LED Street Lighting Pics

jashhash

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Sep 12, 2004
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466
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Phillips Ranch
What many people aren't aware of is the politics surrounding LED street lighting. Right now every LED manufacturer is fighting for a market share of what could be the biggest source of revenue. American LED manufacturers are fighting hard with each other and the ominous inevitability that luminaire manufacturers will eventually turn to China for a fairly priced LED. The truth is that there are so many people still so amazed by what high power LED's can do and this novel amazement blinds them from the fact that they are simply paying too much.

In any semiconductor industry prices plummet with the advance of new technology. Take a computer for example which costing initially $1,000 falls to $250 in the course of 4 years. Now it seems to me that LED's should be following a similar trend, and those who have spent money in R&D should have already recouped their losses. Yet somehow year after year I'm amazed at how LED's continue to sell at a similar price. Maybe I'm crazy but It seems reasonable to me that the R2 bin LED's which are currently being sold to us at $5.00 a piece should only be costing us no more than $1.50. In large quantities it seems reasonable to me that a 100 watt LED board should sell for $50.00 not $400.00

So how does Cree, Osram, and Philips plan to compete with the threat of high quality Chinese LED's? US based LED companies push new legislature like this years LM-80 standard. This standard requires that a LED manufacturer must provide a reliability report that shows lumen depreciation over around 9,000 hours of operation. While this sounds like a great idea, this new standard effectively eliminates all Chinese LED's since it would take them over a year to run LED's to 9,000 hours. If the LM-80 standard is adopted as a requirement for receiving an energy star rating, we will continue to be forced to pay CREE, Philips, or Osram for their products at a ridiculous price.

Just my 2 cents but maybe im just a ranting lunatic. *puts on his foil hat
 
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chinese LEDbulb factory

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Joined
Aug 21, 2010
Messages
1
What many people aren't aware of is the politics surrounding LED street lighting. Right now every LED manufacturer is fighting for a market share of what could be the biggest source of revenue. American LED manufacturers are fighting hard with each other and the ominous inevitability that luminaire manufacturers will eventually turn to China for a fairly priced LED. The truth is that there are so many people still so amazed by what high power LED's can do and this novel amazement blinds them from the fact that they are simply paying too much.

In any semiconductor industry prices plummet with the advance of new technology. Take a computer for example which costing initially $1,000 falls to $250 in the course of 4 years. Now it seems to me that LED's should be following a similar trend, and those who have spent money in R&D should have already recouped their losses. Yet somehow year after year I'm amazed at how LED's continue to sell at a similar price. Maybe I'm crazy but It seems reasonable to me that the R2 bin LED's which are currently being sold to us at $5.00 a piece should only be costing us no more than $1.50. In large quantities it seems reasonable to me that a 100 watt LED board should sell for $50.00 not $400.00

So how does Cree, Osram, and Philips plan to compete with the threat of high quality Chinese LED's? US based LED companies push new legislature like this years LM-80 standard. This standard requires that a LED manufacturer must provide a reliability report that shows lumen depreciation over around 9,000 hours of operation. While this sounds like a great idea, this new standard effectively eliminates all Chinese LED's since it would take them over a year to run LED's to 9,000 hours. If the LM-80 standard is adopted as a requirement for receiving an energy star rating, we will continue to be forced to pay CREE, Philips, or Osram for their products at a ridiculous price.

Just my 2 cents but maybe im just a ranting lunatic. *puts on his foil hat
:)there is a trend that the price of led lamp will down is true,this is the general trend for every new product ,just as said above,computer for example which costing initially $1,000 falls to $250 in the course of 4 years:)
 

HarryN

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Jan 22, 2004
Messages
3,977
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Pleasanton (Bay Area), CA, USA
Why are so many of the LED street lights so grossly overpriced from most manufacturers?

100w of LEDs =$100
extruded aluminum combination heatsink/housing =$100
ac-dc 100w driver/power supply= $50
glass or plastic lens = $30
assembly = $20
profit margin =$100
R&D =$100
fancy new eco-green product subsidized by taxpayer =$150
GREED =$150
Total=$800 (BTW this is what I was quoted for only one 100w streetlight for the poles out front, and I have 5 poles going down the driveway).

Toss in economy of scale savings and I'm a little irate and annoyed by the grossly overpriced LED street lights that are available. I could only imagine what the financially irresponsible gov't purchasing contracts are paying. Just wait 'til they start burning out LEDs, drivers.....

We're already having issues with those LED traffic and crosswalk lights. They just don't work as long as advertised.

Hi, it sounds easy, doesn't it. In practice, just try to make an LED flashlight for less than you will pay for a surefire - go ahead. :whistle:

100 watts of LEDs, decent quality, driven at a current that will make you happy with lifetime and efficiency - about $ 300 - if you buy in bulk.

Drivers- 100 watts of drive power, plus outdoor rated, for even close to the 10K hours of life - a lot more than $ 50.

Custom circuit boards for the LEDs for your light - R/D alone is probably $ 10 - 20K, plus actually making them up (in qty at least 1,000 units, on their money) prob at least $ 25 - 50 each, plus assy.

Profit margin - yes, $ 100 might be viable for a product that is selling very well, but for a low volume product - might be marginal for the up front investment needed.

Agency Certification (UL, or eq) - Another couple grand, for each version.
 

HarryN

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Jan 22, 2004
Messages
3,977
Location
Pleasanton (Bay Area), CA, USA
:)there is a trend that the price of led lamp will down is true,this is the general trend for every new product ,just as said above,computer for example which costing initially $1,000 falls to $250 in the course of 4 years:)

This is definitely true, but keep in mind how far we have come. A 200 Lumen (rated) LED just 5 - 6 years ago was nearly $ 50 / each. Now it is easy to buy a brand name, high quality, well engineered, fully tested similar LED for $ 3 / each, from the same companies. (Cree / Lumileds / Osram )

In addition to being cheaper, the modern LEDs are more efficient and have better color rendering.

Computers are an intersting comparison, but not necessarily an ideal model for this technology. LEDs are to some extent more of a "surface area" driven model vs "ability to shrink the basic circuits" model.

The reactors to build these LEDs are starting to hit up against some interesting size limitations. I won't say that they are at the end, but the 5X increase in capacity with only a 1.5 increase in costs since 1983 isn't likely to happen during the next 7 years.

It is unlikely that the efficiency and brightness gains per square mm will increase going forward nearly as much as during the past 5-7 years, leaving primarily manufacturing yield to drive cost improvements.

I have some serious doubts that there is enough improvement left to achieve another 10X improvement in Lumens / dollar in a quality LED. Of course, I have been wrong many times before. :shrug:
 

lightr07

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Oct 20, 2006
Messages
193
Here in Arizona, the city of Scottsdale has been testing some LED lamps in street lamps which are sitting on motorway overpasses. This has just started in about the last 30-60 days, and took me by quite a bit of surprise. From my best judgement, they look to be 4 rows of 18-24 LEDs. Like I said, these are barely 60 days old, and the Arizona summer is fast approaching, so I'll be interested to see how they survive in 115F heat. The light emitted is actually a very nice pure white colour.

Locally in my neighbourhood, above our community post boxes, the homeowners association recently installed motion activated LED lights, installed on about a 14 foot pole, they seem to be 8 LEDs arranged in a circle, and also work really well, however they only are activated by motion/heat, and stay on for about 2 minutes after the last detection of movement.
 

2xTrinity

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Joined
Dec 10, 2006
Messages
2,386
Location
California
Here in Arizona, the city of Scottsdale has been testing some LED lamps in street lamps which are sitting on motorway overpasses. This has just started in about the last 30-60 days, and took me by quite a bit of surprise. From my best judgement, they look to be 4 rows of 18-24 LEDs. Like I said, these are barely 60 days old, and the Arizona summer is fast approaching, so I'll be interested to see how they survive in 115F heat. The light emitted is actually a very nice pure white colour.

Locally in my neighbourhood, above our community post boxes, the homeowners association recently installed motion activated LED lights, installed on about a 14 foot pole, they seem to be 8 LEDs arranged in a circle, and also work really well, however they only are activated by motion/heat, and stay on for about 2 minutes after the last detection of movement.

I've started to see some LED lights popping up in Tucson, Arizona recently... I've been wondering the same thing about how well these will survive summer ambient temperatures.

The lights I've seen go in actually replaced high pressure sodium, so warm/neutral white LED tint. Light is directed straight down on most and Illuminance is lower than the high pressure sodium lamps that were replaced. That's not necessarily a bad thing. Around here many streets are simply left unlit entirely to keep down light pollution for the nearby obesrvatories, anyway.
 

michael b

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Joined
Aug 11, 2011
Messages
3
Evolux has a 100 watt led light that uses a tiny fan to keep cool.
http://www.earthled.com/evolux-led-light-bulb.html


Seeing this post/advertisement...It has me thinking of at least converting part of my home's CFL's (which I completely converted to a couple years ago). I see the numbers that are posted for savings, but has anyone put this to a true test and seen the results on their bills? I am new to the idea of getting LEDs for the home, so I apologize for the ignorance. It seems like a logical idea for a cost cutting method.
 

DM51

Flashaholic
Joined
Oct 31, 2006
Messages
13,338
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Borg cube #51
Welcome to CPF, michael b. :)

Your post doesn't really belong in this thread, which is about Street Lighting. You'll find other threads on Domestic LED lighting if you look down the Index.
 

Kardings

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Sep 19, 2011
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Led street light cost can be prohibitive to most cities especially during these times. A true lighting solution company will use LED and induction lamps as induction is better suited for some applications. And LED does save large amounts of money in electricity and maintenance ,I do not see how there can be any argument there. After 100's of studies it is easy to see.
 

folke

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Aug 25, 2011
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It seems MCOB LED technology is replacing SMD LED's but most LED street light manufactures still uses multiple numbers of 2-3 W LED's in their lights instead of one high power LED , why is that?
 

elviacannon

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Oct 12, 2011
Messages
2
I just buy some LED street lights not long ago, buying solar powered LED street lights is not so easy as 12 volt led bulbs
, so the salesman told me many advantages of solar powered LED street lights, which is summed up as follows:

Because of energy saving ability of LED street lights, cost of solar street lighting system will be much lower.
Save all your electricity cost. Save electric transformer and cable cost.
Long lifespan. Lifespan of solar panel is 20-25 years. Lifespan of LED street lights 6-8 years. Lifespan of battery is 4-6 years.
Maintain Free
24 months warranty for the whole solar street lighting system
When the power consumption of LED street lights is lower than 80W, ROI of solar street lights is very high.
 
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