Incandescent's, have they reached their technological limit?

[ebow86]

Their's no debate about one thing, incandescent flashlights are dying, they have been for the last several years. Virtually no companies have a interest in incandescent technology any more, not with all the new LED technology available to us now. The chances of a new surefire incan coming out are slim to none, because the only sales would be some of us diehard incan users, most look toward LED. But here's my question. In my opinion the Surefire 10X dominator and M6 guardian and two of the greatest incandescent flashlights ever created. Are these two flashlights at the limits of how advanced an incandescent flashlight can be with that type of technology? Have we hit the brick wall, so to say, or is there something promising on the herizion that may Rejuvenate manufacturers to start looking into some producing new incandescent's?

 

[Phaserburn]

Good question.

 

[Dioni]

Indeed, have they reached their technological limit? :thinking:

I think it depends on the batteries technologies and people stopping say "its so yellowish" . We have not seen a li-ion or LiPo powered Surefire incan yet. It may never occur, altough I desperatly want it to

 

[Conte]

There is nothing really advanced about the Surefire M6 guardian it's pretty simple from what I know of it, and I would almost go as far as to say that the Maglite is more advance due to its focusable cam system. There is more to the 10X dominator, thats for sure. But really, they are all just fancy tubes.

The funny thing about incandescent lights, is there really isn't anything advanced about them. They are just a package, a tube of sorts in which to mount a bulb and some batteries for practical use. Those only REAL advancements made in incan tech, is in the bulbs themselves. I would hazard to guess that we have already mastered the Incan light bulb making it as efficient as can be. Now it's jsut a question of what rated filament do you want it what size envelope on what kind of base to match your application.

The only other advancements to be made are in Battery and Reflector tech, but those are both advancements to be shared with the LED.

If you go to your nearest whatever store, Incan flashlights are dropping off the shelf in favor of LED for the average Joe, but for the time being Incan has a while to go yet, as it still has many practical uses in the high end market until LED matures to match Incans wide spectrum output.

Meanwhile, fluorescent tech is improving in leaps and bound to replace Incan in the household and workplace for room lighting. I'm quite impressed by the new 6700k T5HO offerings.

HID seems already to be replacing incan for extreme high output applications and with tweeking are more capable of delivering wide spectrum light then LED.

Sadly, I do have to admit, the incan clock is ticking. A day will come when a LED can do everything and incan flashlight can do and better. Some would debate that day has already come.

IN other news, we still have quite a few decades to go before Incan bulbs go way of the Carbide Lamp, which STILL can be had today with the right sourcing.

 

[Bullzeyebill]

I think many CPF'ers will keep the incan game going here, particularly with regulated incan circuits becoming more available. Would be nice if the temperature of the hot wires could be increased without burning out the wires, something designed to keep them cooler, then we could see efficency improve, and light output increase per watt.

Bill

 

[AnAppleSnail]

As much as the standard transmission has, yes.

 

[leukos]

As much as the standard transmission has, yes.

That is an excellent comparison. :thumbsup:

 

[Dioni]

I read somewhere here something about the use of lasers with bulbs to produce a whiter light. Did someone also see it?

 

[computernut]

I think with new battery technologies us incan guys will be laughing as the runtime problem will be a thing of the past. The thing is that LEDs will continue to improve and there will be less reasons to use incans. It'll remain for some a personal preference to have the nice warm glow of a filament

 

[LuxLuthor]

It's like comparing a ball point pen and a beautiful fountain pen.

 

[ebow86]

I think with new battery technologies us incan guys will be laughing as the runtime problem will be a thing of the past. The thing is that LEDs will continue to improve and there will be less reasons to use incans. It'll remain for some a personal preference to have the nice warm glow of a filament

Well that's the thing about it. No company out there is going to devote any more time and money into developing a new incandescent flashlight, there's just no demand. It's a dying technology. Everytime I use my 10X dominator I dream of the day surefire will release a new updated version with an advanced lithium ion battery, but sadly it's not going to happen. With that said, I don't think us diehard incan users will be laughing at runtimes of old anytime soon. Unfortunately the battery's powering our incan's now is probably as good as it's going to get, only held back by the desire of manufacturers to move on to more promising things like LEDS and what powers them.

 

[leukos]

Unfortunately the battery's powering our incan's now is probably as good as it's going to get

True, you may never see a better battery for your 10X from Surefire, but the demand for better Li-ion technology is only increasing in most areas of electronics: cell phones, laptops, electric cars. There are some possibilities on the horizon, but there is always a lag time from the laboratory to the store shelves: http://www.geek.com/articles/gadget...-stores-10x-more-energy-than-li-ion-20090520/

 

[ebow86]

True, you may never see a better battery for your 10X from Surefire, but the demand for better Li-ion technology is only increasing in most areas of electronics: cell phones, laptops, electric cars. There are some possibilities on the horizon, but there is always a lag time from the laboratory to the store shelves: http://www.geek.com/articles/gadget...-stores-10x-more-energy-than-li-ion-20090520/

Absolutely, battery technology is only going to move forward and the demand will grow larger, but when are you going to see any of that technology being applied to an incandescent flashlight? Not from the manufacturer of the light anyway, maybe by some modder's out there.

 

[ebow86]

"There is nothing really advanced about the Surefire M6 guardian it's pretty simple from what I know of it, and I would almost go as far as to say that the Maglite is more advance due to its focusable cam system. There is more to the 10X dominator, thats for sure. But really, they are all just fancy tubes."" _ Conte, although you make some good points in your post I would have to respectively disagree withe this part. If you take into consideration the material the M6 is made of, the technology and research behind the lamp and reflector, and most of all compair it to every flashlight available at the time of it's release, yes I do consider it an advanced piece of technology. I get what your saying, its just a tube with a lamp, but looking behind the scenes alot of technology went into making lights like the M6 and 10.

 

[Linger]

The SF lights aren't peak of tech at all.
Add an AW soft-start to a hikari JC5607 and 3AW IMR 26500's and there is a multi-level bulb with output that may double all cpf production led lights (ssr-90 based emitters, the JETBeam, the new 4Seven's).

Going above this tech are Jimmy M's and Alan B's incan regulators. Beyond my 1st hand experience, these steady-output long running high output incan options are tech way ahead of anything surefire put out.

While led's need current regulated, incan's need voltage regulated, but if you remove drivers from each then led doesn't look that advanced it just runs longer.

///
Possible that filaments become much stronger with molecular/nano assembly, removing manufactured impurities the filaments could enter the fantastic efficiencies that we begin grasping at the high end of Lux's destructive incan hotwire charts.

 

[Kestrel]

It's like comparing a ball point pen and a beautiful fountain pen.

... or like comparing a telephone to a marmot. :ironic:

 

[Linger]

A generally large ground squirrel?

Well if you wanted to roast the squirrel, a fire-starting incan could help.

 

[kramer5150]

I think as long as LED CRI remains inferior to incan lighting... incans will never completely die out.

I can see a time when LED lighting will achieve a near-100 CRI. At that point incan lighting will fall into a niche market segment. Its very similar to how other technology driven hobbies have gone:

-analog audio versus digital audio
-Guitar tube amps versus digital modeling
-Mechanical automatic versus Quartz watches

The consumer market is $$$ driven, no ifs ands or buts about that. manufacturers are ONLY going to release products that sell in volume. That volume is going to be in the LED segment. But that doesn't diminish the strengths of incan lighting at all.

 

[Inliner]

I read somewhere here something about the use of lasers with bulbs to produce a whiter light. Did someone also see it?

Yeah whatever was the verdict on the femptopulse (sp?) laser treatment?

 

[Conte]

-analog audio versus digital audio
-Guitar tube amps versus digital modeling

+1 about the guitar amps. As long as human rock, the Vaccuum tube will die hard, even harder then the Incan.

Sadly, analog audio, is on it's way out. At least as far as recording and production goes.