Any info about Ford Fusion Hybrid Li-Ion batteries?

[CuriousOne]

Hello, long time no post here.
I want to build a high power (50-100w) LED work light, which would run for overnight, if needed. So I need really juicy battery.
Batteries are getting expensive, but I have a friend at local car dismantling facility, and he said, that he got some Ford Fusion Hybrid (Circa 2017) Li-Ion cells for sale, for $3 each. For test, I've grabbed a couple, and charging them now with turnigy charger in balance mode, at 2A current. They were reading 3.64v and 0.002 ohm internal resistance, when plugged in. I'd like to have some more info about rated capacity, so I based on that, I can estimate wear of these cells and decide, whenever I can use them for my project, but found no info, except that, that they're made by Panasonic. They have QR code on them, which reads as 21C7D08906, but no google data on that...

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

What are they? 18650's? 4 year old, used cells, for $3 each. Doesn't sound like a huge bargain, IMO. I see that 18650 battery store has (new) Samsung 30Q's on sale right now for $3.99.

You need a better friend.

 

[CuriousOne]

Nope. They are large, prismatic cells. About 7 pieces of 18650 cells in size. So I expect totally different currents and capacities

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

Okay, if they have 7x the capacity, then they're probably a good price. But... do you have the equipment to test their capacity (for balance purposes, if nothing else)? Most power builds I've seen use cylindrical cells, for their convenience.

 

[CuriousOne]

Yes I have all required test equipment, measurements just finished and they measured 3976mAh the first one and 4001 mAh another. Discharged at 4A. Now they're charging and will try to discharge them at 10A, to see if there will be any difference. Btw, discharge at 4A had zero effect on their temperature - they remained 21C, as they were before starting the discharge.

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

Yes I have all required test equipment, measurements just finished and they measured 3976mAh the first one and 4001 mAh another. Discharged at 4A. Now they're charging and will try to discharge them at 10A, to see if there will be any difference. Btw, discharge at 4A had zero effect on their temperature - they remained 21C, as they were before starting the discharge.

Are they higher voltage than 4.2v cells? Because, at 7x the size of 18650's, that doesn't sound like much capacity. They're barely more than a regular 18650 cell.

 

[CuriousOne]

Well, I have no info, when I got them, they both were at 3.65. Charge completed at 4.15 (turnigy acucell). Discharged them to 3V, below it voltage fell down too quickly. As I've been told (unverified source), these are designed for 200 amp continuous drain current, hence the dimensions....

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

Probably 200 amp in a parallel config. I highly doubt they'd handle 200 amps individually. But, yeah, they're probably designed for high discharge, rather than high capacity. I guess high capacity is only needed in pure electrical vehicles.

Still, if they're 7x the size of an 18650 and only have about the same capacity as a single 18650, that means they either have really low energy density, or they're almost dead.

 

[joshk]

Can you post a picture of one please?

 

[CuriousOne]

Here they are, next to the charger. https://imgur.com/a/c9FVXFY

 

[CuriousOne]

Interesting observation - I charged them with 4.10 volts (default setting for Li-ion batteries @ turnigy) - they delivered 4000mAh. Now charged them with 4.20 volts - they delivered 4300mAh. So idea that they can be 4.35V type makes a good sense. Is there any way to clarify that cell is 4.2V or 4.35V ?

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

Have you opened one up to see what's inside?

 

[CuriousOne]

Joking? it's a sealed can
Do you usually open your 18650 -s just to inspect their guts?
The whole package from the car is rated at 1.4kw, and it houses 76 cells in series. If we divide numbers. capacity per cell is roughly 4300mAh, in line with my measurements.

 

[joshk]

Yea, I wouldn't try opening that, it just has fire and pain inside.
That type of battery is built for giving power in bursts, like when flooring the car. It's capacity will be rather lame for it's size.
Also, please note, you can't rule out it may have an operating voltage of 2.5v-3.65v like this one: https://voltaplex.com/lfp-prismatic-battery-72-5ah-400a-2-5v

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

Oh, okay. From the pic, it looked like a battery pack with cells inside. If it's not, then yeah, obviously don't mess with it.

4300mAh seems ridiculous low for the size of it. But, I guess it's for quick response... all show and no stamina.

I'll go back to saying $3 per cell may be on the expensive side, given that they're barely higher capacity than a much smaller 18650. Not a bad deal, but considering you can get new 30Q's for $3.99, it's not exactly a steal for a used battery. And, unless you need super-high current, why bother?