Lumapower vs. Dereelight vs. Tiablo vs. Raidfire vs. Regalight

[jsr]

Merry Christmas all and hope your day's going well. My wife and I are having relaxing day at home and since she's busy doing her stuff, I'm a bit bored and was browsing for more lights (uh oh for the wallet), primarly 18650-lights and big-throwers, and started wondering something...

What are your thoughts and opinions on the brands mentioned and why did you choose one over the other? I'm interested to know what features/characteristics made one brand/model stand out over others. Price seems equivalent amongst most, but quite different relative to one particular brand.

Here are some of my thoughts: Lumapower lights seem to sell for considerably more than equivalent(competitve) china/HK-based brands such as Dereelight, Tiablo, and recently Edgetac/Raidfire. The LP M1-R is $85+sh and the SE Q5 is $105+sh, while Dereelight CL1H 3.0s with Q5s are $79-$82 shipped. They seem to have similar performance, but the price differential, especially between the Q5 versions is quite a bit. And Regalight WT1 seems to perform equally well to both M1 and CL1H at $85. I love the design of the M1 and think it's more aesthetically pleasing than the CL1H and WT1, but I like some of the features the CL1H has (like bezel down clip).
For the big throwers, the MRV Q5 is $165+sh while Tiablo A8/A9s are $128+sh, Dereelight DBSs are $115-$125 shipped, and the latest Raidfire Spear is $130. The DBS and Spear seem to outperform the MRV and A8/A9 in throw. The Tiablo, DBS, and Spear are all considerably lower priced than the MRV. While the DBS seems to be throw king, I know some people don't like the larger size. Aesthetically and sizewise, I prefer the Raidfire of the 4 brands/models mentioned.
What are your reasons for purchasing a certain light vs. another for these 18650-based and big-throw lights? Aside from price, what other factors, features, or characteristics swayed you? I'm particularly interested in Lumapower owners and what features swayed them toward a pricier product vs. other products available. I think LP makes some of the most aesthetically appealing lights, but price is always a big factor for me, so when a lower cost, equal or better performing option is available, I usually sway toward that as aesthetics usually take a backseat to other features and performance. I hope no one takes this as a bashing on one brand. I'm just curious and have time to kill. What influenced your buying decision for these brands/models? Size? Aesthetics? Pure performance? Max throw regardless of size or aesthetics?

 

[Gunner12]

Don't forget the Dereelight has replace/upgrade easy to install modules unlike the others.

I have bought neither so can't really comment on actual performance or comparable size.

 

[WadeF]

I went with the DBS because of the upgrade options and I Iiked the apperance of it.

I went with the Raidfire because the intro price was hard to pass up on.

Out of those two I prefer the DBS.

 

[daveman]

...While the DBS seems to be throw king, I know some people don't like the larger size...

That's incorrect, Raidfire is the current throw champ. Even if we were to factor in variances from unit to unit, and consider the Raidfire to "merely" equal with DBS in throw, the Raidfire is still a size smaller, which makes easier to pocket.

The DBS is more versatile in that it can use both cr123 and 18650s (confirm?) while the Raidfire can only run on 18650s; so if your Raidfire needs more juice in the field, you can't put in cr123s as backup.

The DBS is also WAYYYY easier to upgrade for future emitters, although the availabilty of new emitters will most likely mean that ALL available new emitters will go into production lights where they can be sold for more money altogether, and will only be sold in individual pills AFTER they're no longer cutting edge, ie. outdated. That's just the nature of business.

 

[jsr]

Great info guys! Keep it coming.

I'd like to hear from the Lumapower owners as LP seems to be the biggest of all the brands mentioned with a big following even tho by numbers, specs, or price, they seem out gunned by the other participants.

P.S. I would love to try out a DBS sometime, but all the big throwers are out of my price range. The Raidfire was in it only due to the intro offer. I would love to own all the ones mentioned for a comparo and some CPFers have that ability, which is sweet.

 

[woodrow]

I just received my MRV SE...but only was able to use it a few minutes...got a tailcap with basicly no threads... but its brightness and beam was basicly that of a Tiablo Q5 light. The main reason I picked the MRV is that the M65 18650 tube coming out soon. With it, you should have hours of non dimming light.

I still think brightness of all these lights is pretty close to each other. Buy the one you like the features of the best.

 

[5.0Trunk]

That's incorrect, Raidfire is the current throw champ.

Where is the comparision? I haven't seen any real outdoor beamshots.

WadeF: Have you done any real comparision of the DBS and Rapidfire since you have both?

Thanks

 

[djblank87]

Where is the comparision? I haven't seen any real outdoor beamshots.

WadeF: Have you done any real comparision of the DBS and Rapidfire since you have both?

Thanks

Agreed, after reading all the reviews between most of the lights and also owning a few of them I can say from information listed on CPF that the Raidfire is not putting out the same LUX readings as the DBS.

The DBS is still currently the throw champ unless were compaing it to an Aspheric Mag Q5, custom job. Also, I believe the DBS has a deeper reflector which in turn allows more throw to come from the light.

WadeF is going to have to chime back in on this seeing that he has almost all the lights listed.


I will look for a link and edit this post when I find the LUX readings.

See post one and scroll down and see the LUX readings, ernsanada has everything placed otu very well and it shows the results of his findings.
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=183587

 

[Saiga]

I have much the same philosophy as you,JSR :everything else being (more or less) equal go with the best deal". Which is why when i was after somekind of thrower,i initially leaned toward the lumapower,then the tiablo,THEN the dereelight, but finally settled on the fenix T1. I know it's not the thrower the DBS is ( or probably the others,too) but it throws further than i can usually find a place to max it out, and it was $67 shipped. Add to that fenix's and fenix-stores great reputation, and my positive experience with my other two fenix lights, and the T1 was a no brainer for me.

 

[ernsanada]

These are the lux readings I got. I am using a Meterman LM631 Light Meter measured at 1 meter. I waited 2 minutes before taking the readings. I am using AW's Protected 18650 and AW's Protected RCR123's which were fully charged.

Raidfire Spear TM Q5 - 20,100 lux @ 1 meter

Dereelight DBS XRE-E Q4 with 3 Way Module SMO - 18,500 lux @ 1 meter

Dereelight DBS XRE-E Q5 with 3 Way Module SMO - 20,767 lux @ 1 meter

Lumapower MRV 1st gen. SMO - 8110 lux @ 1 meter

Regal WT1 Q5, 18650, SMO - 10180 lux @ 1 meter

Regal WT1 Q5 SMO, 2 RCR - 11350 @ 1 meter

Fenix T1 Q5 OP 2 RCR123's - 5950 lux @ 1 meter


----------------------------------------------------------------

I have some beam shots taken at 32'



Raidfire Spear TM Q5 SMO @ 32'

Dereelight DBS XRE-E Q5 with 3 Way Module SMO @ 32'

Lumapower MRV 1st gen. SMO @ 32'

Regal Light WT1 Q5 SMO @ 32'

Fenix T1 Q5 OP @ 32'

 

[RichS]

JSR,

Like you, I was also deciding between the Lumapower and Dereelight for each of their pocketable lights and throwers. In the end, I decided on the Deree for both the CL1H and DBS due to a couple of factors:

1. Easy upgradeability, and a strong committment from the manufacturer to keep this up - this was huge to me. As we comparing lux/lumens to find the biggest output in a particular class of light (pocketable, thrower, etc.), the differences are many times no more than 5-10%, or even less. When we look at the later Cree bins and technology less than a year away, we will see much bigger margins of increased output and I don't want to have to re-buy the same light just to get the latest technology. I also don't want to have to attempt to upgrade myself and potentially damage a light I spent a lot of money for.

2. Excellent build quality - strong, durable as many who have bought their lights have attested to.

3. Best value for what you are getting.

4. Looks - I liked the looks of both Dereelights as much as the Lumapower, but I liked the looks of the DBS much better than the MRV. I just can't get past that strange looking (usually shiny) light engine on the MRV...

Having used both Dereelights - they are both incredible lights. They both feel great in the hand - especially the DBS.

I also got a Tiablo A8S for Christmas, and it is just fantastic. The best finish/anodizing on any light I own (awesome matt finish, but perfectly smooth without being slippery or slick...nice!). The feel of the light (it's lighter due to the 7075 aluminum), the protruding clicky/tension, looks, is great. A home run in my opinion. I compared it with the DBS (3SD 1.2a) outdoors, and to my eye (without a light meter) they perform equally. I hate to say it because I love my DBS, but this might be my new favorite. But I would still never part with my DBS, and I'm sure it will once again be my new favorite when they release the R4 bin Cree in a nice little pill sometime next year... Hopefully Tiablo will stay true to what they have stated about releasing upgraded light engines for existing owners...we will see..

Finally - you can not overlook the current best overall deal right now (in my humble opinion) - the Regalight WT1 second edition. It is only $65 right now through CPFMarketplace (http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=172345). All the reviews on it so far sing this lights praises. I was very impressed by Stefan's review and torture test (http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=179105) It is built like a tank, best throw in a light its size (practically pocketable), uses higher grade 7075 aluminum, great design/great color choices, excellent fit/finish/anodizing, shipped with new and better holster, shipped with OP reflector for free (SMO installed), extra switch, etc... Needless to say I have one on the way.

Just my thoughts..

 

[WadeF]

The Raidfire is close to the DBS on the LUX meter at 1 meter, but I still get higher readings from my DBS. Also my DBS has a tighter hot spot, and at 30 feet the difference between the DBS and Raidfire's hot spot is huge, the DBS is still much smaller. Now for some, the larger hot spot of the Raidfire maybe preferred, but if you want throw you want to keep that beam as tight as you can. I still need to get out to the lake where I can see how they perform at the 800+ feet range.

So when the Raidfire was released it was close to the DBS, but Dereelight will have new pills and emitters in the near future and it will continue to pull away from the Raidfire, until th Raidfire is updated, but that means buying a whole new Raidfire for $130 or whatever they will sell them for. Unless the Raidfire can be easily modded.

I'll try to get some more info and beam shots up now that the holiday madness is calming down.

 

[SilverFox]

Hello Ernsanada,

I was wondering if you might be able to repeat your lux measurements at 3 meters (or 5 meters if you have the room). Some of your readings may be a bit off because the beam of some of the lights may not be fully developed at 1 meter. Moving back a little usually takes care of this.

The readings can then be "normalized" to 1 meter for comparison with other lights.

Tom

 

[WadeF]

Hello Ernsanada,

I was wondering if you might be able to repeat your lux measurements at 3 meters (or 5 meters if you have the room). Some of your readings may be a bit off because the beam of some of the lights may not be fully developed at 1 meter. Moving back a little usually takes care of this.

The readings can then be "normalized" to 1 meter for comparison with other lights.

Tom

I'm finding this to be a problem as well, measuring at 1 meter. The hot spots are so small, from light to light, they may all fit within the light sensor. However, at 3 meters, and farther, the hot spots will vary more from light to light, and there will be more of a difference with the LUX reading

For example the Raidfire and DBS were around 25,000 for the Raidfire and 25,500 for the DBS. Hardly a difference, but at 30 feet, it was like 200LUX for the Raidfire and 250LUX or so for the DBS. I have to retest, it may have been more of a 70LUX difference, and the % difference between the two was larger at 30 feet than at 1 meter, in favor of the DBS because the DBS's hot spot was much smaller at 30 feet than the Raidfire's.

 

[Rzr800]

"..So when the Raidfire was released it was close to the DBS, but Dereelight will have new pills and emitters in the near future and it will continue to pull away from the Raidfire, until the Raidfire is updated, but that means buying a whole new Raidfire for $130 or whatever they will sell them for. Unless the Raidfire can be easily modded. ..."

I'm guessing that Alan has been waiting for someone up here to simply come out and say this with no word from Edgetac as to the latter. I really like my Spear; yet Deerelight seems to be proving that this dollars and 'sense' business model works (at least) up here on CPF. In my opinion, there is really no other choice in this market segment; as the 'throwaways' are starting to become pretty darn attractive (output and price-wise) as compared with even the pills themselves.

 

[SilverFox]

Hello Wade,

I use the Peak Hold function to deal with those issues...

Let's see, 30 feet is around 9.144 meters. 200 lux at 9.144 meters works out to 16722 lux at 1 meter. 250 lux at 9.144 meters works out to 20903 lux at 1 meter. If those numbers are good, one light is a bit brighter than the other.

Tom

 

[idiotekniQues]

on that regalight, the only way to have momentary on is with the forward tactical switch, which means you dont have the ability to use the lower setting, is that correct?

 

[phantom23]

Yes.

 

[moses]

OK for me, two units for two purposes.

Spear - for max throw given it's size/diameter, and cost. Love the design too. That it could have been had for a very good price is a plus.

Regalight. Hands down brightest light for it's diameter and ease of carry. A huge advantage is it's 3.7-10V rating compared to some others that can't use 18650 cells. Also, it's regulation is top notch as tested by an online website that tests lights extensively. Currently as STEAL at the price! You get TWO reflectors, TWO switches? Just seem hard to beat. Definitely underpriced in my opinion. (OK, I'm repeating myself here....

Moses

Moses

 

[jsr]

Keep it coming guys! I still haven't heard much from Lumapower owners. It seems everyone's favoring Dereelight's strategy of easy and low-cost upgradeability (which I love also), but it still seems there's more LPs out there and sold (shoot, they even have their won forum whereas the other CH/HK Mfrs don't), so that indicates their size/popularity relative to the others. Tiablo seems the closest in design, size, output, and throw to the MRV, but someone mentioned above it uses 7075 aluminum which is a plus, and the Dereelight and Raidfire both throw more than either, so those have pluses, yet the LP MRV still costs more than any of these. I'd like to hear the reasons owners chose the MRV over these other options.
The LP M1-R is closer in price to the Dereelight and Regalight offerings (without Regalight's current discount), but the M1 Q5 is much pricier than Dereelight CL1H Q5 and Regalight WT1 v2 Q5, so again, what are the characteristics/factors that made one purchase the M1 Q5 over the others which perform the same at a lower cost (build quality seems close enough between all these brands that any differences are likely negligible or due to variances from batch to batch).

Off topic: Hmm...I may have to pick up a Regalight WT1 v2 Q5...the $65 seems darn good...uh, my wallet is yelling at me already (or is that my wife?).

The main turnoff for me with the Fenix T1 is the lack of support for Li-Ions. As a military officer, I would use primary 123As solely, so great. But as law enforcement, I would use the largest capacity Li-Ion possible to get the most runtime so I can use it as much as I can during my patrol w/o running out of juice. Consumers less familiar with other Li-Ion sizes may pick up R123As to use, which is fine, but at the cost of much much reduced runtime. So a driver design that supports 3.7V to 8.4V would seem nomimal, yet the T1 supports 4V to 10V. Anything above 8.4V makes no sense, and the range should've been brought down to support large single Li-Ions. It just seems like while the rest of the light being so beefy was focused on, someone lost sight of or didn't plan out the strategy well enough for the electronics. Same with whoever decided the ID bore of the tube.