Cree R2's ... real or fake?

[DArklite]

All I want to know is if they're real or not. iTP Light can't get any for their lights, and neither can Alan at Dereelight. MattK from Battery Junction had to jump through hoops to get a limited amount and export them to China for the Olight M20.
Yet here we have KD and DX offering them in their lights, in all their silver-backed, Asian Cree factory-made glory... and for inexpensive prices. I'm not trying to "stir the pot" here, but I just want to know if what KD and DX are selling are in fact the Real McCoy. It would be nice if they are. Are they?

I think I'll stop here and let the experts weigh in.

 

[Black Rose]

Perhaps it's simply an issue of USA made R2s vs Asian made R2's, although ITP light is based out of China, so that throws a kink into things :thinking:

 

[lumafist]

I`ve got one in a Aleph LE and it feels kind of real......

 

[Illum]

well, the difficulty in determining whether a CREE is of a certain bin lies in the fact that they all look the same. the only thing we can tell is the number of bond wires on the emitter die...and that has been a pretty consistent 4 since the introduction of Q4s:sigh:

The only viable method of proving that a LED is such is by buying the product and run it through a hodgepodge of tests...:candle:

Knowing the incredible ability for Chinese manufacturers to clone and improve current designs I would say its safe to assume the possibility that offshore manufacturers may have CREE R2s, but I would heed to the advisory that if DX/Kai was the only dealer/resellers that advertizes them in this manner, its most likely a marketing scheme. :thinking:

 

[JohnR66]

As I understand, as the LED die are produced, they are tested and binned on their color tint and light output level. Since there are so few that make the R2 bin, they are very rare.

I'd think statistically that LEDs that make the R2 bin would just barely pass the required output level. Think how rare an R2 must be that is near the top output of the R2 bin lumen range. probably why there are no R3s yet.

Next, the Q5 bin is so close in output, you can't distinguish the difference.

Given this, the Q5 is a better alternative given the availability and cost.

 

[IcantC]

All I want is a DBS V2 with R2 1S

 

[Scourie]

I bought a couple from here;

http://www.led-tech.de/en/High-Powe...CREE-XR-E-7090-R2-Emitter-LT-1331_120_77.html

Out of stock at this time though.

Rob

 

[Black Rose]

Next, the Q5 bin is so close in output, you can't distinguish the difference.

Given this, the Q5 is a better alternative given the availability and cost.

I agree.

I have a couple of Cree P4 and Q5 based lights...the output of the Q5 is more than adequate.

I've seen some beamshots of Q5 vs R2 and the difference is really not that great, especially considering the premium charged for the R2 lights.

 

[Sgt. LED]

All I want is a DBS V2 with R2 1S

ME TOO!

 

[WadeF]

I ordered a couple R2's from Cutter or wheover out of Australia. I believe that is where Alan also ordered them from when he was able to get about 60 R2 WH's. I trust Cutter and Dereelight.

From my testing I am getting more lumens out of the R2 Cree's than my Q5 Cree's when used with the same circuits.

 

[dcbeane]

"Knowing the incredible ability for Chinese manufacturers to clone and improve current designs I would say its safe to assume the possibility that offshore manufacturers may have CREE R2s"

As a long suffering CREE shareholder I am here to tell you its not that easy to do what CREE does. They remain on the cutting edge of LEDs. The problem is that folks like us do not make a large enough market to drive any particular product early before others in time are bright enough and enter that market.

 

[JohnB]

Be Careful and know who you are dealing with. From what I am told by manufacturers I deal with there is a wait in China just to get Q5 and R2 are nowhere to be found.

All I want to know is if they're real or not. iTP Light can't get any for their lights, and neither can Alan at Dereelight. MattK from Battery Junction had to jump through hoops to get a limited amount and export them to China for the Olight M20.
Yet here we have KD and DX offering them in their lights, in all their silver-backed, Asian Cree factory-made glory... and for inexpensive prices. I'm not trying to "stir the pot" here, but I just want to know if what KD and DX are selling are in fact the Real McCoy. It would be nice if they are. Are they?

I think I'll stop here and let the experts weigh in.

 

[kramer5150]

Noob's take:twothumbs...

The other thing to keep in mind is that R2 is ONLY the brightness BIN. So "premium" R2 emitters of a specific color-BIN and Vf range may be uber-scarce and hard to come by. These are the more sought after emitters, desired by the quality manufacturers. Hence the scarcity from top-tier CPF manufacturers.

The generic R2 stuff from DX/Kai, probably has no requirement for Vf or color tint. It shows too, with the reports of varying brightness and tint from DX R2 P60 modules.

IMHO you get what you pay for. You can play roulette with the DX stuff, or play it safe with the higher quality manufacturers.

IMHO you are better-off buying a Q5-WC from a reputable builder... if you want quality assurance.

Unfortunately there is no way to tell an R2 from another 4-wire emitter BIN, without an integration sphere and detailed testing. So, you are at the mercy of the builder to do the honorable thing. I definitely don't trust Ebay sellers in that regard. They already lie about lumen specs, manufacturing origins and things that are easily observed/researched. Ther'es nothing to stop them from BS'ing about emitter-BINs.

 

[ace0001a]

Well from what I was told directly by the original Jerry that worked for Kaidomain (they either hired another "Jerry" or simply have another employee posing as Jerry now) that he did not believe their R2 products actually contained real Cree R2 emitters. I tried to see if he was able to get me a small batch of R2s once, he tried but told me his supplier couldn't get or find any R2s "in all of china". I have said this before as I think it's hard to tell the difference between a Q5 and R2. I bought some R2s from CPF member Endeavor before I wasn't really able to see much of if any a difference to the Q5s I already have.

 

[shomie911]

I agree.

I have a couple of Cree P4 and Q5 based lights...the output of the Q5 is more than adequate.

I've seen some beamshots of Q5 vs R2 and the difference is really not that great, especially considering the premium charged for the R2 lights.

I like the tint on my Olight M20 R2 more than any P4 or Q5 light I've had yet though.

I'm not sure if that's a property of the R2 or because they were from a special tint bin.

What I do know is that it has great color rendering and it's very pleasent to look at.

But as for output, they are basically the same as a Q5. If anybody is actually holding out on buying a light because it doesn't have a Q5, then they're making a mistake. As long as the Q5 has a nice tint it will likely be undistinguishable from an R2.

 

[phantom23]

M20 has R2 WH which is yellower (but I prefer vanilla tint of my Seoul).
There's about 7% difference between Q5 and R2. Human eye cannot see it!

 

[Sgt. LED]

But what about runtime increases?
It's not totally about output. Just mostly.

 

[phantom23]

Same runtime and 7% brighter using the same driver.

 

[Gator762]

Same runtime and 7% brighter using the same driver.

But you could update the driver for similar output and longer runtime.

 

[outersquare]

heh, i didn't realize R2s were really that rare, but if there is any question about it, then they are probably fake, this is freaking china we are talking about, anything goes, including poisoned babys formula.