Is L2 body built like a longer L1?
- Thread starter milkyspit
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Not trying to argue with anyone's preference, just trying to undersand...
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milkyspit said:Among other things, I'd say watches, knives, and flashlights all fit into this category.
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Don't see knives as a legitmate comparison; the size is too closely tied to function, one affects the other directly. Lots of artifacts work that way, lots don't.
Watches.. ok, maybe the size of the face. But the size of a flashlight seems to me closer to the THICKNESS of the watch. I'm not sure I see any advantage to one being thicker unless it's required for more function.
For me, personally, I have to admit that I wondered a bit about what I spent for the L4 when I got to know the Q-III. Sure, it's less capable in several ways... but it's seems to have about 75 percent of the capability in a much more convenient package (for less than a third the price, but we won't go there).
Would I go for something half the size of the L4 with the same functionality? Sure I would. I woudn't miss the size at all. It's pretty much too small to bonk someone with anyway.
Not saying that twisty tailcaps are appropriate on any size, but I'm still not entirely convinced about them anyway. I've got the McE2S tail on mine, but it's for the 2 stages, and maybe a little for the guard. Other than that, I was perfectly happy with the clicky.
[ QUOTE ]
milkyspit said:Among other things, I'd say watches, knives, and flashlights all fit into this category.
[/ QUOTE ]
Don't see knives as a legitmate comparison; the size is too closely tied to function, one affects the other directly. Lots of artifacts work that way, lots don't.
Watches.. ok, maybe the size of the face. But the size of a flashlight seems to me closer to the THICKNESS of the watch. I'm not sure I see any advantage to one being thicker unless it's required for more function.
For me, personally, I have to admit that I wondered a bit about what I spent for the L4 when I got to know the Q-III. Sure, it's less capable in several ways... but it's seems to have about 75 percent of the capability in a much more convenient package (for less than a third the price, but we won't go there).
Would I go for something half the size of the L4 with the same functionality? Sure I would. I woudn't miss the size at all. It's pretty much too small to bonk someone with anyway.
Not saying that twisty tailcaps are appropriate on any size, but I'm still not entirely convinced about them anyway. I've got the McE2S tail on mine, but it's for the 2 stages, and maybe a little for the guard. Other than that, I was perfectly happy with the clicky.
milkyspit
Flashlight Enthusiast
MR Dead, I was mainly thinking of the size, shape and materials in the handle of the knife, not the size of the blade. TOB9595 showed me his VERY impressive collection of what looked like 100+ knives, and I tried many of them, but found that for various reasons, quite a few were just not a good "fit" to my hand size, preferred style of holding the knife, preferred feel as far as balance point, etc. None of this had to do with the blades themselves... in fact, some of the knives I rejected probably had better blades than the ones I liked the most! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif
With watches IMHO we're talking size, thickness, weight, material (plastic vs. stainless steel vs. gold plated, etc.), type of watch band, and even the specifics of the face, like whether all the hours are numbered vs. only some vs. none (like Movado), whether Roman numerals vs. regular numbers are used, the style of the hands, how "busy" the face is designwise, etc.
There are so many little things that add up to a big difference for each individual, and it's often not that the product is good vs. bad, but rather whether the person is comfortable using it... whether it feels "natural" or not.
Heck, I have little tiny girlish hands! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif If Al's got some rather large, masculine hands, he'd probably find the bulk of my own flashlight collection unusable! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif
One final note, with apologies for straying as far as I have off topic (and it's my own thread! DOH!), but a great read on these types of issues is a book written quite some time ago by Donald Norman, entitled, "Psychology of Everyday Things." That book has apparently since been retitled, "The Design of Everyday Things"... it's the one over here.
Edit: If the flashlight doesn't feel right, you won't carry it with you, and it will become essentially useless no matter how good it is. Photographers have a similar saying about point-and-shoot cameras, which of course are vastly inferior to a good, full-featured 35mm SLR camera... I'm sure I'm about to butcher this adage, but I believe it goes like this: "The best camera is the one you have with you." Many professional photographers have a point-and-shoot camera in their pocket at all times in addition to the more "professional" equipment they carry to events. Even with something as simple as a baseball bat, each player in the Major Leagues here in the States has his own style that just "feels" right. No doubt every bat used in Major League Baseball is capable of driving the ball out of the park, and yet there are almost as many styles of bat as there are players in baseball. Each person has his own "best" bat, and it's just as valid for him as the next guy's "best" (but different) bat is in that case. Mostly it comes down to the fit with the individual. Like flashlights! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
With watches IMHO we're talking size, thickness, weight, material (plastic vs. stainless steel vs. gold plated, etc.), type of watch band, and even the specifics of the face, like whether all the hours are numbered vs. only some vs. none (like Movado), whether Roman numerals vs. regular numbers are used, the style of the hands, how "busy" the face is designwise, etc.
There are so many little things that add up to a big difference for each individual, and it's often not that the product is good vs. bad, but rather whether the person is comfortable using it... whether it feels "natural" or not.
Heck, I have little tiny girlish hands! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif If Al's got some rather large, masculine hands, he'd probably find the bulk of my own flashlight collection unusable! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif
One final note, with apologies for straying as far as I have off topic (and it's my own thread! DOH!), but a great read on these types of issues is a book written quite some time ago by Donald Norman, entitled, "Psychology of Everyday Things." That book has apparently since been retitled, "The Design of Everyday Things"... it's the one over here.
Edit: If the flashlight doesn't feel right, you won't carry it with you, and it will become essentially useless no matter how good it is. Photographers have a similar saying about point-and-shoot cameras, which of course are vastly inferior to a good, full-featured 35mm SLR camera... I'm sure I'm about to butcher this adage, but I believe it goes like this: "The best camera is the one you have with you." Many professional photographers have a point-and-shoot camera in their pocket at all times in addition to the more "professional" equipment they carry to events. Even with something as simple as a baseball bat, each player in the Major Leagues here in the States has his own style that just "feels" right. No doubt every bat used in Major League Baseball is capable of driving the ball out of the park, and yet there are almost as many styles of bat as there are players in baseball. Each person has his own "best" bat, and it's just as valid for him as the next guy's "best" (but different) bat is in that case. Mostly it comes down to the fit with the individual. Like flashlights! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
sigp6
Newly Enlightened
I agree with Al. The L2 is perfect(size-wise) for me. The E2\L4s are a little smaller than ideal for me.
My ARC4+ can be a real pain due to its small size(and no, I won't give it up...)
My ARC4+ can be a real pain due to its small size(and no, I won't give it up...)
voodoogreg
Flashlight Enthusiast
I dig the L2 better too. not just size but when i tried it a the local LEO outfitter, it was brighter, two level's, and since i got a KL-1 head and E1e coming i don't need the "option's"(and don't like having to buy a 40-50$ part to make it two stage) the L4 give's, so i intend to get a L2 in the first part of the yr. VDG
P.S. does it ever stop? I got the E1e,KL-1,diffuser, a KC-1 to order tomorrow, and coupla CMG sonic's and ultra's to come too.......I am aDICKted /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif
P.S. does it ever stop? I got the E1e,KL-1,diffuser, a KC-1 to order tomorrow, and coupla CMG sonic's and ultra's to come too.......I am aDICKted /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif
Size15's
Flashaholic
Those are my hands holding those cut-away flashlights in the photos posted above. That A2 is also functional (expect the one LED exposed that doesn't function because the screw fixing is missing because there is nothing for it to screw into!).
There is something about my last two fingers 'riding up' past the body and having to wrap round the larger diameter bezel that makes such lights less easy to grip and use in my experience - It makes it easier to push the flashlight out of my hand when I press the TailCap push-button pressure switch.
Strangely, the L1 doesn't do this. I think it's due there being less difference between the body diameter and the bezel diameter for the L1 compared to the L4.
I know that feedback to SureFire have requested that the flashlights are ergonomic - which means that they are not so short in some cases.
Al
There is something about my last two fingers 'riding up' past the body and having to wrap round the larger diameter bezel that makes such lights less easy to grip and use in my experience - It makes it easier to push the flashlight out of my hand when I press the TailCap push-button pressure switch.
Strangely, the L1 doesn't do this. I think it's due there being less difference between the body diameter and the bezel diameter for the L1 compared to the L4.
I know that feedback to SureFire have requested that the flashlights are ergonomic - which means that they are not so short in some cases.
Al
ODatsBright
Newly Enlightened
LOL, if you're a runt like me with itty bitty hands, the L4 fits perfect, :d
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