems driving the 85 with 3x17670.

Thank you, that answered one question, but opens another.
Can the P91 run off of 18500's alright? You have said the 17500's would sag too much, and I have the means to open it up easily enough.

 

[Bullzeyebill]

Thank you, that answered one question, but opens another.
Can the P91 run off of 18500's alright? You have said the 17500's would sag too much, and I have the means to open it up easily enough.

If you ran unprotected 18500's (actually 18490's), and monitored the voltage carefully, you should be ok with them and the P91. I personally prefer the the P90, or MN15 setups. AW sells the 18490's, also Lighthound. You need the correct diameter body to hold the 18mm cells.

Bill

 

[fivemega]

I don't think that 1794 should be used on anything but a pair of 18650s, I think you'd have problems tripping the PCB on 17670s and 18500s personally.

runtime would not be 30 minutes, it's not even 30 minutes on a P91.

It's a similar load as the 1185 (amps wise) and there are plenty of reports of problems driving the 85 with 3x17670.

1794 runs on 3 amps using 2 li-ion while WA1185 runs on 3.3 amps on 3 li-ion.
0.3 amps makes a big difference when you are on edge of protection maximum ability.
I personally tested and closely monitored 1794 on 2xC, 2x18650, 2x17670 and even 2x18500 without any problem.
Run time is about 35~40 minutes on 2x18650
3 amps current draw did not come from air. It is based on my many years experience, Carley's engineer/designer advise, succesfully tested on several different samples before placed final order. However, 3 amps is not greater than 2C of all mentioned batteries.
There will not be any problem running WA1185 with 3x17670 if newbie engineers follow simple instructions.
All mentioned statements are based on [size=+1]healthy[/size] batteries and [size=+1]correctly[/size] recharged.

 

[sawlight]

If you ran unprotected 18500's (actually 18490's), and monitored the voltage carefully, you should be ok with them and the P91. I personally prefer the the P90, or MN15 setups. AW sells the 18490's, also Lighthound. You need the correct diameter body to hold the 18mm cells.

Bill

I'd rather run protected cells!!!

Boring the body out isn't a problem for me, I have acess to several machne shops, and several years of experiance doing such work.

If I understand correctly fivemega, the 1794 bulb is going to be fine with two 18500 cells?
This lamp is intriuging me more and more!!

 

[mdocod]

Thankyou FM for the update on that, I thought I had read somewhere that it was 3.4A, maybe I was looking at a 6V bulb on carleys website and got the 2 confused...

Though I think it's important to note that 3A is still going to be over 2C for MANY 18500 and 17670 cells on the market.

I haven't seen a discharge on AWs 17670s so can't comment, but based on Tom's discharge charts, the Pila 17670 (600S) will hold out for over 30 minutes into 3 amps, so it would be fine- but all of the other 18500 and 17670s tested come in at 25-26 minutes. That's ~2.4C.

Here at CPF we've pushed a lot of cells over the 2C limit and haven't had many if any incidents directly related, so I don't see this as a major problem, but feel it's important that people understand that we're operating on the edge of the capabilities of these cells.

Eric

 

[sawlight]

With this being used as a "WOW" light, and used in short bursts. Is there really that much of a threat for explosion?
Ganted, ten min. of runtime might be needed now and again, but I have other bulbs, and will get more, that can fill those needs.

 

[Bullzeyebill]

Thankyou FM for the update on that, I thought I had read somewhere that it was 3.4A, maybe I was looking at a 6V bulb on carleys website and got the 2 confused...

Though I think it's important to note that 3A is still going to be over 2C for MANY 18500 and 17670 cells on the market.

I haven't seen a discharge on AWs 17670s so can't comment, but based on Tom's discharge charts, the Pila 17670 (600S) will hold out for over 30 minutes into 3 amps, so it would be fine- but all of the other 18500 and 17670s tested come in at 25-26 minutes. That's ~2.4C.

Here at CPF we've pushed a lot of cells over the 2C limit and haven't had many if any incidents directly related, so I don't see this as a major problem, but feel it's important that people understand that we're operating on the edge of the capabilities of these cells.

Eric

LuxLuther did some tests of AW's 17670's here, http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?p=2605813#post2605813 See post 15.

Bill