Buy the Fenix L2D-CE or wait for the L2D RB100?

[MikeV]

I was going to order a Fenix L2D-CE as a replacement for my Mini-Maglite, but after looking at the Fenix website they have a L2D with a Rebel LED instead of a Cree LED on pre-order for only $6.00 more.

What are the advantages of the Rebel over the Cree?(if any)

The site says that the Rebel is brighter with the same runtime as the Cree is this true or just a "marketing ploy"?

What do y'all think I should do? :thinking:



Thanks for any info.
Michael.

 

[rmorein]

The increase in brightness is probably not distinguishable to the eye, because the eye has logarithmic response.

I'm concerned about the way the Rebel is packaged. It has 1/8 the heatsink area of the Cree, and does not contain a built-in copper heat spreader. This makes a challenge to the flashlight maker, with the possibility of soldering and bonding faults that could cause flashlight failures. See http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=169547&page=2
"The cree has a layer of copper directly under the die attach to spread heat out over the top surface of the ceramic. In addition, the thermal pad on the bottom also serves to spreads heat out further. The cree definitely does not have as much of a "hot spot" as the rebel does due to the two larger pad areas."

"The cree thermal pad area is 5.6x6.5mm (36.4mm^2), whereas the rebel thermal pad area is 1.8x2.7mm (4.86mm^2). The cree thermal pad is 8x as large as the rebel's, and thus, thermal interface material thickness is less critical than for a rebel. Since the cree does not droop any more or less than other devices, then it has sufficient cooling and a thin enough layer to not matter. I can confirm this in that the cree's Vf does not drop rapidly at high current."

I would wait for these lights to be field tested. Alot of solder can crack in a year from thermal cycling.

 

[LukeA]

I was going to order a Fenix L2D-CE as a replacement for my Mini-Maglite, but after looking at the Fenix website they have a L2D with a Rebel LED instead of a Cree LED on pre-order for only $6.00 more.

What are the advantages of the Rebel over the Cree?(if any)

Brightness and tint.

 

[MikeV]

I would wait for these lights to be field tested. Alot of solder can crack in a year from thermal cycling.

Agreed, I'll just order the L2D-CE now and wait for some reviews on the new L2D with the Rebel LED.

Plus it will give me a reason to buy one a year from now.


Thanks for the info.
Michael.

 

[tygger]

Based on my own experience (and many others), I'm sure you'll be very happy with the output of the L2D CE.

 

[Dijon]

Get the L2D-CE now. I have one and it kicks the shitake out of a mini-mag for runtime and brightness. Order today and by Thursday you will wonder why you waited so long. I am waiting for some field reports also before ordering a Fenix Rebel.

Dijon

 

[L.E.D.]

the Mag 2AA 3w is no match for the L2D CE. My Mag's switch failed to function correctly after 2 weeks, then the Lux III dropped out of the socket. The L2D has lasted forever with no switch problems at all. I will say that the L2D could have its overall wall thicknesses beefed up a little though, and maybe a lower low... As far as the Rebel, it depends on how Fenix has it sinked to the metal reflector and body.

 

[L.E.D.]

the Mag 2AA 3w is no match for the L2D CE. My Mag's switch failed to function correctly after 2 weeks, then the Lux III dropped out of the socket. The L2D has lasted forever with no switch problems at all. I will say that the L2D could have its overall wall thicknesses beefed up a little though, and maybe a lower low... As far as the Rebel, it depends on how Fenix has it sinked to the metal reflector and body. The L2D already has good sinking to the body, it gets warm quickly on Turbo.

 

[WadeF]

I'll do a little test to see. This is the P3D Rebel 100 on TURBO, tailstanding. I took temp readings with an Infrared Thermometer which from other tests I've done has shown to be pretty accurate for temps in this range.

71.1F (start), 76.4F (30 sec), 79.8F (60 sec), 83.1F, 85.2F, 86.8F, 95.6F, 95.9F, 96.6F, 97.1F, 97.7F (5 min.), 98.6F, 98.9F (6 min, end)

85.6F (Temp of body just above where it meets the tailcap after 5 minutes).

This shows the body heats up pretty quick, and in 5 minutes even the base of the body tube went up 14.8F in that short amount of time!

I'll try to repeat this test with my P3D Cree P4, but I have to move it to the same room the P3D Rebel was in (my bedroom which has AC, so it's usually a constant temp) to try and get it to around the same starting temp.

 

[rmorein]

It's not the overall flashlight temperature that concerns me. It's thermal shock. With the Rebel, a tiny die is held by even tinier solder pads that receive shear force from thermal expansion and contraction of the die relative to the board.

The whole thing is held together by some doubtful RoHS solder in a flashight factory. I would rather have seen this done in the foundary, which has better "everything", from design to execution. This is why LEDs are mounted on stars. Possibly to save cost, LumiLEDs pushed the mounting job on the flashlight maker. This is the wrong direction.

 

[xiaowenzu]

The whole thing is held together by some doubtful RoHS solder in a flashight factory. I would rather have seen this done in the foundary, which has better "everything", from design to execution. This is why LEDs are mounted on stars. Possibly to save cost, LumiLEDs pushed the mounting job on the flashlight maker. This is the wrong direction.

YIKES! :shakehead Just when I was almost about to consider getting the Rebel. :shakehead:shakehead Please remind me to steer clear from these aftermarket hack jobs!

 

[techwg]

but after looking at the Fenix website they have a L2D with a Rebel LED instead of a Cree LED on pre-order for only $6.00 more.

I would wait for the rebel as i am doing. I went to the fenix site, i see no mention of any rebel models.? What part of the site did you see the details on?

 

[brightnorm]

I just received my P3D-CE Rebel. Total output tests ("ceiling bounce") show that it is slightly brighter than my regular P3D-CE's, but the difference is modest and unlikely to be noticed in actual use. It is still significantly dimmer than my "Turbocharged" P3D-CE

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=166050

The LOP reflector helps broaden the beam, making it more useful generally, especially for walking outdoors.

Brightnorm

 

[Robban]

It's not the overall flashlight temperature that concerns me. It's thermal shock. With the Rebel, a tiny die is held by even tinier solder pads that receive shear force from thermal expansion and contraction of the die relative to the board.

The whole thing is held together by some doubtful RoHS solder in a flashight factory. I would rather have seen this done in the foundary, which has better "everything", from design to execution. This is why LEDs are mounted on stars. Possibly to save cost, LumiLEDs pushed the mounting job on the flashlight maker. This is the wrong direction.

You do know that LEDs aren't used solely for flashlights, right? What might be considered a con for flashlights can be a pro for a completely different application. You're judging the new package based on how it is being used in a very very small part of the LED market.

 

[L.E.D.]

Q5 Crees anyone? Good thing I have the L2D -CE-, had no idea regarding the severity of the Rebel's sinking problems. I was just about to pre-order one of the Rebel L2D's. Now I will just wait for Q5 or possibly a Q6 L2D.

 

[WadeF]

Q5 Crees anyone? Good thing I have the L2D -CE-, had no idea regarding the severity of the Rebel's sinking problems. I was just about to pre-order one of the Rebel L2D's. Now I will just wait for Q5 or possibly a Q6 L2D.

Severity of the sinking problems?! Isn't this all speculation by a few? Has anyone actually documented an actual problem? I think it's way to early to tell. So far I haven't had any issues, but I've only had the light a few days.

 

[MikeV]

Well I went ahead and ordered the L2D-CE, I can't wait until it gets here.

I would wait for the rebel as i am doing. I went to the fenix site, i see no mention of any rebel models.? What part of the site did you see the details on?

They are under the "Lumileds Rebel Editions" tab on the left.

Here's the link.
https://www.fenix-store.com/index.php?cPath=22_76&osCsid=c7dd3535ec6b3cc867e17bcf84a8639e


Michael.

 

[ginaz]

L2D rebel sounds like just what i've been waiting for. i'm in!

 

[Lite_me]

L2D rebel sounds like just what i've been waiting for. i'm in!

They're getting closer for me. I'm waiting for an L2D Rebel Natural. Actually, I've just been waiting for the ...Natural. Then maybe upgrade it to something brighter. I'll have to see what's out there when they finally come out with the ...Natural. I want a ..Natural. .(..Clearing throat)

 

[Lite_me]

. Double post