How to hook up p7 led to 12v motorcycle
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250cc motorcycle with small battery( not electric start) needs more light. Now runs a 35 watt headlight. I have some harbor freight axillary halogen 55watt lights. I would like to put a led p7 bulb or ? for better off road lighting.There is not enough watts to run all three now. How much I don't know.
TorchBoy
Flashlight Enthusiast
If you run 55 W halogen lights why are you worried about being able to power HID? What do you actually want to do?
It's not jsut a matter of replacing a halogen bulb with an LED. LED's, while more efficient (ie: more energy is converted to light than other sources) still produce heat. Unlke an incandescent source, however, the heat they produce needs to be removed quickly from the LED, otherwise it'll fry. Thus, LED's must be very well heat-sinked, and housings usually require finning in high output applications.
LED's also run at lower voltages than in a car or motorcycle. Most LED's have a nominal forward voltage of ~3.7volts. Sticking 12v would just fry it. Also, LED's are usually limited to low current applications (most single-die LED's at 1-1.5Amp, some special high-output LED's at up to 9Amps). Drivers are usually necessary to limit current and voltage to the LED. Drivers also allow for multiple levels of output.
I would suggest taking a look at some commercialproducts, such as the "Solo" pods from VisionX. They'll use 10 watts apiece and produce about 900lumens. They can be found on Amazon for about $110 apiece.
LED's also run at lower voltages than in a car or motorcycle. Most LED's have a nominal forward voltage of ~3.7volts. Sticking 12v would just fry it. Also, LED's are usually limited to low current applications (most single-die LED's at 1-1.5Amp, some special high-output LED's at up to 9Amps). Drivers are usually necessary to limit current and voltage to the LED. Drivers also allow for multiple levels of output.
I would suggest taking a look at some commercialproducts, such as the "Solo" pods from VisionX. They'll use 10 watts apiece and produce about 900lumens. They can be found on Amazon for about $110 apiece.
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Thanks John for the reply! Yes that is what I want. I realize the need for a heat sink outside the light fixture. Just what parts are needed to make this work. I am very capable of building/ modding what ever is needed to do this. I just have more time then money right now. I realize it may fail If done improperly but, I am willing to try that is fun part of this project/ forum.
TorchBoy
Flashlight Enthusiast
Ah, I think I understand now.
The least expensive option I can think of is running just one of those halogens (no cost) followed by running both lights but replacing the bulbs with 25 W halogen bulbs. I don't know if you have the spare alternator power for that.
Have you worked out how much light you want? To get the equivalent of a 55 W halogen I think you need at least 3 XP-G R5s running on 1.5 A (series connected with a single driver). Add case/heatsinking and optics, are you still within budget?
I looked "houfins" up on Google and the first non-surname result was this thread.
The least expensive option I can think of is running just one of those halogens (no cost) followed by running both lights but replacing the bulbs with 25 W halogen bulbs. I don't know if you have the spare alternator power for that.
Have you worked out how much light you want? To get the equivalent of a 55 W halogen I think you need at least 3 XP-G R5s running on 1.5 A (series connected with a single driver). Add case/heatsinking and optics, are you still within budget?
Budget is under $50 total. I ordered a magicshine p7 bike light recently for my bicycle (from dx extreme should get by 2011
), is there a way to power this light from the motorcycle, or charge the batteries while riding. I'm open to any ideas.
), is there a way to power this light from the motorcycle, or charge the batteries while riding. I'm open to any ideas.
TorchBoy
Flashlight Enthusiast
Can't find it, so don't know.
Hamilton Felix
Enlightened
I don't know anything about your 250, but I'm guessing your charging system is even smaller than the one on my 2007 Suzuki DL650. I've been looking into auxiliary lights, and I temporarily mounted an automotive voltmeter on the bike, so I can watch what happens to voltage when I load the system with an extra light or two.
Like you, I have a very small budget. I already had the voltmeter, so hooking it up for testing was a natural move.
If you have H3 lights, you should be aware there are 35 watt H3 bulbs available. Here: http://store.candlepower.com/4-035.html
and here: http://www.rallylights.com/Hella_H3_Bulbs.aspx
I recently tried out some rather efficient MR16 bulbs, 30 watt Infrared Reflective Coated bulbs that put out light like 50 watt bulbs. But they didn't have tight enough beam control to run as anything other than driving lights along with high beam. I mounted them in an old pair of PIAA 1000X lights that were given to me (about the only way I'd ever acquire PIAA lights).
If you can run a 35 watt headlight, plus a few watts more, a 35 watt HID light takes about 42 watts input. But doing HID "right," means installing a headlight actually designed for the HID light source. And that means a bigger budget.
Are you looking for better conspicuity, so cars are more likely to see you?
Or are you looking for better vision down the road at night?
Either way, I'm sure there is an answer out there. But the two applications are different.
Like you, I have a very small budget. I already had the voltmeter, so hooking it up for testing was a natural move.
If you have H3 lights, you should be aware there are 35 watt H3 bulbs available. Here: http://store.candlepower.com/4-035.html
and here: http://www.rallylights.com/Hella_H3_Bulbs.aspx
I recently tried out some rather efficient MR16 bulbs, 30 watt Infrared Reflective Coated bulbs that put out light like 50 watt bulbs. But they didn't have tight enough beam control to run as anything other than driving lights along with high beam. I mounted them in an old pair of PIAA 1000X lights that were given to me (about the only way I'd ever acquire PIAA lights).
If you can run a 35 watt headlight, plus a few watts more, a 35 watt HID light takes about 42 watts input. But doing HID "right," means installing a headlight actually designed for the HID light source. And that means a bigger budget.
Are you looking for better conspicuity, so cars are more likely to see you?
Or are you looking for better vision down the road at night?
Either way, I'm sure there is an answer out there. But the two applications are different.
TorchBoy
Flashlight Enthusiast
Um, does that mean the 25 W halogen bulbs I was thinking of are actually 6 V? They'd have to wired in series to be usable then.
Off road lighting was mentioned, so I'm assuming high beam would be used.
Hamilton Felix
Enlightened
I don't know of a 12V H3 bulb smaller than 35 watts. Now that you tickle my memory, I recall a rechargeable handheld light I once owned, that had a 6 volt H3. Can't recall the wattage, though.
LED is energy efficient, but I can't see doing it on a tiny budget. Not yet, anyway. In a couple of years, maybe.
LED is energy efficient, but I can't see doing it on a tiny budget. Not yet, anyway. In a couple of years, maybe.
The lights would be for offroad use only. I have put 2 35watt hid bulbs/ ballasts on my other motorcyle a 1100gs bmw. I put them into lightforce 140 housings, they put out a lot of light, not perfect pattern, and definitely not for street use. You could probably put those on your 650 in your piaa housings if you want offroad lighting. I got those from VVME about $55 shipped very fast.
SmurfTacular
Enlightened
maybe somebody already mentioned it, but if it can run a 35w halogen, isnt that enough to run a 35w HID?
Alaric Darconville
Flashlight Enthusiast
The ballast provides 35W to the bulb. Since it's not 100% efficient, a 35W HID lamp will consume more than 35W.
However, it's close enough that it probably wouldn't be a problem. The biggest problem is the inrush current when first struck.
I am planning on using a 35 watt hid in the stock housing with a halogen hi beam. I will reverse the hi and low wires to make the halogen the low beam.I have done this on another bike with acceptable (to me) for my application, most my night riding is offroad. However back to the original question about auxiliary lights which I will have little amps left to power them. I wanted to fab some leds bulbs into my auxiliary light housings. I want the leds for a flood pattern during slow offroad riding. what would be the best led bulb to start with and how do I make it work with a 12v system? How do the Vision X lights work?
Hamilton Felix
Enlightened
Hmmm.....
Others here can make recommendations for LED's to start with. But even with you doing the fabbing, I'm wondering how long before you bust that $50 budget. I'd bet the Vision X lights will bust that budget quickly.
BTW, I seem to recall reading that 35 watt HID ballasts require about 42 watts input -- not talking about momentary inrush current when starting; the battery should be able to handle that.
If you have enough power for even one auxiliary light, I'd think one of those low cost HID conversions you mentioned might be the ticket for offroad light.
I'm spooky about changing a halogen-intended light to HID, because the change in focal and length and shape of the lightsource WILL change the beam pattern. Of course, you may be fine for offroad use. But any change to onroad pattern is sure to be for the worse -- especially on low beam, where you need the clean upper cutoff to the beam.
I recall spending a bit more time offroad when I had the 1990 Yamaha XT600. It was electric start. I found myself wishing for the earlier model that had both electric and kick start. My type of offroad is not "race around and fly through the air," but rather "crawl up abandoned roads and old trails and try not to kill it or do down too often." I found that the combination of low speed and frequent restarts resulted in a low battery. If I'd kept that bike, I would have wired a switch to cut out the lights when not needed, just to save my battery. In my case, "offroad" lighting would probably have meant a floodlight, not a driving beam.
With the "adventure bike," I mostly commute, and only occasionally explore old logging roads for fun. So I have to think about roadworthy lights. Only last night, in the rain with intermittent bits of fog, on dark tree-lined rural blacktop, I was wishing for more light.
I've heard that, due to focal length issues, the halogen lamps most likely to come out OK after an HID conversion are H7 lamps like the Hella FF50.
I'll keep the low cost VVME HID's in mind, but... my budget is VERY small (if I can't sell two small houses VERY soon, the divorce settlement will force me into bankruptcy), but I have an interesting assortment of junk sitting around. So, in my case, I'm looking for a way to mount up existing lights if I have the power available. I have a pair, still new in the boxes, of Cibie early 1980's vintage 5-3/4" curved lens H1 high beams. If I can find some lightweight housings and they don't look too huge on my bike -- and I have the power to carry them -- that would be an ideal addition to my stock headlights (which will soon have relays and Phillips X-treme Power bulbs). Failing that, I have some 50 watt PAR36 halogen sealed beams, and recently found a couple of 4-1/2" housings.
Really, to know what you have, I'd recommend mounting a voltmeter. I had an automotive meter already, so I angle cut and painted a scrap of 2" PVC Pipe to make a mounting, wired it with a sub-mini toggle switch to turn on the meter and its illuminating bulb, and now I can watch my system voltage at different rpm and lighting loads. I wired it straight to the battery.
Good Luck.
Others here can make recommendations for LED's to start with. But even with you doing the fabbing, I'm wondering how long before you bust that $50 budget. I'd bet the Vision X lights will bust that budget quickly.
BTW, I seem to recall reading that 35 watt HID ballasts require about 42 watts input -- not talking about momentary inrush current when starting; the battery should be able to handle that.
If you have enough power for even one auxiliary light, I'd think one of those low cost HID conversions you mentioned might be the ticket for offroad light.
I'm spooky about changing a halogen-intended light to HID, because the change in focal and length and shape of the lightsource WILL change the beam pattern. Of course, you may be fine for offroad use. But any change to onroad pattern is sure to be for the worse -- especially on low beam, where you need the clean upper cutoff to the beam.
I recall spending a bit more time offroad when I had the 1990 Yamaha XT600. It was electric start. I found myself wishing for the earlier model that had both electric and kick start. My type of offroad is not "race around and fly through the air," but rather "crawl up abandoned roads and old trails and try not to kill it or do down too often." I found that the combination of low speed and frequent restarts resulted in a low battery. If I'd kept that bike, I would have wired a switch to cut out the lights when not needed, just to save my battery. In my case, "offroad" lighting would probably have meant a floodlight, not a driving beam.
With the "adventure bike," I mostly commute, and only occasionally explore old logging roads for fun. So I have to think about roadworthy lights. Only last night, in the rain with intermittent bits of fog, on dark tree-lined rural blacktop, I was wishing for more light.
I've heard that, due to focal length issues, the halogen lamps most likely to come out OK after an HID conversion are H7 lamps like the Hella FF50.
I'll keep the low cost VVME HID's in mind, but... my budget is VERY small (if I can't sell two small houses VERY soon, the divorce settlement will force me into bankruptcy), but I have an interesting assortment of junk sitting around. So, in my case, I'm looking for a way to mount up existing lights if I have the power available. I have a pair, still new in the boxes, of Cibie early 1980's vintage 5-3/4" curved lens H1 high beams. If I can find some lightweight housings and they don't look too huge on my bike -- and I have the power to carry them -- that would be an ideal addition to my stock headlights (which will soon have relays and Phillips X-treme Power bulbs). Failing that, I have some 50 watt PAR36 halogen sealed beams, and recently found a couple of 4-1/2" housings.
Really, to know what you have, I'd recommend mounting a voltmeter. I had an automotive meter already, so I angle cut and painted a scrap of 2" PVC Pipe to make a mounting, wired it with a sub-mini toggle switch to turn on the meter and its illuminating bulb, and now I can watch my system voltage at different rpm and lighting loads. I wired it straight to the battery.
Good Luck.
TorchBoy
Flashlight Enthusiast
Nice idea but doing that will very probably be illegal as the low beam pattern would then be not what the housing was designed for. And it may look acceptable from your position on the bike but it would be inconsiderate for other road users.
As Hamilton Felix said, the battery should cope with the HID start-up current just fine. Why don't you just mount a single 35 W HID completely separate from the ordinary headlight and use either or both depending on what you need at any particular time? You might break your budget but you won't break the law - or your battery and alternator if you fit the voltmeter HF has mentioned a couple of times.
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