I Need A Bright Light

[saddleman]

I do field research involving snakes and other reptiles. In other words, I spend nights walking around in mountainous desert hoping to see snakes before they see me. Since the early 80's, I have used streamlights and love them but recently bought an Olight M30(700 lumen) which is now my favorite. While looking for batteries and a charger, I ran across some 900 to 1000 lumen Ultrafire and Trustfire lights that are much cheaper but I can't find many reviews on them.
My question is, can you recomend a brighter light for the same price as my M30($139) or a light as bright for less money that won't leave me standing in the dark?
This forum has been a great source of info, thanks to all of you.
Thanks
Rick

 

[Fenris]

Chances are, those two flashlights you mentioned put out no where near the lumens advertised.

 

[Mdinana]

I would think (based on previous experience) that a mountainous desert would have plenty of light, most nights, to see snakes. New moon is a different story. Not to mention a snake can't strike you until you're pretty much on it (what's the rule - can hit as far as 2/3 of body length?)

Having just said that, a 1000 lumen light will totally blow your nightvision, and maybe regular vision if you use it up close.

You're probably fine with something in the 30-60 lumen range, and even that is pushing it. Realistically, if all you're looking for is snakes, you only need to see 10-20 feet, right?

 

[Vamp]

Considering your activity, I believe you should have a light with Hi/Mid/Low/SOS. The Hi would be usefull to reach you search area and the Mid/Low would be for searching depending on the vegetation, SOS would be for... lets hope you'll never need it!

I won't say that there is a more powefull torch for less than that (but there might be), but there sure are a few others with about the same power, with all the features I suggested and for a lot less, maybe 1/3 of that price. You might want to check some p7 and consider that instead of 900 or 1000 lumens, they will give about 700! :P

I must say though, since you are searching for something in particular (snakes) I would recomend that you find out the waveleght (color) which they reflect the most and get the closest color flashight.

The snakes camouflage meens that if you find the color or colors at which the difference in reflection is the greatest with regard to vegetation, it would be even better.

You could then order some speciality leds (they are made in nearly all visible waveleghts, in relatively short increments) and replace the ones on an inexpensive ~20 led flashlight (or for example have a local tv repairs tecnician do that for you).

This information could take some googling and maybe some e-mails to experts in order to obtain, but would make it a heck of a lot easier to find those snakes, and therefore safer!

[EDIT] I found the site I was looking for: http://www.roithner-laser.com/LED_diverse.htm
you will see that they have a huge selection, but unfortunattly these leds are very dim, so you would need quite a few to get some decent light, maybe 50 or more...
An alternative would be to use filter eyewear (with the appropriate waveleght (CSI style)) with an ordinary white led light. The filter would make the snake stand out more, but the contrast would not be as great as with the special leds
If the snake shows phosphorescence it would be even easier, using a combination of uv leds and filter eyewear.

 

[saddleman]

Hey Vamp,
Thanks for the input. P7 is greek to me, can you explain?
Thanks
Rick

 

[jankj]

... recently bought an Olight M30 (700 lumen) which is now my favorite. While looking for batteries and a charger, I ran across some 900 to 1000 lumen Ultrafire and Trustfire lights that are much cheaper but I can't find many reviews on them.

First: Those 900-1000 lumens ratings are most likely hugely inflated, and the quality controll of those cheap *fire (where *fire is any name ending with "fire" exept surefire, which is NOT cheap) is not premium. You may get a good one, you may get something that is not soo good. Lumens-per-dollar, it may still be a good purchase, but not really a light you can rely on.


Second: Don't get hung up in lumens number, because your eyes do not perceive lumens increase in a linear way. Roughly speaking, if you want something "twice as bright" you need 4 times the lumens. For your eyes to detect ANY difference at all there should be roughly a 30% difference in lumens. (Other factors such as beam shape (intense hot spot v.s. more "flood" type of lights are important for how "bright" a light is, too). In real world, there shouldn't really be much gain going from 700 to 1000 lumens. (But a change from a "floody" into a more "throwy" beam - or vice versa - can be a huge benefit, depending on your needs... )

Thirdly: I don't have an M30, but from the reviews I think it should be pretty hard to find something better. At least not without either sacrificing quality or going into an entirely much higher price range... You may spend about the same amount of money to get something which is about just as good, but perhaps with features that are more an exact match to your needs... but is that small improvement really worth the cost?

My question is, can you recomend a brighter light for the same price as my M30($139) or a light as bright for less money that won't leave me standing in the dark?

There may be specific light requirements for your snake spotting that the CPF community should learn from you. A good start is to tell us what you're happy with about your M30 light, and what doesn't work so well. Do you use the "high", the "medium" or the "low" setting of this light? (Try using a lower setting for at least 20 minutes so your eyes have time to adjust - it may surprise you how useful LESS light is out in the bush).


It may be that the beam does not reach far enough for your needs. Then either a more throwy beam (smaller, more intense beam that reaches further ahead - but lights up a smaller area) may be the thing. Or the reverse, you need a more floody beam. Both kind of lights are easy to find.

It may be that the colors do not stand out very well (as suggested in posts above). A warm white or neutral white LED may or may not be better. I wouldn't know, I've never done snake spotting... Such lights are harder to find, but I think it should be possible.


Or it may just be that you simply need absurdely amounts of lights. HID (high energy discharge) lights will give you that, but they are absurdely expensive. (One exception: The stanley HID at walmart / amazon.com cost $70-ish and is a a bargain, but that one is heavy and has half an hour run time. Good if you are in a vehicle with a 12V power source, but not exactly what I would carry around in the desert).

Fourth: Bring a backup that "won't leave you standing in the dark". Fenix E01 cost $15. Never fails, will last 11 hours before dimming, and will probably give usefull ligth for another 10 hours. You can find something reliable and powerful at shiningbeam.com that starts at around $20, but those have only one mode (high) and will leave you in the dark after 1-1.5 hours. Go a bit higher for multi-mode, or you can buy the quark, fenix LD10/LD20 or a similar light at around $60-70 which will be multi-mode (quite powerful OR a loooooooong lasting low, or something in between).

 

[jankj]

Hey Vamp,
P7 is greek to me, can you explain?

P7 and MC-E are both LEDS where you have stacked 4 LED diodes into one. Olight M30 has an MC-E. You can see the 4 individual squares of the 4 LEDs if you look into the business end of the light.

The benefit is that you can crank theoretical up to 4 times the light out of an MC-E or P7 than out of an conventional light diode. This will appear as twice as bright to your eye. In practice, it will be less than 4 times because of practical limitations (heat management, power supply and so on).

Another quirk is that the lighting surface is 4 times larger, so it is harder to focus. A P7 or MC-E is great for lighting up a large area, but if you want a laser thin beam that reaches as far as possible then a conventional diode may actually be better.

 

[saddleman]

Thanks for all the advice.
I think what I need is more of a flood, my m30 has a big spot which works better than my streamlight but not as much of a flood as my stubby. The stubby is a great flood but doesn't shine very far and the battery pack is heavy and hot and a pain to carry with other collecting gear. I need to see a snake that is 12 inches long at 20, 30 or 40 feet before he can drop into a crack or crevice in the rock. They tend to travel along the base of the rock or the edge of a crevice and look like a shadow. I think a white light would be better than yellow but I am not sure about blue. Some snakes have collors like red or yellow but most are earthtones, so I am not sure if the different filters will work.
Thanks
Again
Rick

 

[Vamp]

Thanks jankj for clearing that up! ;)

I'm also on a quest for a low priced p7, and the aurora seems to have a tougher finishing than most for the price, and also have a good light although it would do even better if the led and the electronics were improved.

You can see the one I'm looking at in my previous topic : http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=3034391&postcount=6

I have seen many good reviews on it:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=208093
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=198247
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=2916873&postcount=12
http://www.dealextreme.com/forums/Default.dx
/sku.16091~threadid.196293 (similar model)

The cons of the the aurora is the led is class C, instead of the brighter class D, an the drive isn't to powerfull, it will likely put out about 600-700 lm. The good thing is that it has better annodized coating and shoots a beam with decent range and also with usefull spread, which makes it a better proximity search light.

There is a 5 mode version too:
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.15692

A cheap p7 with stonger light but with a narrower beam is the MTE SF-15 SSC P7-D-SXO 4-Mode Memory 900-Lumen LED Flashlight (1*18650):
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.22567

Please note that these lights use 1*18650 battery, and will likely last less than 1h on High and maybe some 2-3h on low, so If I were you, I would carry some 3 extra batteries. However annoying it may be to carry extra batteries, it also means the light is lighter and smaller and easier to wield, which is ideal for searching for stuff close by. Oh, and never forget to carry an extra flashlight, just in case (2=1, 1=0, as I read somewhere :P), maybe this one http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.13095, because it the smallest I've seen with a Q5 led that uses a 18650 battery, meaning you don't have to carry even more batteries.

[EDIT]
I didn't know you were searching for many different species, and I concurr with you with regard to the filters, but you might want to try shinning red and blue on snakes that you have, and see if they reflect more, in general, one of these colours.

 

[325addict]

If snakes are more of "earth color" and red, all you need is a bright incan with a floody beam. Forget about LEDs in this case. An incan having only half the Lumens of a LED light will be FAR more effective here....
Just try it... you'll see it works much better, and you'll leave your LED-light home next time ;)

I would start using an M90 Rattlesnake (what's in a name!) by Wolf Eyes.
It has one of the greatest beams I've ever seen, with a bright hot spot, gradually going into a really bright flood.

Not enough light? Buy one of the extenders, the 13V D36 drop-in and here you are: more or less the same beam pattern, but WAY brighter!

But ONE WARNING: as an incan is prone to failure when dropped etc. you should bring a backup.... and YES, preferably a LED-light :naughty:


Timmo.

 

[My3kidsfather]

If snakes are more of "earth color" and red, all you need is a bright incan with a floody beam. Forget about LEDs in this case. An incan having only half the Lumens of a LED light will be FAR more effective here....
Just try it... you'll see it works much better, and you'll leave your LED-light home next time ;)

I would start using an M90 Rattlesnake (what's in a name!) by Wolf Eyes.
It has one of the greatest beams I've ever seen, with a bright hot spot, gradually going into a really bright flood.

Not enough light? Buy one of the extenders, the 13V D36 drop-in and here you are: more or less the same beam pattern, but WAY brighter!

But ONE WARNING: as an incan is prone to failure when dropped etc. you should bring a backup.... and YES, preferably a LED-light :naughty:


Timmo.

325addict- I agree with your opinion on the need for an incan here.. especially with this being potentially a dangerous situation. It's time to leave loyalties (led or incan) at the door and consider that leds will not reveal brown and green colors. Saddleman, incans will show these colors vividly and immediately to the human eye not leaving movement as your only detection. My opinion is simply have both- an led with long runtime for backup and walkout and an incan like a Surefire M6 or comparable with spare batteries (absolutely reliable is important). In addition you might look into building an incan modded MagLite with any number of hotwire bulbs providing the higher lumens you desire.. perhaps a good Roar Of the Pengiun (ROP) modded MagLite would suffice?

Your incan may save your life as it will reveal the snakes where a led will "hide them" into the background of washed out colors. It's just my opinion but there it is. And you might want to consider getting a good UV light to reveal certain scorpions if they are a issue in the area. I picked up one of the Inova UV's and it has 40 hour runtime and works great. Have fun!

 

[Vamp]

I agree that an incandescent would be better than a white light led, that's why I suggested the use of coloured leds. An adequate monocrome colour has even more potential than incandescents in making certain coloured objects and animals stand out more. The uv is also great to reveal "hidden" stuff like white scorpions, like My3KidsDad said.
The only problem with the monocrome is that everything would look somewhat alien...
If you were to be a perfectionist, you would gep a custom made, sort of like this one http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=2933108&postcount=14, but using 3 of these http://www.cree.com/products/xlamp_new_colors.asp, with independent fully adjustable drives (you would have 4 knobs). You could then adjust the color to have a rendition similar to incandescent or even better suited to your needs! ;) .. The only big problem that I can see would be the cost! :p

 

[Mjolnir]

I find that incandescents tend to make things blend in more with leaves and dirt, and that LEDs provide more contrast, and make it easier to see animals, such as slugs and insects.

 

[jankj]

There are some very strong recommandations for incadecent lights here. Apart from 3D maglite and some really crappy 2D / 2AA stuff that I had before discovering LEDs (and CPF), my experience with incans are zero. Still, it may be a good idea to check out one of the few regulated incans out there: Surefire A2 aviator. An über-entusiastic review from CPF member Carrot can be found here. From my incan days, I remember how frustratingly quick that great 3D maglite turned yellow and bleak when I actually had to USE it for a while...

It may be too throwy for your liking, though. It's made for pilots inspecting airplanes before takeoff (as well as dim leds for preserving night vision while flying). And it is not cheap, and I personally detest the idea of running through a couple of CR123 batteries each night. (For me it's either eneloop nimh AA or 18650 li-ion rechargeables).

I am not entirely convinced that neutral white or warm white LEDs are totally ruled out... Frankly it is impossible to tell unless you try. You can buy a warm-white zebralight H501w (AA battery) or H60w (li-ion 18650 battery), available from zebralight web site. All floody, will reach well out beyond 40 feet. And VERY small and nice form factor. (Use them hand held, as headlamps or clip them to basically anything you want - amazing versitality). If the zebras don't cut it you can sell them at cpf marketplace or give them away as cristmas presents - or keep them as general utility headlamps.